Tannoy Westminster Royal / Klipschorn / Jubilee / JBL K2

[sunnysal]

PTJ,

Considering the music you are listening too, the room size and that you plan to keep existing electronics (they are quite good units you have there) I would think the JBLs would be an excellente choice. I have auditioned them (not in my home) with levinson SS electronics and they sounded great!

I think the only adavntage the k-horns might have would be if you had two good corners to place them in and that placement put your desk in the sweet spot,...however I would suggest tubes amps if you choose the k-horns, they can sound a bit strident with SS IMHO (I have tried many SS amps in my system with my k-horns and always preferred tubes)..

I see no advantage to the jubes in that size room. I like C-46 (my bedroom system in Mcintosh) and cannot comment on the Tannoys but they do seem oversized for your space.

keep us posted about developments and best of luck, tony

[PartTimeJedi]

Thanks for the input, much appreciated SS

[fmk5805]

Dear PartTimeJedi,

My compliments on your interest in high end JBL products. I was wondering if you were aware of the K2-M9500's? They have been considered the best ever produced by JBL and are convincingly in the elite league. They are extremely rare and it will take at least $50,000 to replace them with something comparable (new), such as the Wilson Maxx's or TAD's Reference Monitors. $20,000 was spent not long ago to acquire this pair from Norway, as they are extremenely difficult to find in the US. I have experienced two different guests who have listened critically to the Wilson Maxxes. Both, after listening to my my M9500's, concuded that they easily outperformed the Wilsons.

http://homepage.mac.com/dkoya/audio/k2m9500.html

From the owners manual: "....Distortion...values seen here lie well below 1% for the lowest frequencies up to 4.5 khz, reaching a value of only 1.6% at 10 kHz. Not many loudspeakers can demonstrate such low levels of distortion

JBL has a more current, downsized version S9800 with one 15" woofer that has recently sold for about $28000, listed for $30,000 and reportedly still don't measure up . I haven't heard much about their very latest.

In comparison, The M9500s listed for $40,000 10 years ago and weigh about 320 lb each without the crossovers, which is another 25 lb or so. Each speaker has 3 sections that are stacked. The separate passive crossover enclosures have three Speakon connectors and cables to each speaker element, facilitating handling and assembly. Efficiency is 95db vs 92db for the newer scaled-down version. Each speaker is capable of producing 122db with 500 watts at 1 meter distance, so the pair would easily produce 120db at normal listening distance. Most listening has been below 95 db and therefore below 1 watt. This translates to very light use, long component life and tremendous dynamic range.

The finish is a special rubbery sound-absorptive coating resembling ultra suede that unfortunately scuffs easily. I am an old self-employed engineer with health issues and some tough economic choices. Otherwise I wouldn't dream of selling them. I am hoping the 9500's will find the right new home! If their value increased beyond their list price in the same manner as JBL's L300's, their selling price would help me to stay in my home much longer!

Please PM and I will provide a phone number if you are interested. I will look forward to hearing from you.

[tigerwoodKhorns]

I like the JBLs allot, they have a dynamic openness that I have not heard before, very electrostatic like. You are right, in past months I have come to realize the extra wattage makes a difference. I have also seen that with Tannoy's. What’s your current system?

Classe CAM 350 power amps and Pioneer S-1ex sepakers, which are actually TAD speakers (I replaced B&W S800's with the Pioneers). I don't use the power, but the amps still sound great wit hthese speakers.

[IndyKlipschFan]

100% personal bs chat on this one..I assure you....

You said, "What I like is a wall of sound that you can have while sitting at a desk working (that’s how I listen to music.)"

I have to ask about your room size here, and the location in that room of your desk too. Because you sound like this is an office I assume at home? That said, the "big ness" of these speakers will not really be appreciated in such a small room, because you will need some loudness to get that "wall of sound" feeling in my opinion for it to hit you just right?

So here we go. I'll try with my 2 cents.

Your gonna need great corners to help you with K horns. K horns in my opinion, need a room with great walls, a unobstructed back too, and be 18- 24 feet into the corners. I have to ask too...if you have
a monitor in front of you, thats going to screw things up a bit too. (I have these.)

The Jubes are just HUGE.... They might be fun, you may also desire a sub too. Both the Klipsch will display any hiss or bad recordings that will make your fingernails on a chalkboard pale by comparrison. With good recordings too.. they will WOW you! That said, in a big office... A bigger family room etc., they are just awesome. (heard these a lot.. Friends have these.)

I cant speak too much for the exact Tannoy you mention. I still feel you need to be in the sweet spot or they suck. And a lot of money too.. (Heard Tannoy at stereo fests..)

As for the JBL's LOTS of money, away from the wall, with LOT's of power needed too.. (Heard at CEDIA.) Sorry to say, not the best place, and not 100% OMG impressed.. NIce,,, yes I am sure.. but didn't wow me like no other.

An opinion is like a pooper shoot. Everyone has one.. Some smell (In this case sound) worse than others...

[Coytee]

Hi PTJ,

Here's my take, is your room big enough? I'll let you decide. You may feel you don't care if it's not optimum and make a decision anyway (and like the decision)

My room is about 16x25 give or take (it's actually 15 1/2 wide). My Jubilees are on the narrow wall. I used to have Khorns there.

Where are you located? There are Jubilee (and Khorn) owners that will welcome you into their home to give a good listen. I know you said you've heard them both so maybe you have this covered.

Here's my take... If you consider Khorns then I would suggest you strongly consider the Jubilees instead. Here's why... I've said it over & over on this forum AND I've attributed the logic in the wrong area (silly me!)

I had my Khorns in my corners, I had some ALK extreme slope crossovers in them. I was also running them with some JBL 2404 tweeters so they weren't maxed out on tweaks but... might have been better than bone stock.

Long story short, the sound on the Jubilees comes together in coherency MUCH closer/sooner than it did with my Khorns. I had to be about 30' away from the Khorns (line of sight, in the foyer) before their sound had the same coherency that the Jubilees do while being only 10' away from them. Yes, I have actually measured to this spot.

If you love or hate the asthetics of the Jubilee, that's between you & your wife. All I'm saying is if you put blinders on your eyes and only used your ears you would agree that in my home, my electronics (and all those disclaimers), the Jubilees sound noticably better up close, than the Khorns did. Not that the Khorns were ANY slouch I might add, I'm not slamming them. This is really just a testamony to the improvement that the 2-way format brings over the 3-way format. To a lessor degree (if any?) I also use an active with some signal alignment in it but after having fiddled around with that for fun, have come to the conclusion that it's the change to a 2-way that offered me the most improvement.

Also, if you have good corners, the Khorn/Jubilee will tuck away much nicer.

I also own a pair of LaScalas that I've had for 30 years, the Jubilees...as massive as they are, still take up less 'room space' than my LaScalas AND, they essentially the same ease of placement (though you want them within maybe 10" of the corner to maximize their low end extension)

[AltmanEars]

Actually this thread has a really cool subtext --- if you dont read carefully you might miss it...

The subtext is --- I have tons of money and I have already picked out some components I think are really cool, though I'm not sure what they would work with... Help me find some expensive speakers I can shoehorn into my office and arent so good that they require careful matching with the rest of my stuff.

With a clean slate you would simply send your room dimensions to Shindo and Yamamoto and have them design speakers with really good drivers which work in your room and a custom amp and preamp that go with them. You would have your choice of two completely intgrated solutions which would likely sound really good. In the process you would save money even considering the ridiculous Shindo / Yamamoto prices.

[PartTimeJedi]

AltmanEars - Thanks for the input on Shindo / Yamamoto - from my side at least - no subtext - genuine interest in some very good speakers using my long term stable electronics I have had which used to drive electrostatics - and I have appreciated the input from the various members which I will think with when demoing/deciding. On the cash side of it there is not much - just - I work about 15 hours every day - and save.

[tigerwoodKhorns]

The subtext is --- I have tons of money and I have already picked out some components I think are really cool, though I'm not sure what they would work with... Help me find some expensive speakers I can shoehorn into my office and arent so good that they require careful matching with the rest of my stuff.

I'd go with the JBL's so that you don't have to be subjected to this crap.

[AltmanEars]

The subtext is --- I have tons of money and I have already picked out some components I think are really cool, though I'm not sure what they would work with... Help me find some expensive speakers I can shoehorn into my office and arent so good that they require careful matching with the rest of my stuff.

I'd go with the JBL's so that you don't have to be subjected to this crap.

Not sure we have to devolve into that kind of language. I'm also not sure how accurate it is since the Shindo and Yamamoto owners seem to be really decent guys. The engineering and voicing is a love it leave it type of thing.

The observation though remains --- and I'll say it another way. In practice at the higher levels of sound reproduction you are buying an amp/speaker combination. Its pretty rare that an amp which works really well for an electrostatic speaker would be optimal for use with a very efficient dynamic speaker so even if you are willing to pay stupid money for a speaker your results might not be so hot...

Another observation many will disagree with is that most speakers which like a bunch of watts and require massive amplification arent particularly good speakers.

Said another way a cheaper speaker and a really good low powered amp may actually sound better than using the existing amps on a speaker that likes loads of watts.