rf-82 front, rf-52 surround, rs-52 front high and back surround - advice please

[Johnny Do]

Hi guys. I'm hopping a few of you guys can give me some advice or point me in teh right direction. I'm aiming to get a 9.2 setup up and running. So far this is what I have:

2x SUB-12

4x RSX-4

2x RF-52

1x RC-62

This is what I'm thinking for a nice 9.2 setup using what I have and buying speakers which are on sale/no longer sold at my local store:

2x rf-82 - front

2x rf-52 - side surround (yes these are the tower speakers)

2x rc-62 - center (cheaper then a single rc-64)

2x rs-52 - rear surround

2x rs-52 - front high

My questions to you guys are:

- should/can I use the rf-52 as my side surround or just bite the bullet and get 4x rf-82 for the front and side surround (none are purchased yet but they are only on sale for a few more days here)

- will I get much of a benifit on using two rc-62's instead of one as I was originally going to get a rc-64 but they more expensive then teh cost of 2 sperate speakers.

- should/can I use the rsx-4's as rear/front high speakers or should I go with the rs-52's for all the above. I haven't even priced them out locally yet so not sure what the price difference is. I paid $100 for each rsx-4's and already have 4 of them. The other option is the rs-42 are avliable and pretty cheap here. Some advice here is most helpful as I'm not sure what I "need" or what I "should" get.

- how can you describe the difference between the SUB-12 and the reference 12" RW-12d ?? Currently I am placing my 2 SUB-12 on the front left and right to even out the bass, and so far it's working it pretty good. I'm just not sure if it's worth it to sell them off and get the reference line.

- what is better if you had to choose 7.1 sound - "rear surround speakers" or "front high speakers" and why?

I currently have an onkyo sr-507 receiver with the rear surrounds running off an external 100watt amp (the receiver has 5 channels of amplified output, but has another line level output for the rear surround or front high speakers. The plan is to buy a higher end 9.2 amp later down the road once the speakers are paid off.

Thanks in advance for your help. I greatly appriciate it.

[Bill H.]

Save your money. Just setup a nice 5.1 system and bank the savings..............

There are not even many 7.1 movies out, so why go overboard ?

[Zen Traveler]

Save your money. Just setup a nice 5.1 system and bank the savings..............

There are not even many 7.1 movies out, so why go overboard ?

http://community.klipsch.com/forums/t/124229.aspx

[Oblio]

Save your money. Just setup a nice 5.1 system and bank the savings..............

There are not even many 7.1 movies out, so why go overboard ?

Or use the last 2 for a second zone if your AVR supports it

[Zen Traveler]

Save your money. Just setup a nice 5.1 system and bank the savings..............

There are not even many 7.1 movies out, so why go overboard ?

Or use the last 2 for a second zone if your AVR supports it

Whoa! That's not my quote. []

I LOVE the way my Library Home Theater listed below converts 5.1 material to 7.1. [H]

[Johnny Do]

I'm not too worried about saving money if I get something worth while in the end. That is within reason. I've already set my heart on the RF-82's, but I don't know if I shoudl get 1 set for the front's and use the RF-52's I have for the side surround. Or get 4x RF-82's and use them for front and side surround.

The next thing, is I'm not sure what the best rear surround and front high speakers would be to match up with the rest of what I have. I'm alrady oplanning on getting a 9.2 receiver down the road, so that's not going to be an issue. I just need some help/advice as to what to plan out for speakers.

So in responce to my original message, consider money a non-factor as I want to just make this all work .. even if it takes me months to buy everything, I just simply need a plan of attack here. For the next week and a bit the RF-82's are on sale at half price as well the RC-62's. So it's a matter of how many to get.

[Johnny Do]

I LOVE the way my Library Home Theater listed below converts 5.1 material to 7.1.

What is or rather how are you suing yoru "A" and "B" surrounds ? Have you ever tried out 9.1 audio? is it musch better then 7.1? I'm getting mixed feedback locally to whoever I talk to. Ho wmuch audio do you get out of the surround/back surround to the point of do you think it's worth it to get bigger speakers?

cheers

[Johnny Do]

Save your money. Just setup a nice 5.1 system and bank the savings..............

There are not even many 7.1 movies out, so why go overboard ?

Or use the last 2 for a second zone if your AVR supports it

I could use a 2nd zone, however I don't need to. My bedroom has a RSX-4 and RC-10 setup, the office a pro media 5.1 pro, and this is my living room. I have my workshop all setup with speakers to the back yard so that's all good. Thanks though.

[wuzzzer]

- should/can I use the rf-52 as my side surround or just bite the bullet and get 4x rf-82 for the front and side surround (none are purchased yet but they are only on sale for a few more days here)

Considering that the general recommendation for side surrounds is more of a wide dispersion type, I'd be inclined to look at RS-52 or RS-62s. That being said, I personally use floorstanders as my side surrounds. I think with a multiple-speaker arrangement such as you're considering the RS series might be better.

- will I get much of a benifit on using two rc-62's instead of one as I was originally going to get a rc-64 but they more expensive then teh cost of 2 sperate speakers.

No. I would highly suggest a single center speaker. There are acoustic anomalies that come in to play when you have two speakers playing exactly the same sounds that are intended for a single speaker to reproduce. There are RC-64s on eBay for $600-700 buy-it-now all the time.

- should/can I use the rsx-4's as rear/front high speakers or should I go with the rs-52's for all the above. I haven't even priced them out locally yet so not sure what the price difference is. I paid $100 for each rsx-4's and already have 4 of them. The other option is the rs-42 are avliable and pretty cheap here. Some advice here is most helpful as I'm not sure what I "need" or what I "should" get.

RSX-4s aren't going to give you the same dynamics as the other speakers you're considering. Rear surrounds are recommended to be a direct radiating design such as you'll find in the RB or RF series.

- how can you describe the difference between the SUB-12 and the reference 12" RW-12d ?? Currently I am placing my 2 SUB-12 on the front left and right to even out the bass, and so far it's working it pretty good. I'm just not sure if it's worth it to sell them off and get the reference line.

Two Sub-12s, properly set up, will give most anyone all the musical and LFE bass information that you'll need unless you're listening at extremely high dB levels or have a huge room.

- what is better if you had to choose 7.1 sound - "rear surround speakers" or "front high speakers" and why?

At this point I'd lean towards a 7.1 with rear surrounds. I haven't heard a setup with front high speakers, but at this point that signal is being matrixed from the front channels, compared to many discs featuring 7.1 discrete channels with a rear channel setup.

I currently have an onkyo sr-507 receiver with the rear surrounds running off an external 100watt amp (the receiver has 5 channels of amplified output, but has another line level output for the rear surround or front high speakers. The plan is to buy a higher end 9.2 amp later down the road once the speakers are paid off.

Something to consider would be getting a nice 3 channel amp to run your front 3 speakers as they generally demand the most power from a receiver. A 7+ channel power amp is going to be pretty expensive in most anything that would be an upgrade from a nice receiver's internal amps. You could then keep your current Onkyo receiver and amp that you're powering your rear speakers with and simply add a 3 channel amp such as the Emotiva XPA-3.

[Johnny Do]

Thanks Wuzzer,

Note: my audio preference is based around movies and games. I don't listen to music very much short of what is on the radio.

- So the RF-52's would be better suited for the rear surrounds not my side surround? My understanding is that correct placement of rear surrounds are on the back wall, facing towards the tv and and mounted 2 - 3 feet above ear level and pointed down towards the listener. Am I wrong on this? If not, how could I impliment the RF-52's into my system; or do you think I should just sell them off and go with somethign else instead. My understnading is also that side surround speakers to be just at or above ear level (the rf-52's do this). Of note, the RS-42/52 go on sale here alot more offten.

- Since you use floor standing speakers for your side surrounds, how do you like them? Are you considering going with the RS series instead?

- You haven't commented on the front high speakers, should/can I go with the RS-42/52 speakers or other? Again what experiance would I have if you recomend the RB instead of the RS series.

- what difference would I experiance with the RS-42/52 Vs the RB/RF for the back surround?

- I'm going to take your recomendation and not use the RSX-4's in this setup but instead use them in the bedroom with a RC-10 center channel and a 5.1 amp I have. I didn't think these small speakers would be up to the challenge of goign with these other larger speakers.

[wuzzzer]

Note: my audio preference is based around movies and games. I don't listen to music very much short of what is on the radio.

- So the RF-52's would be better suited for the rear surrounds not my side surround? My understanding is that correct placement of rear surrounds are on the back wall, facing towards the tv and and mounted 2 - 3 feet above ear level and pointed down towards the listener. Am I wrong on this? If not, how could I impliment the RF-52's into my system; or do you think I should just sell them off and go with somethign else instead. My understnading is also that side surround speakers to be just at or above ear level (the rf-52's do this). Of note, the RS-42/52 go on sale here alot more offten.

If you're pretty much 100% movies I'd stay with the wide dispersion sides and direct radiating rears that's recommended by Dolby and others.

- Since you use floor standing speakers for your side surrounds, how do you like them? Are you considering going with the RS series instead?

I used to have RS-42s as side surrounds. Due to space and layout contraints in my room the RS-42s just didn't work. Once a friend knocked one off the wall when we had a party here I knew it was time for them to go. I have my KG 3.5s on stands I built that are about 6" tall. I listen to a lot of music and music concerts and like the sound of the KGs as surrounds. I feel that they are a closer timbre match to my Fortes than the RS-42s were.

- You haven't commented on the front high speakers, should/can I go with the RS-42/52 speakers or other? Again what experiance would I have if you recomend the RB instead of the RS series.

The RB series will produce sounds that are easier to locate where they are coming from, the RS series will disperse the sound and make it harder to localize. I'm not sure what the intent that front height speakers are supposed to give but I'd imagine the RB series would be the way to go.

- what difference would I experiance with the RS-42/52 Vs the RB/RF for the back surround?

Again, localization of sound versus dispersion of sound. I'd stick with the direct radiating speaker recommendation.

- I'm going to take your recomendation and not use the RSX-4's in this setup but instead use them in the bedroom with a RC-10 center channel and a 5.1 amp I have. I didn't think these small speakers would be up to the challenge of goign with these other larger speakers.

Good choice!

[Rockingout]

I just got my 7.1 system up and running and I think it is AWESOME. I have for the front RF-82, center RC-62, side RS-52 and my rear RB-61 all hooked up to an Onkyo SR-805 receiver. I was running a sony 5.1 receiver with just 5.1 before and adding the rear rb-61 really really added an experience along with the upgrade in the recevier (more amps and better processors). On movies which have alot of surround it envolopes the listener better. I just watched my bloody valentine last night and it was freaky hearing stuff cracking and creaping behind the listener coming from the rear speakers. I really didn' have that before the 7.1. The side rs-52 are just perfect in the setup. I have them about 3 feet above the listener and pointed down about 10 degrees, they really are crisp and dispersive. Hope this helps.

Cheers!

[Johnny Do]

Can anyone give me feedback on using RF-52's for the front-wide (DSX I think it's called) Vs getting another set of RF-82's. I Read that the center is where most of the action is, the front left/right gets about half the action, then half again goes to the front wide .. so I'm thinking a smaller speaker here woudl work out friggin awesome, especially when I already own the RF-52's.

I just got my 7.1 system up and running and I think it is AWESOME. I have for the front RF-82, center RC-62, side RS-52 and my rear RB-61 all hooked up to an Onkyo SR-805 receiver. I was running a sony 5.1 receiver with just 5.1 before and adding the rear rb-61 really really added an experience along with the upgrade in the recevier (more amps and better processors). On movies which have alot of surround it envolopes the listener better. I just watched my bloody valentine last night and it was freaky hearing stuff cracking and creaping behind the listener coming from the rear speakers. I really didn' have that before the 7.1. The side rs-52 are just perfect in the setup. I have them about 3 feet above the listener and pointed down about 10 degrees, they really are crisp and dispersive. Hope this helps.

Cheers!

WOW, that's exactly what I was looking for thanks man.

- Do you find that you need the RB-61 vs the RB-51 for the back? I figured that since you use the RS-52 for the sides, teh back would be a matching set .. so the RB-51 would be used.

- Have you tried to run anything for the front high speakers? I'm curious to see/hear what others have to say between using a direct speaker (rb-51/61) Vs the dispersion type speaker (RS-52/62). I just read elsewhere it depends on what amp you want to run. I'll be going with teh onkyo high end 9.2 or perhaps a Denon .. not sure which .. but problaby the flagship denon 9.3/11.3 amp

So having said all the above, how do I determine or can anyone give with reason which line of side/rear/front high speakers to use (5.25" drivers or 6.5" drivers). From what I have read and listened to .. all these speakers are used less and with less volume then the front and center channels. So I assume you can go smaller, but how small can you go. ie, I alrady have 4 RSX-4's right now. So how would I determine or can anyone give me a reason why these would or would not be a good choice for this application? obviously the smaller the speaker the less volume you get out of it and less punch you get etc, but I'm looking for the methodology for determining what is required and what is recomended.

Thanks again for everyone's advice. It's been a great help.

[Rockingout]

Can anyone give me feedback on using RF-52's for the front-wide (DSX I think it's called) Vs getting another set of RF-82's. I Read that the center is where most of the action is, the front left/right gets about half the action, then half again goes to the front wide .. so I'm thinking a smaller speaker here woudl work out friggin awesome, especially when I already own the RF-52's.

no help here as my receiver only does 7.1

WOW, that's exactly what I was looking for thanks man.

- Do you find that you need the RB-61 vs the RB-51 for the back? I figured that since you use the RS-52 for the sides, teh back would be a matching set .. so the RB-51 would be used.

The rb61 are pretty big, I would think since the rb51 has the same driver as the side rs 52 it would be ideal. I chose the rb61 cause I listen to full surround music. In my setup all the surround and rears flow perfectly from each other and sound matched up.

- Have you tried to run anything for the front high speakers? I'm curious to see/hear what others have to say between using a direct speaker (rb-51/61) Vs the dispersion type speaker (RS-52/62). I just read elsewhere it depends on what amp you want to run. I'll be going with teh onkyo high end 9.2 or perhaps a Denon .. not sure which .. but problaby the flagship denon 9.3/11.3 amp

no help here. my receiver is only 7.1

So having said all the above, how do I determine or can anyone give with reason which line of side/rear/front high speakers to use (5.25" drivers or 6.5" drivers). From what I have read and listened to .. all these speakers are used less and with less volume then the front and center channels. So I assume you can go smaller, but how small can you go. ie, I alrady have 4 RSX-4's right now. So how would I determine or can anyone give me a reason why these would or would not be a good choice for this application? obviously the smaller the speaker the less volume you get out of it and less punch you get etc, but I'm looking for the methodology for determining what is required and what is recomended.

my surounds on some explosions are just as loud as my fronts. My receiver has Audussey sound equilizer set up and it set up my listening position perfectly. I would use the rs52 for the sides and either the rb62 or the rb51 depending on how far the listening position is from the rear speakers. If the listening position is closure than 2-3 feet from the rears I would look at a dispersion style speaker like the rs52 instead of a direct firing speaker like the rb51 and 61. hope this helps.

Thanks again for everyone's advice. It's been a great help.

[Johnny Do]

Can you check out the speaker levels of the Rear and Surround speakers? I'm curious to see what the Audisey setup did to compensate that the rear is a much larger/more efficient speaker then teh surrounds. If there is a big different 3 or more db, then I know I'm safe with the RB-51, if the difference is small, then audesey likes having a larger rear speaker.