formica Posted April 2, 2003 Share Posted April 2, 2003 I had originally considered going with an SVS sub to keep up with my Klipsch because many people here are using similar combinations with pretty good success... but after reading on HTF and here about the good results that could be had with a DIY sub I reconsidered. I am going the DIY route and I have ordered a 700W JBL (QSC) amp as well as a Stryke AV15 driver, which I will probably put in a 6ft3 enclosure tuned to about 20Hz. One thing I haven't seen much of, is head to head comparisons of commercial subs versus DIY ones. I'm in the Montreal region and I was wondering if anyone would be interested in setting up a shoot out? I should have the sub ready this summer after the driver ships... and I will do a series of comparisons to my existing Energy 12... but it would be nice to see real world numbers compared to higher end subs which may (or may not) out-perform the DIY one. Subs like the HGS Velodyne, SVS, Paradigm Servo15, etc... Anyone interested? Rob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin B Posted April 2, 2003 Share Posted April 2, 2003 Out of those companies, besides the SVS B4+ (but for it's cost you could build a sub with multiple AV15 drivers that will match or beat it), I'd bet money only the soon to be released B2+ will be able to compete with a properly built vented AV15. The shoot outs have been done on other forums and it ends up being pretty consistent. DIY results in the most sub for the money, for the most part by a very large margin. The only time commercial subs can close the gap is if size is also a major consideration (but even then DIY will still be cheaper, just not as much). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted April 2, 2003 Share Posted April 2, 2003 Make sure you take LOTs of pics and post them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabulousfrankie Posted April 7, 2003 Share Posted April 7, 2003 Formica, I just ordered 2 AV-15's a few minutes ago. When they come, I'll give my thoughts on how they compare to my single Ultra and other subs I've owned. Won't really be a fair comparison due to the huge increase in cone area and cabinet volume(7ft^3 w/18hz tune). I saw your posts about the JBL amps at HTF, did you ever get yours? I really want to get some because of how cheap they are but I'm afraid of not being able to modify them for 120v. If you've done it already, how complicated was the process? I'm thinking of a MPC200(700w @ 4ohms bridged) for each sub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted April 7, 2003 Author Share Posted April 7, 2003 We will end up with very similar subs with the exception that I will have just one... AV15 in 6ft3 @ ±20Hz with a MPC200 ... It reassures me that you are aiming to outperform your Ultra with a similar setup rather than just buying a second SVS.... My Energy12 is an easy target... but I didn't want to regret not going with SVS in the long run. I look forward to reading your comparison, even if it won't be for awhile. One of the great parts on the JBL deal is that it includes the shipping as well... but that is also why I haven't received mine yet as I had it sent to a helpful friend in the US, and then sent to me, doubling my shipping time. As you may have noticed on HTF, Bill F. has received his MPC300 and says it really a simple DIY project. The 300 is actually a more complex conversion than the MPC200 as there is a fuse and a thermistor to be replaced which there ISN'T in the smaller 200. As for the rest he says: "The rest of the conversion looks dead simple: New power cord, move a few friction connectors to different terminals on the power PCB" That is it... you can check out my info page I posted at: http://www3.sympatico.ca/bonaz/JBL/JBL-MPC-230V-120V.htm when I do get mine, I'll post up some pictures as well... later... Rob. PS: You really got that AV15 preorder in last minute... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabulousfrankie Posted April 7, 2003 Share Posted April 7, 2003 Thanks for the info. I almost forgot about placing my order. My fiancee called me and asked if I ordered those subs I was talking about. That was at 11:55PM. It really didn't matter in the end because I IM'd John J. and he said the preorder was being extended because he hasn't updated the website. DIY is great. With what I'm selling my Ultra/Samson for, I'm able to vastly outperform it, and the Ultra is no slouch. It took me a long time to make up my mind because I didn't know whether I wanted a single Tumult or dual AV-15's. I decided to go with AV15's because I'd have higher output for less money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted April 8, 2003 Author Share Posted April 8, 2003 I think you made a good choice... I agree that the pair of AV15 will give you similar (or slightly more?) output than the single Tumult at a fraction of the cost and with less power... the only drawback is the larger box for the pair versus the compact one. Will you keep the SVS until after your new sub is complete? I think I'll keep my existing Energy for future use as it doesn't have a large resale value ... and A-B comparisons are very interesting... Still hoping someone in Montreal with a killer sub will take me up as well... I already can't wait... I noticed you are using a BFD DSP1124P in your subwoofer setup... did you set your RF-3 as "large" seeing they play down to 37Hz, or did you cross them over (at 60Hz, 80Hz, etc) into the subwoofer and flatten it with the BFD? I'm just curious as I have a room peak around 45Hz and if I were to EQ only my sub, wouldn't this peak remain since it's fed to both the sub and my mains? (I use them at the large setting as they VERY large ) later... Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabulousfrankie Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Rob, The dual AV-15's can displace more air than a single Tumult. Two AV-15's(w/23mm Xmax) displaces 7.4L of air. Around $350 shipped One Tumult(w/34mm Xmax) diplaces 5.1 L of air. $499 shipped While conversing with John Janowitz, he said he likes to be conservative with his numbers and the AV-15's are capable of around 28mm linear excursion. If we use this number: Two AV-15's(w/28mm Xmax) displaces 9L of air The Tumult is slightly less sensitive than the AV-15's as well. The big advantagd the Tumult has is the XBL motor. I figured with two AV-15's in a my small room wouldn't work very hard so distortion would be low enough it wouldn't make a big difference. Don't know if this is true, it just seems logical to me. Unfortunately, I won't have my SVS, someone is buying it this Monday. I'll give my subjective review on it but I wish I could do some objective testing with my SPL meter. I'll will compare it to what ever sub I can get a hold of. Probably my brother's diy sub using the original driver. I may also have another DIY sub cooked up by then to compare it too as well. With my RF-3II's I have them set to small, everything sounds cleaner when they are relieved of bass duties. I tried it that way but liked the result with the x-over set higher. Keep in mind that a x-over point(say 40hz) is not a brick wall, meaning your sub will play frequencies above that. As the frequency goes higher the level at which it plays is reduced. So if you want to run them this way, you'll still be able eq that 45hz peak. I set my x-over to 80hz but eq'd up to 120hz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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