DrWho Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 Tell JL Audio that.See if they respond.What the heck would that accomplish?The Gotham starts off with an enclosure that sacrifices effective use of floor space for a pretty enclosure, is using a less efficient sealed cabinet enclosure that is undersized for one driver, let alone two drivers....which requires an absurd amount of amplifier power to even get into normal SPL levels. The power compression of the system happens retarded early (especially at the lower frequencies where cone excursion must be huge) and the distortion skyrockets above 110dB (gotta love Bl and CMS nonlinearities). Heck, it even has a sliding high pass filter to help reduce cone excursion down low (meaning not very loud subsonic information). About the only thing it does is play loud and look pretty while costing way too much. But then, that's all someone more interested in touting an image is concerned with anyway so they really got their demographic nailed down well. I have no doubt that something like the following is going to sound much better than any of the subs mentioned so far:http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/t/100846.aspx (Much better engineering has gone into this design) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyleLeeKeating Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 Paul, do you work for JL? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 About the only thing it does is play loud and look pretty while costing way too much. But then, that's all someone more interested in touting an image is concerned with anyway so they really got their demographic nailed down well. Baadaabing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 TheBEAST eats The Gotham for lunch. Performance wise (output,extension and sound quality when both subs crank around 115dB and up)the larger and ported (PR's) Beast will have a good deal lower distortion AND not suffer from any audible compressionup to where your ears will crap out. That is IMPRESSIVE My upcoming Acoupower monsters will also be similar in performance. 125dB pah no biggie even @ 16Hz ...at half power. Gotham is superlative as a compact sealed sub,there you can hardly do better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakedmb Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Tell JL Audio that.See if they respond. What the heck would that accomplish? The Gotham starts off with an enclosure that sacrifices effective use of floor space for a pretty enclosure, is using a less efficient sealed cabinet enclosure that is undersized for one driver, let alone two drivers....which requires an absurd amount of amplifier power to even get into normal SPL levels. The power compression of the system happens retarded early (especially at the lower frequencies where cone excursion must be huge) and the distortion skyrockets above 110dB (gotta love Bl and CMS nonlinearities). Heck, it even has a sliding high pass filter to help reduce cone excursion down low (meaning not very loud subsonic information). About the only thing it does is play loud and look pretty while costing way too much. But then, that's all someone more interested in touting an image is concerned with anyway so they really got their demographic nailed down well. I have no doubt that something like the following is going to sound much better than any of the subs mentioned so far: http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/t/100846.aspx Very well said! Gotham owners don't want to hear all of that though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted March 1, 2008 Share Posted March 1, 2008 Gotham and The BEAST are not in the same class. The Gotham is a compact sealed using two 13.5" drivers,The BEAST is a not so compact dual 18" and ported via FOUR 18" PR's ! Simple displacement check reveals the obvious...TheBEAST outdisplaces the Gotham several times over. So at any human volume level TheBEAST will beloafing where the Gotham has to work much harder. Problem is TheBEAST is a one off sub build with drivers you cannot buy...company gone. Gotham is a product you can purchase and still beats its intended commercial competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcharles Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 The size of the enclosures are as follows- External dimensions Height 65" Width 30" Depth 24" Internal volume net 18.04 cu ft. The volume has been changing due to addition or removal of certain interior brace material. It is still in flux as of this post, but only varying from system design +/- .3 cf. Cabinet tuning with 2000 grams of additional weight added to each passive radiator - 14.4 Hz. Baffle thickness for woofer and passive mount will be approximately 2.25". All other panels will be 1.5" thick. Baffles and other panels will be composed of both mdf and baltic birch ply laminated together. The result seams to be both very strong and very "dead". Total cabinet weight will be in excess of 600 pounds without the addition of top and bottom granite accents. Rear casters will allow for easy transport. Cabinet design courtesy of NeoDan the sub design man. He modified some of my ideas and the result is all forces opposed resulting in decreased cabinet movement and shift. One of the laws of Physics. Dan has been instrumental in the birth of these subwoofers. I really appreciate his help. Power is now going to come from 2 Crown I-tech 8000 amplifiers bridged to 8 ohms. One amp per cabinet with each amp on its own breaker. WinISD .060 was used to model LMS 5400's. Special thanks to Ilkka for his input regarding the tuning and sizing, as well as Kyle Keating from TC sounds. These cabinets are well within the parameters set by TC sounds as optimal for this woofer/passive setup. I would also I hope this clears up some of the questions and any input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcharles Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 DrWho, Does not seem as engineered in what ways? What would you do differently? Thanks, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted March 5, 2008 Author Share Posted March 5, 2008 welcome to the forums robert charles and thank you for clearing up the specs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcharles Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 I was hoping for at least some inspiration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted March 7, 2008 Author Share Posted March 7, 2008 I was hoping for at least some inspiration. Eh, its a tough crowd in this forum. Don't mind them..... I only own one lms 5400 and its still unmounted. You have inspired me to making a completed version. Too bad I am in college, well spring break is around the corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcharles Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 I'm giving these cabinets a good shot. The final brace scheme has been incorporated and forward we go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 Inspiration. Four LMS-5400 18's should all the inspiration needed. With these two subs you will have subs capable of overpowering any known loudspeakers sold for home use. Only large JBL's,Danley and the massive Klipsch Horns would do these justice. What mains do you have ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcharles Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 As a matter of fact, I do have a pair of Khorns. I also have 2 forte's, and four kg1.5's, and 2 cv3 centers and 4 reference surrounds . But, that is with my older pro logic system. and I also use the K horns for 2 channel listening for classical-Beethoven mostly. I really don't like symphonies and sonatas in surround. With that said, my dolby digital system consists of Electrovoice and JBL professional speakers. I always like the way horn loaded systems project into the room. All of the powerful outdoor systems I have experienced at Disney and the other parks mostly consist of horn loaded cabinets. That is why I chose the speakers I chose. As far as the subs, I went from just using 4 older 15's that need resurrounds to new 15's to acoupower, then TC all different models, and finally, I said I am going to do this once and get the most I can get with the least real estate usage- LMS was the choice. Now to get them finished. I no longer can just brute them around by myself. I need help moving the cabinets, so I don't destroy the finish on the final layer. So, it is slower going right now. I will update as progress goes forward. Thanks, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Problem is TheBEAST is a one off sub build with drivers you cannot buy...company gone TheBEAST is one off yes, but as far as I can tell, TC Sounds is not gone, they're just under a different name now...Audio Pulse, as I'm sure you knew. The LMS-5400 is still available, just this time its BLUE. Heck someone even has one on ebay already.... http://cgi.ebay.com/Audiopulse-Tc-Sounds-lms-ultra-5400-18-subwoofer-re_W0QQitemZ110229571899QQihZ001QQcategoryZ18805QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Robert, Good choices,the larger horn loaded (mid and HF section at least) speakers do not break a sweat even at hellacious SPL. I like this ,clean clean and more clean. As for my Dyanudio I use them nearfield almost, 1.5M from speakers to listening position. Dynamics ,transparencyand efortless reproduction is what any audiophile should be after. I will build two Acoupower subs,one using dual 18's and the second dual 15's,both ported EBS. The larger driven by Crown iTech 8000 and the smaller by the iTech 4000. When you have 130dB @ tuning... the goals of efortless reproducion are met. As few speakers folow there and who wants to listen at a level this high ? As you know Kevin H. from Exodus Audio is preparing some very special drivers that will best anything made todate,with a linear Xmax that is insane,5" VC ...NEO motor and the driver may weigh around 100lbs apiece ! Now if his project comes to fruition...I am signing for FOUR drivers instantly. It is a great time to build the ultimate subwoofers,no brand name even dares to offer. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 darkside, TC Sounds (AudioPulse) cannot even be reached,thsi is not serious in the least. A company that wants $1500 for a driver and I cannot even speak with anyone there !!! I will not spend a dime. Acoupower, Mach5Audio, SoundSplinter, CSS I called them all and spoke with the people who sell them...and sometimes the owners. So you know...you want my bmoney show me some you care about customers. And I have purchased from all the above numerous times. Exodus Audio...Kevin H. you bet I will get his creations, they go for $1000...$1500 each...bring them on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 AHHH, you make a really good point. I, for one, have been waiting for forever for them to get their site up completely, especially the dealer list, but no dice. It's been this way for probably about 4 months now...I see what you mean.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted March 8, 2008 Author Share Posted March 8, 2008 Problem is TheBEAST is a one off sub build with drivers you cannot buy...company gone TheBEAST is one off yes, but as far as I can tell, TC Sounds is not gone, they're just under a different name now...Audio Pulse, as I'm sure you knew. The LMS-5400 is still available, just this time its BLUE. Heck someone even has one on ebay already.... http://cgi.ebay.com/Audiopulse-Tc-Sounds-lms-ultra-5400-18-subwoofer-re_W0QQitemZ110229571899QQihZ001QQcategoryZ18805QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem they are basically defunct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Oh, shame... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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