m-dub Posted January 28, 2003 Share Posted January 28, 2003 Hello all. I've been reading the forum for some time now and finally decided to jump in. To make this short, I'm putting a pair of Cornwalls in the wall. My garage is on the back side of the wall I intend to butcher to make these fit, so I have plenty of room. Here's the thing. I'm not putting the actual Cornwall cabinet in the wall. I've bought all the necessary drivers and crossovers, and I want to make my own enclosure for the woofer (K-33). I have the clearance to build a box 22" square, using marine grade 1" plywood, that should give me roughly 4.63 cubic feet. Question: could someone please plug this into a builder program and see how it looks,..and how do I port this? That's where I'm really lost. Will it work at all? And if it's to small an enclosure, could I use polyfill to "trick" the speaker? I used to do that all the time in car audio applications. Anyway, that's it. I thank you in advance for any help on this venture, and will keep all whose interested posted. Take care, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-dub Posted January 28, 2003 Author Share Posted January 28, 2003 INWALL CORNWALL PART II Hoping this may help a little. Here's a pic of the wall (if it shows up) I'm working on here. The 4 holes in the wall are where 2 pair of Klipsch IW250's were. I got the Cornwalls from a crazy uncle (who bought them while in Vietnam), who gave them to his kid. The kid got tossed in jail, so I asked to have them, and he gave them to me. At any rate, I've owned many different Klipsch through the years, and have owned solely Klipsch for the last 10 years, but have never heard the Cornwalls. Needless to say when I plugged them in, I can't listen to the inwalls anymore. There is just no turning back. So the problem is how to get the Cornwalls in the wall. I want to put the woofer in its own enclosure below the chair rail shown in the pic, and the horns above (again, please note, I'm not dissecting these Cornwalls, I have all seperate components from ebay)(These ones are going to be in the kitchen when this project is done). Anyone who can help with the woofer enclosure would get a big "thank you" from me. The driver is a K-33, and I plan on making the enclosure 22" square like I stated in the first post. I need to know how to port or tune this box before I can do any work to the wall. Is it possible at all with the space I have? I'm open to all and any suggestions!!! Thanx again in advance for your time and input.. Take care, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Cornell Posted January 28, 2003 Share Posted January 28, 2003 I see its the no room issues here, nice pool table, what a nice fun room! I think i would actually try to mount them on the wall rather than through the wall! OR i would cut out a big enough hole, box it in, then set the whole cornwall inside them, using braces on the insides, the garage side! I think this would be better than lifting, and mounting the 108 pound speakers at once, also this would keep them whole, no mounting holes! Just an idea Regards Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-dub Posted January 28, 2003 Author Share Posted January 28, 2003 Thanx for the sound advice, and compliment Jim. That was my first idea actually. It is feasible. The reason I opted not to is simply for the "to easy option". I have a real cool idea for the horns, and how that's going to be installed above the chair rail. I wanted to keep the asthetics of that wall in tact versus plugging in a huge black faced speaker. I even thought of painting the grill to match the faux brick design. Either way, I'm dead set on seperating the horns and woofer. Got everything I need to do it,.except, how do I make it work?!?! That's usually the first formula to failure! Someone may come up with something, or I can build the box and play with an adjustable port. We'll see..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted January 28, 2003 Share Posted January 28, 2003 The performance of the bass end of the Cornwall in its ported enclosure is dependent upon the ENTIRE interior volume of the standard Cornwall cabinet. Not only that, the if the dimensions are changed, then the port size ,may also have to be changed...which requires alot of figuring to get correct...either way...22" x 22" won't be enough...because you have a 15" driver to begin with...and this leaves no room for proper porting no matter HOW deep you make the box in order to get the interior volume correct!...IMHO! You could end up with a good sounding speaker doing it this way...but I highly doubt it will sound like a Cornwall in its bottom end. Also...the Cornwall needs to use a corner or a wall to help project its bottom end better...how it will perform as an in-wall mounting is not as easy to predict as it is for doing this kind of thing with a LaScala instead! Because the LaScala is a folded bass horn...and it projects MOST of its bottom end FORWARD...it is a better candidate for this kind of installation than a Cornwall is, since the Cornwall is ported and not horn-loaded in its bottom end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted January 28, 2003 Share Posted January 28, 2003 Builder---I doubt very much that the LaScala basshorn projects the bass forward, the mouth is far too small, in fact some mid horns which are designed for super directivity control have mouths as large as a LaScalas. Arrays of basshorns can project sound forward but only when the combined mouths are very large. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted January 28, 2003 Share Posted January 28, 2003 Tom...I was referring to its directivity...most of what it provides goes FORWARD(and some downward)...but even the LaScala performs better when it has a room corner...remember...the original intended use for the LaScala was outside on a flatbed trailer...and for what it is...it performs quite well in those applications. One of my favorite things to do with them when I lived in a small frame house on a piered footing out in the boonies was to put a pair on the ground, up against the back wall of the house outside...facing to the back yard...the combination of the open underneath of the house, and the house's rear wall...with the thin tree line actross the barbed-wire fince delineating the back yard(about 60 yards or so from the rear of the house) allowed the LaScalas to really perform well considering they were outside...and my neighbors over a mile behind the house really enjoyed sitting in their back yards and listening to them...LOL!...just being pushed by 32 watts per channel, too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted January 28, 2003 Share Posted January 28, 2003 Builder---Yeah, I know you were talking about directivity. You know, I read somewhere that the whole story about the LaScalas being designed for Winthrop Rockerfeller's campaign is just a myth (a euphemism for bullsh*t). I gotta look that up, maybe it was PWK's interview with Bruce Edgar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted January 28, 2003 Share Posted January 28, 2003 Well, Tom...from what I always heard...Rockefeller called up PWK and told him his needs...and PWK sent Gillum(I think)to the Hope movie theater to measure an old RCA theater folded-horn sitting behind the screen there(akin to the MWM of the MCM1900 system...which was also kind of modeled on that old horn to even greater extent!)...and when Gillum got back with dimensions and sketches...they started in on the project...ending up with LaScalas(but not configured like the LaScalas NOW)! The ones they ended up with for Winthrop Rockefeller had 12" woofers firing the bass bin, the bass bin was rotated 90 degrees compared to current configuration, and the top end was just a motorboard for the mid horn and tweeter...not a complete housing...continued development of the speaker ended up with the configuration as seen for most of its life in production(with a few exceptions, of course). This story was related to me by Moers, with PWK working in the backround in the lab...and PWK never uttered a word to dispute it. The same story was related by Portus Gilley...who was working there at the time it was developed(he passed away while I worked there, and was just one of two employees in the PLANT who had Klipsch stock...which was given out to employees in lieu of complete weekly wages at one point prior to the early 1960's). So, I have no reason to doubt it. Winthrop Rockefeller first ran for governor in 1964...against long-time incumbent Orville Faubus(I believe this was when he requested PWK build some speakers for him)...and lost...but won on his second attempt...sometime around 1966 and he served two terms..Arkansas had two-year terms for governor back in those days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-dub Posted January 28, 2003 Author Share Posted January 28, 2003 Well, i'm glad I didn't decide to start cutting drywall then. There must be a way to do this. I realize it's asking alot to try and plug in different parameters and keep plugging away at a box program until it works. I was hoping someone else had tried there hand it, and I could ride on someone elses shoulders in this capacity. What to do now? HDBRbuilder,....I appreciate your expertise in this field, thanx for responding. Let me ask you something. What size do you "think" would be optimal if the K-33 were to be put in its own enclosure? To be done right, am I really looking at stuffing the whole Cornwall,..in the wall? Like eating a McD's cheesburger in one bite (I've sen it done)! I haven't given up on the idea yet,..but I'm getting closer to doing just that, as no one has stepped up and said they did it and it worked. Another great idea getting shot down in flames,..like my roof mounted solar swimming pool heater idea! Alas! Any input on this would be awesome. HDBRbuilder,..Love to hear from you again on this. Surely someone must have tried something like this........Anyone? Thanx again in advance...got to go back to work for a while Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-dub Posted January 28, 2003 Author Share Posted January 28, 2003 Well, i'm glad I didn't decide to start cutting drywall then. There must be a way to do this. I realize it's asking alot to try and plug in different parameters and keep plugging away at a box program until it works. I was hoping someone else had tried there hand it, and I could ride on someone elses shoulders in this capacity. What to do now? HDBRbuilder,....I appreciate your expertise in this field, thanx for responding. Let me ask you something. What size do you "think" would be optimal if the K-33 were to be put in its own enclosure? To be done right, am I really looking at stuffing the whole Cornwall,..in the wall? Like eating a McD's cheesburger in one bite (I've sen it done)! I haven't given up on the idea yet,..but I'm getting closer to doing just that, as no one has stepped up and said they did it and it worked. Another great idea getting shot down in flames,..like my roof mounted solar swimming pool heater idea! Alas! Any input on this would be awesome. HDBRbuilder,..Love to hear from you again on this. Surely someone must have tried something like this........Anyone? Thanx again in advance...got to go back to work for a while Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-dub Posted January 28, 2003 Author Share Posted January 28, 2003 Well, i'm glad I didn't decide to start cutting drywall then. There must be a way to do this. I realize it's asking alot to try and plug in different parameters and keep plugging away at a box program until it works. I was hoping someone else had tried there hand it, and I could ride on someone elses shoulders in this capacity. What to do now? HDBRbuilder,....I appreciate your expertise in this field, thanx for responding. Let me ask you something. What size do you "think" would be optimal if the K-33 were to be put in its own enclosure? To be done right, am I really looking at stuffing the whole Cornwall,..in the wall? Like eating a McD's cheesburger in one bite (I've sen it done)! I haven't given up on the idea yet,..but I'm getting closer to doing just that, as no one has stepped up and said they did it and it worked. Another great idea getting shot down in flames,..like my roof mounted solar swimming pool heater idea! Alas! Any input on this would be awesome. HDBRbuilder,..Love to hear from you again on this. Surely someone must have tried something like this........Anyone? Thanx again in advance...got to go back to work for a while Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-dub Posted January 28, 2003 Author Share Posted January 28, 2003 OOOOPS,..I posted twice! And now 3x.....sorry, new guy and slow computer thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-dub Posted January 29, 2003 Author Share Posted January 29, 2003 I give up. I think HADBR was right, and the answer to this is try something different. I still would like to have given it a shot and heard the results, but who has time for that?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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