Queston: ribbon tweeter with Khorns?

[dubai2000]

Hi all,

yesterday I was exposed to a person's -don't laugh- Chinese loudspeaker produced by a company called Aurum cantus. In that bookshelf unit they use a ribbon tweeter which sounded mighty fine.

The interesting thing is that they also offer a model with 102 db efficiency (i.e. my Fostex tweeter's territory). Has anybody ever tried using such a tweeter on his Khorns? I would cross over at the regular Klipsch frequency.

Any feedback will be appreciated - thx.

Wolfram

[pzannucci]

My home built speakers have G1's in them. The ribbons are excellent though about 2-3 db down from the level of a k-77. Also it is hard to mate the dispersion of the ribbon to match the k-horn. This is very relevent on the vertical axis. Some discussion of matching with a horn though in the thread referenced. And yes I tried to mate it with the khorns.

http://community.klipsch.com/forums/p/92931/941637.aspx#941637

[dubai2000]

Hi Peter,

thanks a lot for chiming in and the link. Unfortunately in it there was no 'final result' postetd. What have been your experiences? And yes, the G-1 raised my curiosity as the G-3 in that Aurum speaker was really quite interesting.

Wolfram

[tigerwoodKhorns]

Ribbon tweeters sound amazing, but in a very narrow plane. Stand up and they do not sound right. If you will always be seated when listening, they are very nice.

[pzannucci]

Hi Peter,

thanks a lot for chiming in and the link. Unfortunately in it there was no 'final result' postetd. What have been your experiences? And yes, the G-1 raised my curiosity as the G-3 in that Aurum speaker was really quite interesting.

Wolfram

No final result... You are absolutely correct. What may be a final result for me, which was not put them on my k-horns, may not be yours, That outcome was based on my trade-offs.

Now if you are willing to have something similar to a flashlight beam vertical dispersion pattern and figure out a good position so they can mesh in your room with the rest of the horn, you could come to a different conclusion. You will need to figure out how to get an extra 2 or so DB from it especially due to it's dispersion and not reflecting off a bunch of surfaces in the room to raise perceived efficiency. A second Class A amp will do nicely.

The key is the sound. Ultra fast with no residue if crossed correctly. I'm not sure how their AMT drivers are.

I would say buy a pair and play though I can't really endorse that since they are around $400US each. They are also easy to destroy if you don't cross them over correctly. The ribbon is very very fragile and will go out of shape (the zig-zag). Then you tear the driver apart and have some fun replacing the ribbon and centering it in the gap. Nice part is the ribbon is only $14 but not the easiest thing to do.

A different design using something like a KLF-20 or KLF-30 would probably be very nice.

Klipsch should look at an Ultra High End with a similar driver horn loaded.

[dubai2000]

Peter,

thanks for more information. I was hoping to purchase directly from China - cutting out the middleman - but they no longer do that as by now they have a European distributor.....[].

Anyway, time will tell if I am going to give them a try - first I shall build an alternative crossover to my current one (will be Type-A).

Wolfram

[boom3]

As a long-time user of ribbon tweeters, let me add some information. If you want a ribbon to take the place of the K-77, you need a true tweeter, not one (like in the attached picture) designed for a two-way system. Those ribbons are just too big (tall) and as noted have very poor vertical dispersion. A dedicated "ribbon" tweeter will have vertical dispersion no worse than a K-77. However, the horizontal dispersion will be wider than the K-77 at nearly all frequencies. The ribbon's dispersion is so wide that reflections from the flanking walls will be a problem.

The other factor to consider is whether you want a "true" ribbon or a small planar magnetic sold as a "ribbon". The JVC "ribbon" tweeters of the mid 80s that are so good (and I still have several) are actually planar magnetic units. If the tweeter requires a transformer, it's a true ribbon. True ribbons are fairly costly. If you want to try a "ribbon" tweeter with a Klipsch product, try one of the planar magnetic units that sell for $50-100 first. The stock Klipsch crossover will probably give the tweeter adquate protection, but you may need to do some level matching to get the balance right.

[dubai2000]

I admit I have never heard about the JVCs you've mentioned....Can you tell me more about them?

Wolfram

[coolhandjjl]

Aren't Heils ribbons?

[pzannucci]

Aren't Heils ribbons?

A Heil is a pleated mylar membrane, not a true ribbon. Even some ribbons aren't really true ribbons because they are not a foil driver but a kapton or mylar with aluminum conducting strips.

[boom3]

I admit I have never heard about the JVCs you've mentioned....Can you tell me more about them?

Wolfram

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=181604

[dubai2000]

Thanks for the link - it seems they are not efficient enough to go with Khorns though....[].

Wolfram

[boom3]

you could try a different (louder) tap on the autoformer...

[dubai2000]

Well if I see that correctly on the squawker level can be changed and if I were to turn down the mids, the bass would get too loud. Or am I on the wrong track here?

Wolfram

[boom3]

sorry, I should have been looking at the schematic when I wrote that. You're correct, there is no autoformer tap to move for the tweeter. There are some pretty efficient ribbons/pseudo-ribbons out there. The most drastic solution is to go to an active crossover.

I plan to try one of my JVC ribbons with one of my Corns, where the difference in efficiency will be less dramatic than with Khorns. My Corns have the K79 tweeters which seem to be fine, and IMHO, better than the K-77s.