For speakers and active crossovers experts

[robi]

Hi guys,

look at the attached pages please. We're speaking about BSS 366 speakers manager.

For that you can read in the attachment do you think the alignment assistant with a microphone can correct (phase and amplitude) the room??? Or not???

Thank you for your contribution!!!!

Robi.

TimeAlign_fds366um.pdf

TimeAlign_fds366um.pdf

[Edgar]

For that you can read in the attachment do you think the alignment assistant with a microphone can correct (phase and amplitude) the room??? Or not???

Not.

You cannot correct a room by modifying the input to a loudspeaker. You can compensate for some room deficiencies at one fixed listening location, at a cost of making things worse at other listening locations. But to correct a room you have to modify the room itself.

Greg

[Guest " "]

no and the product does not claim to do so.

[DrWho]

What is it you're trying to do?

[Al Klappenberger]

Robi,

My reasons for saying this are long a drawn out, but I wouldn't waste a dime on that thing of you have a LaScala Belle or Khorn. With one of the newer speakers withOUT a horn loaded woofer. it might do something. I can't tell but it might require bi-amping or even tri-amping to function correctly. That's a bag of worms in itself.

Al K.

[mark1101]

I'm with Doc.......what are you trying to do?

[Rudy81]

It will not correct your room. It will check your drivers for phase and time alignment. It seems rather similar to the things I can do with the Behringer crossover I am using. It also has an automatic feature. If you want something that will attempt to analyze and correct for room anomalies, you will need something like Audyssey, or do it yourself with an EQ.

I have been looking at the BSS unit as a possible upgrade to my Behringer unit. Perhaps if you told us exactly what your goals are, we might be able to provide some suggestions. Several of the folks who have already answered you are very knowledgeable on these types of issue.

[robi]

Thank you guys for your important contribution!!!!

I'm just looking around to improve my Cornscalas. Active crossover, multiamping, digital room correction, eccc.....

If in the attached file BSS say the microphone should be ok forward listener position then the measure should be affected by the room (walls, carpets, ecccc...).

If the BSS use this measure to correct amplitude and phase why don't correct the room??????

I'm sorry but I'm not an expert!!!

Thank you again!!!

[Edgar]

If the BSS use this measure to correct amplitude and phase why don't correct the room??????

Here's why. Signal manipulation can compensate for only a small fraction of room anomalies. Basically, if you're room is bad, correct the room, not the signal.

[Al Klappenberger]

I agree with Edgar. Early on I bought into the thinking that says that you should put you instrument mike at the listening chair and adjust your equalizer to get a flat response there. As it turns out, after doing that your stereo image is shot! I found the thing to do is set your instrument mike 1 meter in front of each speaker and adjust each channel for a flat response, THEN set both channels equal and half way between the settings!

BTW: trying to equalize the time delays between drivers just puts the overlap between the drivers out of time. To keep everything in time you need to make each driver reproduces only a specific frequency range with no overlap. That means extreme-slope crossovers or bi-amp or even tri-amping each driver. Once you go to extreme slope crossovers you are left only with the phase difference between the components of the waveform. Your ear is deaf to that so you no longer need to correct for the time erros in the first place!

Al K.

[Rudy81]

As most here know, I too am no expert. I will just share my experience on the subject. Al is correct. If the room is bad, there is not much you can do electronically to fix those issues. Most rooms suffer from low frequency problems more so than HF problems. HF problems are much easier to fix with some 'thin' absorbers properly placed. Bass problems are much more difficult to fix. I have a dedicated room and was able to do as I wished with the room. It was a long journey and a steep learning curve. But, I eventually came to the conclusion that I needed to fix the major room problems first and then tweak things with electronics.

I spent quite a bit of time in Ethan Winer's pages and his commercial site http://www.realtraps.com/ as well as reading the "Master Handbook of Acoustics" to learn as much as I could on how to treat a room to optimize sound. My room currently has heavy basss absorption on the room corners and wall to ceiling corners. I also have HF absorbers on the ceiling and side walls at the speaker reflection points. The entire back wall is a giant quadratic diffuser I made. Overall, sound in the room is very good. However, it is not perfect, or flat. I use my Integra's Audyssey to make the final tweaks. The difference with and without Audyssey is minimal and primarily affects the lower frequencies.

My active setup has minimal EQ and I have my two way DBB system time aligned.

The imaging is outstanding. But, the really awesome part is the soundstage I am getting right now. I have never had such good, deep, clear soundstage. I believe a lot of that is due to the room treatment as well as the fact that I was able to move the speakers away from the walls when I went from the Khorn to the DBB.

The P. Audio driver BM-D750 (K69) and horn P-4525 are an awesome combination and I could not be happier. I have made many changes in my system over the years and my current setup is by far the best I have heard in my room.

One problem with time alignment is that when you time align drivers, it is only for one location in your listening space. There is a long discussion on the topic by Dr. Who in my Active Crossover thread. Dr. Who helped me a lot to learn about active crossovers, time alignment etc.

If you don't have WAF issues and can place acoustic treatments in your room, I believe those changes will be much more effective than anything you can do with electronics in order to improve the sound you hear in your room.

[robi]

Thank you guys!!!!

Your suggestions are precious!!!