Islander
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Posts posted by Islander
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6 hours ago, Full Range said:
Sugar man - I just got the news that he died at 81
RIP - Sixto
I just saw the documentary about him last year. Sugar Man was a big star, but never knew it, no thanks to the record company. He seemed like such a mellow guy, with no hard feelings toward anyone. At least he did get to do those big concerts in South Africa, so his children could see with their own eyes that their dad was a big star who could fill an arena with fans.
That one fan that sought him out, following up any clue he could find, did a wonderful thing.
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5 minutes ago, MeloManiac said:
RIP Robbie Robertson, age 80.
9 August 2023
Man, that's sad news! Robbie Robertson! It's to be expected that our musical heroes would be checking out now, since most of us are old, and those heroes are mostly older than us, but even so, it always comes as unpleasant news, especially if you heard him in a radio interview not long ago. Wait a minute, that interview was over five years ago. The months pass like weeks now, and a year passes like a season.
God rest him, his music moved us.
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13 minutes ago, the real Duke Spinner said:
I had a Cerwin Vega sub at one time But I found I preferred female subs. 😀😀😀
Wow! I didn't think that this would be the place that you tell us you're a Dom, lol!
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On 8/9/2023 at 1:20 PM, MMurg said:
Several instruments besides the obvious pipe organ or synthesizer can produce fundamentals in the region of deep bass around the first two octaves (center frequencies of 16 & 32 Hz): piano, bass (not bass guitar but string bass for orchestra/jazz), tuba, harp, contrabassoon, and others. There can also be very low bass in good recordings of all genres that pick up the room resonances, the faithful reproduction of which helps transport the listener to the venue. So, if you listen to some types of jazz, much classical music, solo piano, other music with similar instruments, or synthesizer music then you may want a sub (or true full-range speakers like the Heritage Jubilee) that can reproduce frequencies in the deep bass octaves.
Exactly! Very well said. And some snobby hi-fi magazine writers who initially rejected subwoofers as only needed for movie explosions and the like were surprised to find that they had beneficial effects all the way into the midrange, in similar fashion to how super tweeters can also produce beneficial effects all the way down to the upper midrange.
BTW, Duke, the lowest note on a 5-string bass guitar is 32 HZ, and some metal and hard rock bassists even have 6- or 7-string bass guitars. Then there's the Chapman Stick, which can go pretty low, too.
Finally, nothing performs well at the very edge of its abilities, so to listen to musical notes at, say 40 Hz, a speaker that's rated down to 40 Hz won't do the good job that you'll get from a speaker that goes down to 32 Hz, or even lower. Just like horn-loaded speakers sound so good because their drivers are barely moving, thus staying within their linear range, a speaker that's not near the edge of the envelope, so to speak, is more likely to be within its linear range, thus producing much less distortion.
One last thing: I really envy those Heritage Jubilees. A true full-range speaker! Wonderful!
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On 8/7/2023 at 5:23 AM, KT88 said:
Just a thought, if quite recently Roy/Klipsch launched a very thoughtful KJH that reaches 18 Hz, then I would test or make use of the same principles to achieve real and high quality bass down to 28 Hz (sufficient for most of music) with a smaller cabinet which fits a LaScala system.
That odd gap in the text below seems to be stuck there, so try to ignore it.
I had a sub that was rated down to 23 Hz, and enjoyed it for many years. In 2020, I replaced it with a sub from the same company (Paradigm) , and some of the specs were similar: sealed housing, front-firing direct-firing 10" cone driver, although the new sub's driver is nearly flat, not cone-shaped. The first sub had a 400 watt amplifier, while the new one has an 850 watt amp, both RMS, of course. The new one is rated down to 18 Hz, and the difference is day and night. Yes, the new one is from a higher line of the same company, so the parts are better and it has more advanced engineering, but the general "It's a front-firing 10" sub in a sealed box" similarities would suggest just an incremental difference, but not so.
The new subs (I added a second one a few months later, as I had planned) do more than produce another fraction of an octave of music. Now you can get some sense of the performance space, or just a more spacious sensation. Interestingly, although the subs help the speakers produce a more lifelike sound, sometimes it seems like more bass pressure than I need. It's a bit like having a live band playing on the other side of the wall when you'd like to get to sleep. It's easy to turn off the subs by a menu on the AVR/preamp, so I often do that when I'm listening late at night, like right now, at 4 am. That has given me a new respect for the La Scala bass.
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4 minutes ago, MicroMara said:
Audiophile Cats
That's not your record collection, is it?
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9 hours ago, Fido said:
I inherited a pair of Forte 1s from my father who passed in 2000. Replaced the crossovers with new Crites crossovers, added titanium tweeter diaphragms and then installed Dave As tweeters. They sounded very good and I loved them as my mains for many years. This last year I bought a new pair of Forte IVs and made my Forte1s my rear surrounds. I have placed the Forte IVs where my Forte 1s used to be and in my room with the rest of my system the IVs sound better in every way than my Forte 1s ever sounded. Sound stage, bass, midrange, mid bass — all better to my ears than the 1s. I don’t understand how people could prefer the Forte 1s over the 4s. Yes the 4s cost more. My dads 1s were $1000 back in 1986. I paid $3200 for the Forte IVs but I think they are worth every penny.
The engineers at Klipsch keep working on the speakers, so that each new generation sounds better. Sometimes there are small steps, sometimes big jumps. The 2007 La Scala IIs of mine are clearly better than the 1974 models (which are now my Surround speakers), and they should be. I don't doubt that the AL5s are better yet.
Of course, the JubScala conversion probably closes the gap a bit...
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1 hour ago, mikebse2a3 said:
I bet they will be awesome especially with Heritage… 👍🙂
Spotted this on a facebook post for those interested…
miketn
Is that a 1502 subwoofer, or an actual centre speaker?
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On 7/30/2023 at 12:13 PM, Islander said:
I agree that a horn-loaded sub is ideal for horn-loaded speakers, but I went with direct-firing subwoofers. Why? For two reasons: first, I didn't see any sensible-sized subs for sale at sensible prices. That's two reasons. The second one was the price. While there are lots of kits and plans available, I have neither the skill nor the space to build a sub, since I live in a condo apartment.
However, if you choose sensibly, I think you can find a sub that will pair up with La Scalas, the OG model or the La Scala II/AL4, play with minimum distortion, and easily cover the bottom two or three octaves that are out of reach of the "portable-sized" La Scala bass horns. I'll add more later.
Adding more later. This explanation is intended for people who don't know about Paradigm speakers or subwoofers, or Anthem DSP software, so it it seems too obvious or simple, it's not because you're too smart. Not everybody knows everything. The Paradigm subs can be ordered with the Perfect Bass Kit (it's included at no charge with their higher-end models), which includes a tripod and an individually calibrated microphone, plus the necessary two USB cables. You can set it up for individual listening, in which case you place the microphone in 5 different locations around your listening position, at least 2 ft/60 cm apart. If you're setting up your sub(s) for multiple listeners, you set the microphones at up to 10 locations (minimum 5 locations) around the room.
This lets the DSP program sense the attributes of the listening room, its size, shape, sound absorption, reflectivity, and so on, by using test tones that emanate from the sub and are picked up by the microphone, placed around the listening position at 5-10 spots. The microphone has a number on its label, which you punch in to the PBK program. The microphones are tested before they're sent out, and the curve of each one is kept on file. Then, when you punch in the number of the mic, its curve is loaded into the program, for maximum precision.
When you've placed the microphone in the suggested positions, on your display you see the uncorrected curve of the sub in its place in your room. Then, it shows the correction curve which will be applied. It's the reverse/inverse? of the original curve, and once it's applied, the sub's curve becomes more like a straight line. You can hear the difference immediately! Its been a couple of years since I did the routine, so I don't remember all the details, but I think you can store the curves, maybe for different configurations of the room?
Paradigm makes the kit, and it was developed in cooperation with the National Research Council (NRC) In Ottawa, but there's some connection with Anthem (ARC) and Martin Logan, who also sell the kit. On the Paradigm page, it's marked as discontinued, but I have no idea what's up with that. It seems to be available on the Martin Logan page.
The Paradigm page: https://www.paradigm.com/en/accessories/perfect-bass-kit
The Martin Logan page (the first picture seems to be the recommended positions where you should place the microphone for several listeners, not that you need to buy 5 of them): https://www.martinlogan.com/en/product/pbk-perfect-bass-kit
Crutchfield also has them in stock: https://www.crutchfield.com/S-htTXvPWAeTl/p_839PBK/MartinLogan-Perfect-Bass-Kit.html
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5 hours ago, Flevoman said:
Honestly, WAF can be the number one factor determining the size of your speakers, the maximum volume you can listen to your music, how far you can place the speakers from the wall in terms of speaker placement, and whether you can opt for that "actually expensive amplifier" or stick with the "affordable model," etc..etc...
That's why most of the McIntosh amplifiers look the same. You can sneak in the more expensive model without anyone noticing.
However, I would not want to live under such constraints.
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17 minutes ago, Chief bonehead said:
Patience….
Hmm...
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I agree that a horn-loaded sub is ideal for horn-loaded speakers, but I went with direct-firing subwoofers. Why? For two reasons: first, I didn't see any sensible-sized subs for sale at sensible prices. That's two reasons. The second one was the price. While there are lots of kits and plans available, I have neither the skill nor the space to build a sub, since I live in a condo apartment.
However, if you choose sensibly, I think you can find a sub that will pair up with La Scalas, the OG model or the La Scala II/AL4, play with minimum distortion, and easily cover the bottom two or three octaves that are out of reach of the "portable-sized" La Scala bass horns. I'll add more later.
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While we're discussing space stuff, have you heard about the "boomerang meteorite"? A small meteorite was found recently. No big deal, until it was studied and found to be made of Earth materials. And yet, it had clearly been exposed to galactic radiation for around 10,000 years. Odd, right?
The current thinking on this meteorite is that it was somehow blasted into space from Earth, either by a bigger meteorite impact, or by a volcanic event, which often throws material very high in the sky. It must take a really weird series of events to make that happen, but more than once we've seen meteorites that clearly came from Mars, so these things happen.
And for more detail: https://www.space.com/boomerang-meteorite-left-earth-and-returned
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The Forum is being tricky again. I don't usually leave a hole in the middle of a paragraph, but that's what the Forum wants to do today. Oh well. Hmm, that's a famous song.
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On 7/26/2023 at 10:31 AM, archdukeobvious said:
@jvs1670 I'm glad my center channel LaScala's neglected brother found a good home and is getting the attention it deserves! Great work on the restoration, it looks fantastic! Maybe one day I'll restore mine, but I'm fine with the scars from high schoolers for now.
I have khorns for rears and the sound is heavenly. I can't imagine needing to add a dedicated sub (nor is there anywhere to put it haha).
Nice setup! Bet it sounds great. But. Yes, a but. As your system gets better and better, the Buts get more and more expensive, but now and then, something simple can be overlooked, and not cost much to sort out. I'll just suggest something minor that might, or should, produce an immediate improvement in the bass response of your left-side Khorn. To the left side of that speaker is the railing of a staircase, instead of the wall beside the right speaker that serves as the last few feet of the bass horn. It would be easy and cheap (my favourite kind of audio tweak) to obtain a small sheet of maybe 1/4", or even 1/2", good-looking plywood that would fit into your decor, depending on the wood you choose, probably light-coloured walnut (if I'm correct and that's what your speaker is made of).
Just to try out the concept, you wouldn't need to carefully match the wood to anything, but if it does do the job it should, it will improve the bass response, plus you'll get nearly the same timbre from the left speaker as you get from the right. When the sound moves from one side to the other, the sound moves from one side to the other, the sound will be noticeably more consistent throughout the frequency range. Another instance is when the musician on one side is playing a duet with the player or singer on the other side. It should also improve your imaging, like in the duet situation I just mentioned. That would also give you a better sense of the performance space. Does it sound closed in, like a small club, or big and open, like an arena? To get it just right, you'd want the false wall, to give it its proper name, to be as tall as the speaker and around 48"/120 cm wide, measured from the room's wall to the other edge of the plywood. So that's the completed side/false wall, which you would need to secure to avoid vibration android getting any marks on your Khorn.
How's that for cheap and easy? Almost forgot something. Since the false wall would be on the speaker side of the railing, it will tend to keep the music in the music room. The Heritage Series speakers are quite directional. With my La Scala IIs, I can set them to play quite loudly in the living room, in front of the speakers, and yet when I'm in the kitchen, in sight of the living room, the volume sounds quite a bit lower, and I may be unable to make out the words of an unfamiliar song. Isn't it good to be able to listen to your music or TV show without bothering the rest of your family? The false wall would increase that effect.
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On 7/25/2023 at 8:33 AM, the real Duke Spinner said:
Nikko. ..
Had a Beta ...before my ex-wife made it dissapear. 🤬
Exes are exes for a reason, or several reasons in some cases. In those cases, just thinking about the time spent/wasted with them can cause gnashing of teeth, loudly spoken or forcefully muttered expletives, or even a manly tear or two (but not more than two, since then you're drifting into less manly categories). More than two manly tears are reserved for things like the last few minutes of Easy Rider or Vanishing Point, or the scene in Saving Private Ryan on D-Day where the soldiers are being slaughtered on the beach by heavy machine guns, and even diving into the water gives no shelter from the heavy-caliber bullets. Your personal tear triggers may vary, of course. Those are just a few scenes that are hard for me to watch. For you, it might be the sight of your favourite team being eliminated from the Championship in the last minute of the game. You get what I mean.
Duke, I hope you were able to replace your Beta with something even better.
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On 7/24/2023 at 1:15 PM, babadono said:
yes and i'm trying to post like 150K.....no worky
That's odd. Even 500k pix should post just fine, and give a sufficiently detailed look at whatever the item is.
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On 7/16/2023 at 10:09 AM, RickD said:
This may be a bit off topic but I'll see if I can get away with it. My system consists of modified Khorns with ALK extreme slope x-over networks, Volti's wooden mid-range horn with BMS drivers and DE-120 w/SMAHL lenses. I have a McIntosh MA-352 integrated amp and an RME DAC 2 FS. Streaming is done via mini PC. I am about to upgrade my DAC and I am wondering if I should upgrade my XLR cables? I am currently using a $17 set bought on amazon. Audioquest cables start at $300 and go up from there.
Is that money well spent?
Check out Mogami cables. They're made in Japan and are used in many studios. They're relatively inexpensive, but are very good quality. I got my Mogami XLR cables at a Guitar Center when I bought the Dx38 and I was pleased at how little they cost.
It's interesting to see how much cheaper stuff is at music shops, compared with the prices at hi-fi shops. It was an eye-opener for me.
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19 minutes ago, Jim Gregory said:
Sometimes you get a vision and just go for it.
Total price = 8 sea containers x $5,000? = $40,000 = a small mortgage = room for all your cousins to live next door. Handy when you need to borrow the price of a 2-4 of beer. Points for planning for the future.
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On 5/27/2023 at 5:40 PM, Smitty8451 said:
I have kind of an oddball setup as I use balanced matrix switches for all my sources so I can send my dac to all my systems being fed by the following;
-Oppo Hap HA-1 DAC with the following inputs
— Oppo BD-95
—Sonos Port
—TEAC PD-501 CD Player
—Sony HAPZ1-ES
System 1
-Yamaha CX-5200
- ATI AT-2007 (7 Channels 200W)
- ATI AT 2004 (4 channels 200W)
- Oppo BDP-205
System 2
- Rogue Audio Pharoah
System 3
- Luxman Cl-38uC
- Rogue ST-100 AMP
System 4
_ Rogue Audio RP-7 preamp
- Rogue Audio Atlas magnum II
System 5
Yamaha RX-A5000 preamp
Elekit TU-8800 amp
‘This is all feeding 2 LA Scala AL5 speakers, except when using system 1, then a center La Scala AL5 and ForteIV’s for surround duty kick in.
Nice. How much difference do you notice when you change to another power amp? Have you found a favourite yet? Isn't it amazing how your La Scala AL5s can sound so good with so many different power sources? They're not too fussy about how much power they get, as long as it's clean and quiet. I've driven my La Scala IIs/AL4s with a Yamaha RX-V750 AVR (2006-2007), then a Yamaha MX-D1 power amp with the RX-V750 preamp (2007-2008), then two MX-D1s (bi-amped, still with the RX-V750 preamp (2008-2016), then two MX-D1s with a Yamaha RX-A2060 AVR preamp (2016-present).The Rx-V750 had 100 Wpc, the MX-D1 has 500 Wpc, and of course the pair of amps make 1000 Wpc available to the speakers. Obviously, with the very high sensitivity of the AL4s, most of the time the amps' output is just a few watts, even while playing pretty loud, which means that the amps are always running in their optimum and linear range, with minimal distortion and noise. The system doesn't need that much power, but I like the clean and quiet sound of the MX-D1 power amps, and since they were a halo/statement product, they only came in one size, powerful enough to drive any speaker they were connected to. They're also compact, with a low profile of only 3 inches/75 mm tall, so they don't visually dominate the electronics stand. Each channel has its own power supply, so they're dual-mono amps, rather than stereo. This really lowers the crosstalk specs, but I'll stop now before I recite the whole sales brochure. Bottom line is that they make me happy.
Every step brought a noticeable improvement in clarity, imaging, detail retrieval, and overhead, but that any step beyond this will be expensive and produce minimal improvements, so this will be the configuration of the system for some time yet.
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Keep in mind that those official specs are impedance (resistance while AC is applied, like normal speaker operation) figures, while your meter measures resistance (resistance while DC is applied), so the numbers will be a bit different from the specs, although both resistance and impedance are measured in ohms. However, the figures for the drivers (both tweeters, both squawkers, both woofers) should be similar to each other. Of course, the woofers don't need to have the same exact resistance figures as the tweeters.
The other thing you can test for is continuity (does the driver have a complete circuit that is, does the power go in one terminal and come out the other one?) This is troubleshooting in the case of a non-functioning driver, so it won't apply in your case. Just wanting to give you the complete picture.
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Some assembly required...
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On 7/16/2023 at 9:25 PM, Flevoman said:
Now you've made me curious.
Years ago, I had the original La Scala. Now, many years later, I have the La Scala AL-5.
Unfortunately, I have no idea how the original La Scala sounded, and I can't compare them anymore since I don't have them.
What's your experience? How does the La Scala II differ in terms of sound from the original La Scala?And what do you mean with cabinet toughness?.. The fineer?
Yes, the veneer. The Lacquered Walnut is very delicate and easily scratched. Even resting your hand on the speakers while wearing a watch with a stainless steel bracelet can cause scratches if you move your hand around. So many sharp corners on those bracelets. However, when I called Klipsch Customer Service about how to repair some scratch marks on my old black-painted plywood La Scalas, I was told to use a Magic Marker, a felt pen with permanent ink. I used it and it did make the scratch less noticeable, but I certainly wouldn't use anything like that on the lacquered LS2s. I have some old Audio Logic speakers, a local brand from Toronto in the '80s. They're covered in oiled walnut veneer. The oiled walnut is certainly more scratch resistant, and you can put things on top of the speaker without making dents in the finish, like you get with lacquer. The helpful guy at Klipsch CS told me that lacquer never really hardens, which is why the feet of anything that's placed on them, even the peel-and-stick rubber or plastic feet of anything that weighs more than a few ounces/50 grams (rounding off, wise guys), can leave little dents in the finish.
Sure, oiled walnut (or cherry, or oak) finishes need to be oiled periodically, and La Scalas or Khorns are really big speakers, so it will take more than five minutes to apply all that oil, but maybe that's really not too much of a tradeoff for a more durable finish that won't make you nervous whenever a vacuum cleaner enters the room.
"No, I insist. The inch of carpet in front of the speakers does not need to be vacuumed. It will be just fine. Please."
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I find that with some kinds of music, if I have a friend over and we're in the middle of the room, before we sit down, the sound is around us, as if we're on the middle of the stage, and although the volume may be a bit high, we can talk over it easily, and understand each other without difficulty. I haven't experienced that with any other speakers.
This effect is more noticeable when the receiver/preamp is set to "9 Channel Stereo", which is really 2 channel stereo, with the sound going to every speaker that's connected, so the Left Main and Surround speakers get the Left channel, the right front and back speakers, JubScala II and La Scala, front and rear, get the Right channel. The front centre Belle and the rear centre Heresy III get a blend, so in effect they're mono.
For critical listening, it's not perfect, but if I'm in the mood, it certainly sounds good enough for the moment. Straight Mode means 2 Channel Stereo, not processed at all, so then all the sound comes from the other side of the room, but it's really clean and clear, because the two main speakers are bi-amped with really good amps. Years ago, when I connected one of the power amps to a Heresy II, it made that speaker sound really good too.
The surprising and cool thing is that the "music is a presence in the room" feeling happens in Straight Mode as well as 9 Channel, but it's less obvious when sitting in the MLP (Main Listening Position). When sitting there, the sound may extend from a little in front of the speakers to way behind them, for normal imaging, but I'm not on the stage. I'm in the audience, looking up at the stage. The performers are located where the recording engineer placed them, left-to-right and front-to-back, with most studio recordings that were assembled with many overdubs. With live music, especially acoustic live music, of course the performers will be located where they were on stage during the performance. I haven't heard a recording where one of the performers comes walking into the audience and you could hear it as well as see it. When I saw Buddy Guy perform here, he came off the stage, walked up the right-hand aisle all the way into the lobby, across it, and re-entered the room by the left-hand aisle, and walked back up onto the stage, playing all the while. It was pretty cool.
However, the sound continued to come from the speakers on and above the stage. It would have been cooler if it was possible for the sound to follow right with him. The only exception I've seen was at a performance by Winter Harp, a local group that plays late Medieval instruments. They generally do some concerts around Christmastime, and start the concert by entering up the centre aisle from the back of the room, playing all the while. The room was a former church, with the usual very high ceiling, but the audience was probably around 400 people, so it was a relatively intimate performance, and the instruments had enough volume to be able to do without sound reinforcement. I think they may have plugged in once they were onstage, but I can't be sure, since it was about 15 years ago.
I suppose it would be possible for a studio recording be done so that the performer, probably a singer or a guitarist, could walk around and have the sound travel with him/her. The idea seems good, but it's possible that a good stereo would be required, and the sound would be compromised when played on a mono speaker or car radio, although car stereos are getting really good.
Okay, I'm just mind-wandering now. Time to stick it back in my head.
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Subs for La Scala's?
in 2-Channel Home Audio
Posted
They should be politicians, with their ability to spend a long time talking without saying anything, or conveying any useful information.