Bkue-Ray versus HD-DVD

[kde]

In general terms, what is the major difference between the Oppo Upconverting DVD player versus the Sony BlueRay technology? I watch many DVDs on a 50" Pioneer Plasma with a Klipsch 7.2 system and use a basic Sony DVD player that was given to me. What should my next player be?

Also, why does Oppo not recommend the middle player (DY-970HD) for screens above 45"? They state the DV-981HD and OPDV971H for 45" and above.

[ARPRINCE]

As of now Denon has not made a decision, so which ever format DENON decides to go with will be the winner...HDDVD or BLUE RAY?

Have they made that decision yet? Probably be a universal player.

http://usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/DVDPlayersAndChangers.asp

Here's a link to some note worthy speculation.

Denon Blu-ray Player on the Way?

Posted June 29, 2007 by Josh

In a recent interview with ListenUp.com, Jeff Talmadge from Denon

stated that they would announce plans for a high definition player as

early as July, but no format was given. When you couple this

information with the fact that Funai (who recently announced a Blu-ray

player for this fall) makes DVD players for Denon, and that D&M

Holdings, the parent company of Denon, is now an adopter of BD+, it

appears that the Denon player will most certainly be Blu-ray.

This information, of course, is all speculative right now, but we hope

to hear more from Denon in the upcoming months about their future high

definition plans.

NOT SPECULATING ANYMORE.

DENON TO INTRODUCE GROUNDBREAKING

BD-ROM PROFILE 1 version 1.1

BLU-RAY DISC PLAYER AND TRANSPORT

New Products Represent the Pinnacle of High-Definition DVD Video

and Audio Performance; Offer Exciting Interactive Capabilities -

Mahwah, NJ - July 24, 2007 -- Denon Electronics, a world leader in

high-performance home entertainment products, today announced the

upcoming introduction of two groundbreaking DVD products, the new

reference-standard DVD-3800BDCI BD-ROM Profile 1 version 1.1

Blu-ray Disc Player and the DVD-2500BTC BD-ROM Profile 1 version 1.1

Blu-ray Disc Transport. The DVD-3800BDCI (SRP: $1,999) is the world's

first BD-ROM Profile 1 version 1.1 Blu-ray Disc Player from a Blu-Ray

Disc Association member featuring the acclaimed 10-bit Silicon Optix

Realta chipset. It provides users with the highest resolution

high-definition video available today via HDMI connection, as well as

the ultimate in audio performance, including high-definition audio

decoding and DDSC-HD audio output. The DVD-2500BTCI outputs audio and

video signals and requires a connected audio/video receiver to do the

decoding. Both BD-ROM Profile 1 version 1.1 Blu-ray units are slated to

ship this fall.

In addition to its Blu-ray Disc introductions, Denon is updating its

advanced lineup of DVD players and changers with six additional models,

including the DVD-1940CI (SRP: $349) and DVD-1740 (SRP: $169), as well

as the new DVM-1845 (SRP: $269) 5-disc DVD changer. With the new

additions, Denon's current line of DVD players now feature advanced

HDMI output capability for the ultimate in audio and video performance.

Three new models in the company's Retail Home Theater DVD lineup have

also been added, including the DVD-758 (SRP: $349) and DVD-558 (SRP:

$169) DVD players, as well as the new DVM-745 (SRP: $269) 5-disc

changer.

Joe Stinziano, Denon's Senior Vice President for Sales and

Marketing, noted: "Denon is committed to providing our discriminating

customers with a no-compromise high-end solution for enjoying

next-generation high resolution media. Our new products exemplify the

highest level of home theater quality. As a member of the Blu-ray Disc

Association, we brought all of our design and engineering expertise to

bear in the creation of these groundbreaking Blu-ray products, setting

new performance standards for the format. Denon remains committed to

offering our customers the most options in ultimate-quality home

entertainment products and to this end, our future plans do not

preclude the introduction of high-definition products in other formats."

Reference-Standard DVD-3800BDCI: "Boundless" Home Entertainment

Denon's new DVD-3800BDCI BD-ROM Profile 1 version 1.1 Blu-ray Disc

Player sets new standards in high-performance, interactive DVD

playback. In addition to delivering the pinnacle of high-quality audio

and video performance, both the DVD-3800BDCI and DVD-2500BTCI feature

SD card readers that offer users a new level of full interactivity with

multiple opportunities for content providers to add enhanced content

such as movie trailers, games and more.

The Ultimate in Video Performance...

In addition to being in the forefront of BD-ROM Profile 1 version 1.1

Blu-ray Disc Player technology, Denon's DVD-3800BDCI is also the

world's first to feature the acclaimed 10-bit Silicon Optix Realta

chipset, providing enhanced video performance with upconversion and IP

scaling to 1080p. The pixel-by-pixel and Digital Noise Reduction

feature afforded by this technology allows the player to remove

image-degrading artifacts, resulting in astoundingly clear,

high-resolution image quality.

The Ultimate in Audio Performance...

Denon's new DVD-3800BDCI also utilizes a variety of the world's most

advanced audio technologies, including Advanced AL24 processing, to

deliver the ultimate in audio performance. The player offers HD Audio

and DDSC-HD, with decoding of Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD and

DTS-HD Master Audio and is capable of outputting both 7.1-channel

analog signals and PCM audio via HDMI output.

DVD-2500BTCI Blu-ray Transport: High-Performance Connection to A/V Receivers

The DVD-2500BTCI is a leading edge Blu-ray Disc Transport that allows

owners of advanced A/V receivers to add Blu-ray capability to their

system and enjoy high definition video. The DVD-2500BTCI will natively

output an HD audio bit-stream to a connected receiver via HDMI. Once

this signal is accepted in the receiver, it can then be decoded into

its native format including Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD

Master Audio.

Secondary Video and Audio Decoders

In keeping with the guidelines mandated by the Blu-ray Association for

BD-ROM Profile 1 version 1.1 players, both Denon Models DVD-3800BDCI

and DVD-2500BTCI incorporate a secondary audio and video decoder. This

allows for simultaneous playback of a secondary audio and video track

which may be used for interactive audio and commentary and for

picture-in-picture capability (respectively). Additional information

(subtitles, audio streams, camera angles, trailers, games, etc.) can be

downloaded from the Internet via computer and stored on a SD card that

either player will accept. This content can be played with the original

content of Blu-ray Discs.

Denon's DVD Lineup offers More Models with HDMI Output

In addition to the new Blu-ray Disc products, Denon has significantly

upgraded its DVD player line. Denon's new DVD-1940CI and DVD-1740 DVD

players, for example, output video at stunning 1080p resolution via

HDMI, making them ideal for use with the advanced digital display

devices of today (and tomorrow). The superior image quality of the

DVD-1940CI is achieved through the use of the advanced Faroudja FLi2301

DCDi chipset, providing an improved Film Mode, 3:2 pulldown detection

and de-interlacing, as well as five Progressive Mode memory settings

that enable viewers to fine-tune picture quality to their particular

preference. The result is remarkably clear, high-resolution image

quality, free from picture artifacts. Additional audio/video

enhancements in the DVD-1940CI include HDMI 1.1 output compatibility,

SACD / DVD-Audio playback, discrete interlaced and progressive video

D/A converters. For enhanced audio playback, both the DVD-1940CI and

DVD-1740 use discrete high performance Burr

Brown Audio DACs - models PCM-1738 and PCM-1756 respectively. The DVD-1940CI and

DVD-1740 will also interchangeably convert video standards; NTSC and

PAL and the DVD-1940CI will now support the popular DivX Ultra

standard.

The DVD-1740 and the DVD-1940CI are both currently available.

NEW 5-Disc DVD-Changer Added to Lineup

To provide additional flexibility, Denon is also introducing a new

5-disc DVD changer, with HDMI 1.0 and selectable scaling output to

1080p. Model, DVM-1845 is a progressive scan changer with DVD-Video,

DVD-R/RW, DVD+R/RW, CD and CD-R/RW playback compatibility, Kodak

Picture, FujiColor, and JPEG Photo File Viewer for total convenience

and utility. For enhanced image quality, the DVM-1845 also includes an

advanced 12-Bit Video DAC (108MHz, 480i/480p) and 3:2 Pull-Down

detection. The DVM-1845 is currently available.

In addition to the new models announced today, Denon's DVD line

includes: the flagship DVD-5910CI (SRP: $3,800), DVD-3930CI (SRP:

$1,499) and DVD-2930CI (SRP: $849).

New Retail Home Theater Series Models: High-Value, High-Performance

Denon's new Retail Home Theater Series line of advanced DVD players,

includes the DVD-758, DVD-558 and DVM-745 5-disc changer, and offers

many of the same high-quality features found in Denon's companion

models. Features include HDMI output with upscaling to 1080p, Burr

Brown 24/192 Audio DACs, playback of CDs and DVDs with MP3 and WMA 9

audio files as well as CD-R/CD-RW, DVD-R/RW and DVD+R/RW. Additionally,

the DVD-758 will play discs encoded with DivX Ultra. All three models

are currently available.

[DTLongo]

Further to my July 18 post, here are first impressions of my Oppo DV-981 HD upconverting DVD player that I have had up and running for a week now, hooked up via HDMI to my 50" Pioneer plasma HDTV. Picture improvement over my previous Sanyo DVD player is MARGINAL. There is a slight improvement in general but nothing dramatic or stunning. Slightly better clarity and slightly better color but nothing that would blow one away.

I strongly suspect this is because of Hollywood's tendency to soften the sharpness of movies as compared to the crystal sharpness that one can see, say, on Discovery HDTV and some ESPN HDTV. Why Hollywood does that, I don't know. Sometimes "making-of" featurettes on DVD's are sharper than the movie itself, which reinforces my sense that Hollywood "fuzzes-up" the final movie, for whatever reason. I saw the latest Bruce Willis flick "Live Free or Die Hard in in a local "digital" theater a few days ago. The image there too was less than crystal clear, it was soft.

Given this phenomenon, I am skeptical that Hollywood movies so degraded would look dramatically better on HD-DVD or Blu-Ray than they already do on the Oppo or even my previous player. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray may simply not be worth their cost not only because of the format war, but because the source material, the movie, is purposely softened such that the expected high-def improvement is negated.

On the other hand, the AUDIO improvement through the Oppo is very noticeable, even dramatic, especially in the back channels. Definitely a plus.

[gibbie]

Target just announced that they will only sell Blu-Ray players....("at least through the holiday season").

http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSN2643741920070726

[kde]

I believe that I have made my decision to go with the Samsung BlueRay player that goes for ~$599 as it is suppossed to have a better upconverting chip for normal dvds. However, Panasonic is highlighting a 7.1 channel audio program on their ~$599 model.

Shouldn't all BlueRay players basically have the same 7.1 functionality? Why does the Panasonic point out 7.1 where the others don't? One even points out 5.1???

[MatrixDweller]

I am only 22 so dont completely remember beta-vhs I do remember when the laser disk came out.

Laser disk came out in the early 80's after MCA's similar DiscoVision which was around in the 70's. It was sort of a third competitor in the VHS vs Beta battle but was not a very strong as you could not record to it. Laserdisc survived because of its popularity in Japan.

You could liken HD-DVD and BLue ray in a way to Laserdisc. The HD formats might fail, or take a long time to catch on, because not enough people have HD TV sets (ie: the improved quality means nothing).

[Professor.Ham.Slap]

Given this phenomenon, I am skeptical that Hollywood movies so degraded would look dramatically better on HD-DVD or Blu-Ray than they already do on the Oppo or even my previous player. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray may simply not be worth their cost not only because of the format war, but because the source material, the movie, is purposely softened such that the expected high-def improvement is negated.

Here are some side by side photos (taken from AVS) from the movie Hot Fuzz (great movie, btw). There are some rather huge differences in picture quality between the two formats.

DVD

HD DVD

Edit: I can't tag these in the forum because the software doesn't allow high-res shots. But yea, there is a huge difference to be had between HD and DVD.

Edit 2: Alright, I can't get the HD screen to show up reliably. Here's a link to the original thread. (pops)

[dougdrake]

For the money, I think the PlayStation3 is the best Blu-Ray player out there. Recently reduced to $499, it packs some amazing power under the hood. True, it does not have multi-channel analog output, so you're left with regular DD/DTS 5.1 via Toslink unless you have an HDMI 1.3 receiver capable of decoding the audio via HDMI.

I brought one home last weekend from Best Buy to try out and am so far pretty impressed. Only watched 1 BD on it - The Departed - but found the picture to be excellent. I also watched one standard-def disk (V for Vendetta) on it and it did a great job. Granted, that's a pretty small sample, though.

Add to it the gaming function (which my grandson will love) and I think it's a keeper.

[MatrixDweller]

For the money the $299 HDA2 is the best HD player all around. I would buy the cheapest player for now and wait for the third generation to come around.

Compare it to the cheapest Sony Bluray player at $499.

Feature<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Toshiba HDA2

Sony BDP-S300

Price

$299

$499

Audio Decoders

Dolby True HD, Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby Digital, DTS Master HD, DTS

Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby Digital

Max Output Resolution

1080i

1080p

[dougdrake]

Apples and oranges - they play different formats. I picked BD because it seems, to me, to have a better selection of current movie material on it...

[kde]

Any comments on this:

Shouldn't all BlueRay players basically have the same 7.1 functionality? Why does the Panasonic point out 7.1 where the others don't? One even points out 5.1???

[ARPRINCE]

Any comments on this:

Shouldn't all BlueRay players basically have the same 7.1 functionality? Why does the Panasonic point out 7.1 where the others don't? One even points out 5.1???

I see that the unit actually has 7 ANALOG audio out compared to a usual 5. It depends on the source though. If the audio source is 7.1 then you get that full range if you have the same complimentary setup.

[kde]

thanks