DrWho Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 putting it blunty, mackie sucks. however, they've got really nice studio monitors. if you're looking for a nice board, check out allen and heath (they're the same price range too). (i may sound harsh, but i've been mixing with mackie for 8 years and so i've gotten to know their boards really well...they're so limiting and harsh) i've heard a lot of good things about the event studio monitors and they're not too expensive. i've even mixed and done some recording with them and they were decent. (that's if u like a really really dry sound...but i guess it's more revealing that way). and while im on my soapbox (hehe)...i don't like the JBL pro speakers either! they've got this wierd sound to their low end, dunno how to describe it, but i can pick out jbl speakers wherever i go just by their sound. i very much prefer the klipsch pro line...much better low end. (i do have to say jbl has warmer mids though). ok, im off my soapbox...in the end, all that matters is how it sounds to you, so try out some studio monitors and find which ones sound best...you're not gonna be able to mix well if u can't get it to sound right first (and the speakers are where your sound is coming out in the end!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 ---------------- On 7/4/2003 1:02:15 PM DrWho wrote: putting it blunty, mackie sucks. however, they've got really nice studio monitors. if you're looking for a nice board, check out allen and heath (they're the same price range too). ---------------- Well, you're entitled to your opinion about Mackie, but I hardly can comprehend where you see Allen and Heath in the "same price range" The Allen and Heath (which we plan to upgrade to) version of the Mackie 24VLZ-Pro (which we currently use) is double the price tag. 24 channel Allen&Heath GL2200 boards (A&H's equivalent to the VLZ-Pro line) start at $2000. The VLZ-Pro line (even before the recent move to China) start at $800. Big price difference. Not saying that the A&H's aren't worth the money, but they're definitely not in the same price range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 5, 2003 Share Posted July 5, 2003 i stand corrected --------------------------------------- when we "upgraded" our system the first time...we traded two old allen and heath mixers + all our reel to reel recording stuffs for the mackie 32*8 + new amps + system repairs (so we got ripped off basically, lol) our recent upgrade traded the 32*8 for the GL3300 + $8k + system repairs so basically, i didn't figure how much of the $8k went towards the board...cuz we got a ton of rewiring done and lots of other stuff. anyways, i didn't mean to bash mackie that hard either, cuz we still use the 24VLZ-Pro for our touring system and it sounds fine. (except we bought it a couple years ago for a lot more right when it came out)...and it's built like a tank, been dropped plenty of times and has even gone to the beach and gotten a bit wet (and sandy)!!! all that to say, i wasn't aware of the price difference and i don't wanna say mackie totally sucks (even though i did say that, lol)...im still in shock from the sound of the GL3300 and i would say the price difference is a lot less than the increase in quality. --------------------------------------- anyways, this is about studio monitors right? were u planning on using a 2 channel system or 2.1? here's a link from an article from extremetech.com that talks about setting up a digital audio workstation (a high end and a price-valued system): Build It Digital Audio Workstation, Part II they recommend the Event Audio TR5-N for $300 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natan Posted July 5, 2003 Share Posted July 5, 2003 I'm DBvader's friend that he mentioned. Thanks for all your responses, they are helping me out. Let me make a few clarifications: - The reason I want a pair of Studio Monitors is because I want a great stereo audio system. I'm not doing studio work with these, I just want a superb listening system. I'm not extremely impressed with the 2.1 PC set offerings, and I'm willing to spend more money to get a nicer system. I could get ProMedia 5.1's or whatever, but getting more than a stereo system would be a waste of my money and space (as far as I know). - I'm driving them via an iBook audio out, since that's the only computer I'll have at school. That said, it might be worth my investing in a USB > digi out if any of the monitors I could afford would have digi in (I know that some do). - I don't know if I want a stereo or a 2.1 system. I was under the impression that the bass response of most monitors is usually sufficient for my purposes, but maybe I'm mistaken. I've heard the most hype about Event monitors these days. I have a number of friends who have 20/20's and love them. I can't really afford to get them and an amp. Has anyone here heard the TR5-N? I don't think that my local Guitar Center has them for sale, at least the guy at their proaudio department claimed they didn't - so I'm not sure where I could hear them in person. But based on the fame of their brand, and their price, it sounds like they might be the ones to pursue further. Again, thanks for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted July 5, 2003 Share Posted July 5, 2003 OK, if you want a superb listening system, don't buy studio monitors. Buy a hifi system. You will not get good sounding powered studio monitors for $500. You will get cheap ones, just like you will get cheap hifi for $500. There's no avoiding it. You get what you pay for. "superb" listening systems, whether hifi or monitoring, cost money. You can get a "decent" listening system in your price range. You want a solid listening system for <$500? Sony STR-DE185 stereo receiver - $150 Klipsch SB-3's - $200 a pair. Bang. There's your solid listening system. Much better than any powered monitors you'll get for that price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBB Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 DOH!!! Shucks! Does this mean you wont be looking at a Solid State Logic SL 9000 J or a Neve 88R console in the near future? Just kidding. I guess I was on the wrong track, so to speak. He He He Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 wow...studio monitors for listening enjoyment is like a a big no-no! you've got "hifi" speakers (as griff calls em) and then studio monitors...the purpose of hifi stuff is to make it sound good, like give it a warm rich sound. studio monitors are always dry and are built to try and make it sound bad. if you're listening for enjoyment, you might find yourself quickly frustrated. most recording studios i've seen have a set of studio monitors, two sets of car speakers (good and bad), and a pair of nice "hifi" speakers (ie, khorns or rf7's or something similar...only cuz this is a klipsch site ), and then if the studio is setup for surround, there'd be another set of surround sound speakers. and don't forget a pair of headphones. all that to say, the ppl making your music are trying to get it to sound good on systems that make it sound bad, so that it sounds that much better with a speaker built to make it sound better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible Nectar Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 "wow...studio monitors for listening enjoyment is like a a big no-no! you've got "hifi" speakers (as griff calls em) and then studio monitors...the purpose of hifi stuff is to make it sound good, like give it a warm rich sound. studio monitors are always dry and are built to try and make it sound bad. if you're listening for enjoyment, you might find yourself quickly frustrated." Not if you have a pair of JBL L200s.....or better yet, a pair of JBL L300s......of course, those will cost more than the $500 budget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invidiosulus Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 The L series JBL's were the home equivalent of the studio series. I have a pair of L46's, my little brother has a pair of L56's and my dad has some 4311's which are the real studio speakers. Peace, Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natan Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 ---------------- On 7/7/2003 1:57:32 PM DrWho wrote: wow...studio monitors for listening enjoyment is like a a big no-no! you've got "hifi" speakers (as griff calls em) and then studio monitors...the purpose of hifi stuff is to make it sound good, like give it a warm rich sound. studio monitors are always dry and are built to try and make it sound bad. if you're listening for enjoyment, you might find yourself quickly frustrated. most recording studios i've seen have a set of studio monitors, two sets of car speakers (good and bad), and a pair of nice "hifi" speakers (ie, khorns or rf7's or something similar...only cuz this is a klipsch site ), and then if the studio is setup for surround, there'd be another set of surround sound speakers. and don't forget a pair of headphones. all that to say, the ppl making your music are trying to get it to sound good on systems that make it sound bad, so that it sounds that much better with a speaker built to make it sound better. ---------------- On that note, is there any hifi setup in particular that you recommend I consider? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelShaffer Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 SB-3's are more than $200 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natan Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 ---------------- On 7/7/2003 3:08:43 PM MichaelShaffer wrote: SB-3's are more than $200 ---------------- Yeah, here are the bookshelves that I'll check out.. SB-1's = $170/pair SB-2's = $240/pair SB-3's = $310/pair RB-15's = $200/pair RB-25's = $265/pair RB-35's = $400/pair Any suggested cheap receivers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelShaffer Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 The TX-8511 is only $210 from the Onkyo website with the extended warranty. If you want a receiver with a subwoofer preout, Harmon Kardon has some for about the same price. I'm using the TX-8511 with the RB-35s (got them from sounddistributors.com for $419) and it sounds great. I may get rid or the receiver and get one with a subwoofer output though since I like my bass. Here are a some pictures of my setup http://www.geocities.com/divx_edu/speakers.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 ---------------- On 7/7/2003 4:16:18 PM natan wrote: Yeah, here are the bookshelves that I'll check out.. SB-1's = $170/pair SB-2's = $240/pair SB-3's = $310/pair RB-15's = $200/pair RB-25's = $265/pair RB-35's = $400/pair Any suggested cheap receivers? ---------------- That's why I pointed to the Sony STR-DE185. $150 for a solid 100wpc stereo amp (designed by Denon, as I understand) - plenty for your purposes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 i'd go with griff on this one....i've listened to a decent pair of noname speakers powered by the sony he's suggesting and it had a very clean sound...well until i blew it up that is (no worries...i was building my own speakers from scratch and shorted the output from the amp and that's how it blew). as far as speakers, i really have no idea. i'd prob go with griff again and buy the highest level u can afford...just remember that ur gonna have to live with them and if u go with a better speaker, there's a better chance of still using them when u get outta college i know it'd cost a lot more, but i would see if u couldn't find a good deal on a pair of rf-3's to use with that sony amp...that would be killer for a pc stereo setup! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBB Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 I like to use the Weight method when it comes to anything with amplifiers. For example: Sony STR-DE185 100Wx2, Weight: 15.4 pounds (WxHxD): 17 X 5.7 X 11.8 Harman Kardon HK 3375, 75Wx2, Weight: 24.6 lb (WxHxD): 17.4" x 6.1x 16.3" Onkyo TX8211 50Wx2 Stereo, Weight: 18.3 lbs (WxHxD): 17 1/8 x 5 7/8 x 12 11/16 The wattage ratings these manufacturers assign to their products are all over the place. My rule of thumb: Never buy a receiver that can be grabbed quickly with one hand. I learned a long time ago that there is a reason for everything. Have you ever heard anyone say It sounds funny when I turn the volume up ? He He He He Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 BBB: Of course you'll do better with an HK or Onkyo stereo amp. Problem is, this guy really doesn't have the budget for either of those units - not if he wants to get any kind of decent speakers for it. I figure, we cheap out a little bit on the amp and go for better speakers - once he's out of college, he'll want to move up to a surround system - so what did he gain by purchasing a more expensive stereo receiver? If he buys better speakers, he'll still be able to use them in a surround package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natan Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 ---------------- On 7/8/2003 2:48:05 PM Griffinator wrote: BBB: Of course you'll do better with an HK or Onkyo stereo amp. Problem is, this guy really doesn't have the budget for either of those units - not if he wants to get any kind of decent speakers for it. I figure, we cheap out a little bit on the amp and go for better speakers - once he's out of college, he'll want to move up to a surround system - so what did he gain by purchasing a more expensive stereo receiver? If he buys better speakers, he'll still be able to use them in a surround package. ---------------- Actually, I don't know if that's the case. I'd much, much rather spend money on a stereo system than a surround system, and I don't know if I'll ever want to upgrade to a surround system, unless the music industry changes and starts releasing lots of music in surround format - which I guess is possible. Watching movies with a surround system isn't nearly as important to me. Next weekend DBvader is planning on coming up to LA and we'll do some listening tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelShaffer Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 I just wanted to add about the RB-35s. I've noticed that if I leave them on my desk, then it's easier to hear the midrange (since they're pretty directional) but they don't translate as much bass to the room. If I put them on the floor they make a lot more bass but it's hard to hear the horns since they're at my feet. So I guess what I'm saying is, if you want to feel the bass and midrange you may need a subwoofer. Also if you audition them you might want to try them on the floor as well as on stands to hear the difference. I guess this is pretty obvious to audiophiles but I just thought I would share it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 are floorstanders an option, or does it gotta be bookshelf? the sb-2 is $325 at Bestbuy and has great specs: FREQUENCY RESPONSE: 35Hz-20kHz±3dB SENSITIVITY: 96dB @ 1watt/1meter POWER HANDLING: 100 watts maximum continuous (400 watts peak) or you can go reference and get the RF3 (which has similar specs, but costs more). the deal with floorstanders is they have plenty of bass (can't imagine buying a sub for them unless u spend over a thousand dollars for it). the problem with floorstanders is they take up more room (but that's not to say u can't get creative and lay a board across the top of them and use that as a desk! or even bed!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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