hjones4841

No hurt feelings here. I, too, came on strong with my emotional response. To know what could have been, but was not, was a disappointment. The other H III is a lot straighter grain. As I said before, I knew they were not going to be matched, but these two are rather drasticly different. My first Klipsch dealer had a matched set of K'horns and Belle in oiled rosewood and they were absolutely beautiful. Not too much grain. But he "knew a guy" in the woodworking shop at the factory. At the end of the day with the lights out, the projector on, and the Heritage playing a first rate blu ray, all is well! By the way, I cannot say enough good about timbre matching Heritage for HT. I commented to my wife last night that movie music tracks with A-DSX turned on seem to float in the air. Truly an experience!

Ordering at the same time for custom build is the key for getting matched pairs. I believe that is what either the website says or what I was told when I asked Klipsch customer service about ordering from the factory. Each set of K'horns were bought as pairs and they match perfectly - even the wood grain is in the same place on each one. This time I did not want to wait for the up to 8 weeks for a factory order to finish my HT project, so I ordered them from an online dealer, Vanns. Turns out they only had two in walnut in stock - one from a Montana store, one from Kentucky. I accepted that they would not be matched to get them quicker, but they are vastly different in wood grain. Color is very close, however. I believe that dtel identified what is going on - no stain on the walnut veneer, only a clear lacquer. I do recall that the K'horns darkened some over time as I put more coats of oil on them, but there is an inherent difference in color vs. the newer ones that is not due to darkening alone. Anyway, enough on this. Like I said earlier, if you have an older set in walnut and want others to match, new ones won't. That could be true for cherry as well, but I have not seen that finish.

Here is one of my new Heresy IIIs in front of one of my 1998 K'horns. Now you see the color difference and why I, personally, am disappointed with the finish Klipsch is now using for walnut. The new ones have no feeling of woodgrain; therein is my reference to a plastic like finish.

I think you nailed it - no stain is being used now. The color is close to "bare" walnut. Your picture 100_2064.jpg is about the color of my later Heresys. You got a good bit more wood grain than either of my 4 Heresys. Folks need to be aware of the color change, tho. If you want to color match older ones, well, you had better find some good used older ones. As I said before, this in no way affects my love for the Klipsch sound. My first Heresys were purchased in 1972 (had to sell them to help pay for the K'horns), followed by the '78 and '98 Khorns and the '98 Belle. There was an Academy in the mix at one time - sure wish I had kept it. Many times I have said that I will part with my K'horns only when I am put into a pine box or moved to a nursing home[] By the way, dtel, I was born and raised in Laurel. Went to school at MS State - that is where I was introduced to Klipsch. PWK came to campus in Spring 1971 for a student IEEE program and I cut classes to spend the day with him. Truly an amazing fella!

Thanks for the input, folks. Perhaps my use of "crap" was too strong and emotional. Lets just say that I am quite disappointed in the finish vs. the older speakers. Yes, the older ones are oiled walnut and yes, they have had many coats of oil on them over the years. The older K'horns were available in lacquer and they looked great. I opted for oiled on both sets and on my Belle on the recommendation of the dealer. My biggest issue is the brown color stain that Klipsch is using now for walnut. When my wife saw the Heresy's she said "that is not walnut." In addition, the two Heresys bought a year ago have what appears to be cracks in the finish on both tops - looks like a drying out thing, which makes no sense for lacquer. Nothing has been put on top of them, by the way. Because of the cracks, I opted to put them on the wall for DSX height and put the new ones on the floor for the width channels. Anyone who has an older set in walnut and buys a newer set thinking that the colors will match will be very disappointed. I actually think that cherry would be a better match to the older walnut. I now have three shades of walnut on my front wall. The K'horns and Belle, the walnut on the Hsu subs (Klipsch should find out how Hsu did that, by the way - beautiful!) and the brown Heresys. Of course, all this is cosmetic and in no way impacts my enjoyment of the incredible sound of my Klipsch. I have been a huge fan since the late 1960s.

When did the Heritage finish quality go to crap? My 1978 and 1998 K'horns are beautiful walnut. So is my 1998 Belle. My 2003 Heresy's look great. But the Heresy IIIs that I bought a year ago and the Heresy IIIs that I bought this week look much different. Brown walnut rather than the pretty reddish walnut of years past. Also, finish looks like plastic rather that the advertised real wood. Sure hope the new K'horns don't look like that. I would really be upset paying that much for that kind of finish!

To answer my own question, yes timbre matching does make a difference for height speakers on DSX. The new H IIIs came in yesterday and I had a chance to mount them in place of the RB-81s and re-run Audyssey Pro. The result is a better blend from the wides to the heights and from the mains to the heights. Quite noticeable on "flyovers" on Avatar - perhaps the best demo of the benefits of 11.x DSX. When the RB-81s were turned on, they called attention to themselves. The H IIIs don't. You know they are there, but there is no distinct difference in the sound. Not sure why, but the derived height channels sound less "phasey" than with the RB-81s. Guess that is either real or placebo[]

After several days of trying to talk myself out of it, I ordered another pair of walnut Heresy IIIs for the height channels. Should be here tomorrow. Got them from Vanns. As you know, Heritage is very hard to find in stock anywhere. Vanns had one in MT, another one in KY. I called the "factory store." None in stock. Guess I was mistaken about buying Heritage direct. What I was told is that they send them thru a local dealer with up to 8 weeks delivery; no store close to me anymore for Heritage. So, online made sense. I use a pair of 60lb rated Omnimounts for the RB-81s. Not pleased with that mounting; very wobbly until the compression bolt on the ball is very tight. Not going to do that to the Heresys. Gonna use a wood shelf attached to studs in the wall. Think I will reverse the Heresy risers to put a slight tilt down. I will post my impressions of the difference after re-running Audyssey Pro calibration.

Thanks for the reply. When I bought the RB-81s I had recently bought Heresy IIIs for the wides, so I decided to compromise. Plus the RB-81s were certainly easier to hang on the wall with heavy duty Omnimounts. It sounds fine, but the extra efficieny and better timbre match of hanging another set of Heresy IIIs might be worth it. Let me get the wife's new furniture delivered first, know what I mean? []

Thanks for the input. Will do. I read that someone sent their amps in and had Emotiva reduce the gain. I am within driving distance of thier offices, so that may be an option.

I am driving Emotiva XPA-5s with the pre-outs of a Denon AVR-A100. There is audible hum (well above 60Hz) from all channels when I am very close to the speakers (combo of K'horns, Heresy IIIs and RB-81 IIs in an 11.2 setup). All normal trouble shooting has been done (interconnects, ground loop check, etc.) I think the issue is higher gain of the Emotivas. Other than the $$ Jensen transformers, has anyone found decent lower price attenuators? I read that the ones from Parts Express are poor quality. Thanks for your input.

My system is set up for Audyssey DSX 11.2 (Denon AVR-A100 with Emotiva external amps). All channels except for the height speakers are Heritage - K'horns, Belle, Heresy IIIs. The heights are RB-81 IIs. Would there be any audible benefit to swapping the RB-81s for another set of Heresy IIIs? My initial thoughts are that timbre matching is not that important for "derived" channels like A-DSX. Full discrete channels likely would be different. Your thoughts? Thanks.

I am using a Hsu ULS-15 Quad Drive with my K'horns. Very good match with freq response to well below 20Hz. The Hsus have excellent transient response (fast) that matches very well with the horn bass from the K'horns. Plus, the Quad Drive will "keep up" with the K'horns' output when you get the urge to "turn it up to 11."

Yes, RB-81 is what I meant. These Omnimounts look like they will do what I want. Most of what I was seeing would not tilt enough to get the proper angle for the DSX heights. These will. Thanks!!

What is a good way to hang RF-81s from the ceiling. Need them in the corner, pointed down at 45 degrees - for height speakers for a 11.2 HT setup. Vertical or horizontal? Thanks.

I am considering using RB-81s in a 11.2 DSX system. Rest of system is K'horns for FR, FL, SBR, SBL, a Belle for C, Heresy IIIs for SR, SL, and Heresy IIIs for Front Wide L & R. Couple of questions - will the RB-81s timbre match OK with the Heritage speakers? I have a Denon AVR-100 with Audyssey XT-32 that will help with that. Also, anyone have ideas as to how to ceiling mount the RB-81s? I see that there are treaded inserts in the bottoms of the RB-81s. Do they match any Ominmounts that could be hung from the ceiling or mounted on the wall? Would I be better off using two center channel speakers mounted horizontally? Thanks.

Yes, but I cannot meet those specific angles in my room. L/R is more like 45 deg to my main seat. Best I can do is put the LW/RW along the side walls, which puts them 3-5 feet in front of the K'horns. That might get me about 60 degrees with them toe'd in.

I just upgraded to a new AVR (Denon AVR-A100) and wondered if anyone with K'horns as their fronts has tried adding front wide speakers. If so, was there a noticeable widening of the sound stage? With the K's in the corners, I am not sure there would be any benefits to adding the width speakers. Thanks.

. I agree. Lightning fried the amp in my FSR-18 about 4 years ago. Velodyne fixed it for about $175. Worth a phone call

If I may chime in with my PWK "moment"... In Spring, 1971 PWK addressed the MS State IEEE student meeting in Starkville, MS. A good friend was the local Klipsch dealer (Steve Shepard, Ideal Acoustics) and made all the arrangements. A host of speakers and electronics were set up in the campus Physics building. Don't remember the details, likely a pair of K'horns with a Heresy or Cornwall, driven by Marantz electronics and a Crown reel-to-reel. I was an EE student at the time and cut a day of classes to drive PWK around between the dealer's house, the local Holiday Inn, and the campus. I had a Plymouth GTX car at the time, 8-track and all. I remember Paul telling me of a fella that mounted Heresys on the rear deck of his car. He told me that he had just quit running 5 miles a day per his doctor's orders. At the IEEE meeting, the girl that introduced him pronounced "Klissphh," I wanted to get up and slap her. PWK ran down the aisle at full speed, took one step with those long legs of his and leaped up on the stage. Of course, most of what he said was over the heads of most in attendance - vaguely remember a discussion on intermod distortion of woofers, dopper effect, etc. But I am sure that the following demo sold some Klipsch speakers to future grads!

Real men don't hide their toys[]

Amy: If you are speaking of the Wood Play brand of play sets, I bought my son one years ago (about 1993). I was disappointed in the quality for what I spent. I bought all cedar, but bees quickly started boring into the wood. It started looking bad quickly, even tho I put 2-3 coats of oil stain on it. Plus, the accessories are not well made (at least at that time) - the slide had so much friction that he could never enjoy it. Some of the parts that were not cedar rotted within 2-3 years. I ended up cutting it up with my chainsaw about 3-4 years ago. Maybe quality is up now, but from my experience I would not pay that kind of money for it again. My neighbor built his own play set out of pressure treated lumber - it stood the test of time far better than the Wood Play set. ...just my two pennies worth...

About 8 or so years ago, I paid the difference to buy the Elite over the nearly indentical standard Pioneer receiver. I don't remember the model numbers, but the Elite carried a significantly higher price. I ordered the service manual from Pioneer and found out that the same manual covered both the Elite and the standard Pioneer versions. The schematic showed IDENTICAL parts between the two (same part numbers, too), except for one additional feature that the Elite had - a second zone feed. So, at least at that time, I paid a lot of money for a prettier black finish on the cabinet... Perhaps things have changed since then; perhaps not.

I would advise not going on Saturday. It took me over 2 hours to get from Sevierville to Gatlinburg last Saturday afternoon - bumper to bumper, all lanes. You will love the K'horns. I have a 78 pair that I bought new, a 98 pair also bought new, and a 98 Belle, also bought new. All in my home theater - 98 pair and Belle up front, the 78 pair in back. I did upgrade the crossover networks and the midrange drivers on the 78 pair in 2002 to better match the voicing of the 98's. They are there to stay - won't even consider changing for anything else unless they won't fit in the nursing home some day!!!!!

I have had the 5805 since late last April, driving 4 K'horns (front and rear corners), a Belle (center), two Heresy IIs (sides) and a Velodyne FSR-18 sub and I love the sound. Previous set up was 1998 vintage separate Denons (8000 series pre-pro with the 8300 amp for the fronts and a 8200 amp for the rears.) The 5805 beats the crap out of the older separate set-up. Most folks on this forum do favor separates, but again, I am very, very pleased with the 5805.