111db Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 Hi, Gang. I have a friend who has asked me to help him spec a system for his small living room. He LOVES my '86 Fortes and wants something that sounds similar, but his room just won't allow floorstanders or stand-mounted. Heresys are probably too big also, or I'd suggest a pair of those and a sub. I'm also doubtful that cabs with a rear port or passive radiator will work because he really needs to mount them against a wall. What should he get? I'm looking for replies from people familiar with the Forte sound who know whereof they speak. BTW, he mostly listens to rock, folk/ethnic, and jazz, and he particularly wants something that does kick-snare-bass with the snap and authority of the Fortes, without sacrificing good vocals. Thanks! Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 IMHO, there is nothing that equals the sound of the Forte. Yes, other Klipsch speakers also sound great, but nothing sounds the same. And, with the restrictions you've imposed, it sounds like a bookshelf speaker out of the new Reference series is the only Klipsch offering - front ported, small, etc... But even with a sub, I don't believe he'll get anything that sounds like a Forte. Doug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j-malotky Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 I have to agree with Doug. You are not going to find any modern Klipsch speaker to match your Fortes. Not in the Reference line or smaller. The closest would be the Heresy 2, but will lack the low end so you would need to add a subwoofer. Other than that, you will need to go to the larger LaScalla or Belle. I would look at Ebay for a used set of Fortes in your area. Other models to consider used are Chorus (the Forte's big brother) and the Quartet, the Forte's little brother, but that will be smaller sounding than the Forte. Where are you located you may find somebody here with a set to sell. JM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddc Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 What about pairing the new RB-75's with a meaty subwoofer? Has anyone heard them or found a review anywhere? Do they meet the old klipsch standard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frzninvt Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 You are not out of options just yet. KG-1's would fit the bill with the Forte's they are the only bookshelf speaker from the line that are sealed and not ported and would work perfectly with the Forte's. They can also be found in finishes that would match the Forte's as well. I would suggest a KG 2.2V or 2.5V for a center channel. They can be found fairly regularly on eBay and other audio sites. With them and the Forte's in place you would have a sweet setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reel 2 reel Posted July 7, 2003 Share Posted July 7, 2003 ya beat me to it....definitly Kg1s' small but wonderful sound I thought about a pair in my van.......gc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
111db Posted July 8, 2003 Author Share Posted July 8, 2003 Thanks for the suggestions. Some of you didn't read my question very closely (shakes finger); I'm not trying to add smaller speakers to my Forte system, but trying to spec a compact system with as much Forte magic as possible for my friend's tiny living room. I'll definitely look into the KG1 and subwoofer, though if I recall correctly the KG1 is relatively inefficient at 90dB; and I tend, right or wrong, to associate slam with efficiency. OTOH, how much slam is possible in a small room with very short delay times before the reflections take over? (that's rhetorical unless someone cares to comment) BTW, I'm also looking at some Adire HE8.1's with a sub or HE10.1's, the advantage being that as kits he would have the chance to shape and finish the cabs to suit his room provided he retains the proper box volume. But he has that Ol' Time Klipsch Religion thanks to my Fortes so any other brand will be a hard sell. Hmmm. Maybe he should buy some old beat-up Heresys and make new slimline cabs for them, or build them into old-style console cabs with legs, that can double as end tables. G'day! Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 Don - Yes, I noticed that, too. But, how small a room are we talking about here? And, can they adjust themselves to having less room for other stuff and more room for those Klipsch speakers? The Quartet is similar to the Forte, and is a bit smaller. Likewise, the KG-4 is smaller than the Forte. Doesn't have quite the same sound, of course, but a great "little" speaker in its own right with very strong bass (only a 2-way design, though). Doug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reel 2 reel Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 dont underestimate the Kg-1s....also are you looking for equipment to go with the speakers??? ....just want to know before we start rattling off a bunch of models of amps and scorce components!!.....gc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strabo Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 Never mind. I was confused, Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j-malotky Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Unfortunately this is too tall of an order. There is no way you are going to get a small Klipsh speaker to sound like a Forte. If you need something smaller than a Forte, the only options are Quartet and Heresy. The Quartet is the better choise, the Heresy would need a subwoofer added to sound like a Forte. Reading these recomendations - I don't think most of you guys making recomendations have ever heard a Forte. The Forte is one of the best speakers EVER built by Klipsch. A definete top 10 of all time Klipsch home speaker. And probably the best choise for poeple with small listening rooms. Im not bashing the smaller Klipsch speakers, I own many sets myself in various rooms of my home. But there is a reason I have a near mint set of Fortes sitting in my storage room! Im sorry, but your Fortes are just too big of shoes to fill with smaller Klipsch speakers. What you need to ask is what you are willing to give up going to the smaller speakers. JM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
111db Posted July 9, 2003 Author Share Posted July 9, 2003 Thanks again for the responses. To clarify the room size, I recall it as being at most 12x12, with a walkway on the left from the front door (rear wall left corner) to a hallway (front wall left corner. Sofa, 2 chairs, a few cabinets. As suggested, he MIGHT be amenable to something as large as Choruses but he's married so that's not likely to work from a WAF standpoint. I should look at his room again and see if some slim floorstanders would work, like RF-3. KG4 is a good suggestion though just a bit big, and with a rear passive they cannot be mounted against a wall. KG2 looks like a good fit except for same rear passive problem (they actually go lower than KG4, I've seen the curves, but only 90.5 dB). I will have to find some KG1 to audition. I'm in Fort Collins, Colorado. Anyone nearby listening in who has a pair I can check out? G'day! Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddc Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 I think you should give a play to the new RB-75. I know this group is all about heritage (I happen to have the forte's myself). But it might be that your friend likes the klipsch sound (not just the forte sound). For example, there was a review posted here not too long ago from Vacume Tube Valley magazine issue 19 reviewing the RF-7 and it compared extremely favorably to the Khorn. The RB-75 has the front port and the size you need. And I'd bet it has a pretty good sound. Personally, I'm dying to find an objective review. Have your buddy bring home a pair on trial and give us a report! I'll bet he keeps them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
111db Posted July 30, 2003 Author Share Posted July 30, 2003 Thanks for the suggestion, Todd. Sorry about the delayed response. I am actually getting some "professional" help on this question now. At a trade show a few weeks ago (I work in the music biz) I was introduced to a former Klipsch employee, I believe a one-time manager of Klipsch Pro's sales and marketing. He is very savvy technically. We hit it off right away and may actually do some audio projects together. He is suggesting some of the professional cabs for my friend, a possibility I had not previously considered. He particularly mentioned a flyable 8" 2-way (KP-102)and a commercial sub (KP-115SW). He is also sending me some alternative-material (aluminum, titanium) diaphragms for my Fortes for experimentation (grinning fiendishly as I dodge envious daggers). In reply to another posted question, no I'm not particularly interested in electronics suggestions, though if you have a really high bang-for-buck recommendation please go ahead and make it. I feel that the electronics are not nearly as important as the speakers if a little care is taken in selection. I myself am running a cheap 45wpc Onkyo HT receiver with very good results. Don ---------------- On 7/9/2003 5:36:03 PM toddc wrote: I think you should give a play to the new RB-75. (snip) ---------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dflip Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I feel that the electronics are not nearly as important as the speakers if a little care is taken in selection. --------------- Many on this forum, including myself would disagree strongly with you on this statement. The right electronics make a huge difference to the quality of the sound. At high db's the horns can scream at you on some/many solid state amps, preamps or receivers. That is why many are using tube amps to get the most out of their Klipsch speakers. As for the Fortes, a friend has a pair and they impressed me for the past 12 or so years. He uses top end SS equipment and they produce lots of punch and a nice midrange. Try going to the Quartets if you are looking for something smaller. A smaller woofer, but close to the wall would produce additional punch, although most speakers benefit from some distance from the wall, 18-24" to improve the soundstage. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
111db Posted August 1, 2003 Author Share Posted August 1, 2003 ---------------- On 7/30/2003 7:27:19 PM Dflip wrote: --------------- Many on this forum, including myself would disagree strongly with you on this statement. The right electronics make a huge difference to the quality of the sound. At high db's the horns can scream at you on some/many solid state amps, preamps or receivers. That is why many are using tube amps to get the most out of their Klipsch speakers. Don ---------------- Don, I'm trying to believe what you assert, it's just that logic (or more likely ignorance) gets in my way. I hear the same thing about speaker cables all the time, and I think that's mostly a bunch of snake oil, as do people like Paul Dunlavy. Amps have a lot more room for variation or error than speaker cables do, but I wish someone could propose some kind of measurement method other than the subjective human ear to differentiate between amps. Slew rate? Square wave response? Damping factor? THD? IM? TIM, power bandwidth issues, frequency response anomalies? If all these nasties are quite low, even identical between amps, why do the amps sound so different? Is 70vdc from a toroidal transformer different from 70vdc from a conventional transformer? What unnamed and thus far unmeasurable property is responsible for making amp A sound harsh at high frequencies when driving a horn to high levels, whereas amp B does not do so? A crucial question, because until it can be detected and measured, designers are shooting in the dark in trying to correct it. And can these unmeasurable differences affect the sound more than a sharp -8dB notch at 6kHz from driver alignment problems at a crossover point? If harshness at high output levels is a horn-plus-some-solid-state-amps characteristic, does the horn somehow KNOW what kind of amp is driving it, even if the waveforms are identical? Sorry about the near-rant. You just happened to bring up a point of bewilderment for me. I want an explanation for everything. And (not that you are doing this) I get skeptical when audio gear gets the wine critic treatment: "It's a sunny and winsome little interconnect, with a generous helping of mellow June evenings, green at first then bending toward yellow, dry in the ear canal but slightly dampish at the eardrum. Placing Czech leaded glass paperweights on it at 2.83cm intervals failed to correct the dampness to my full satisfaction. Still, a best buy at the price." I don't doubt that tube amps sound different, and maybe better, at least for some program material. But if the objective is to hear the music as it was recorded, does a tube amp do that and solid state probably not? Or does a tube amp make it sound BETTER than the recording? (Many recordings NEED this!) Or does a tube amp correct some negative characteristics of horns so that they can sound more like the original recording? Or is it something that just can't be verbalized? And will my friend be unable to really enjoy his music collection unless he picks just exactly the right amp? Please enlighten me. Or ignore me; I won't take offense if you do. Cordially, (also) Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
111db Posted December 22, 2003 Author Share Posted December 22, 2003 Okay, some closure on this thread at last! My buddy bought some like-new oak KG-3.2's from another buddy of mine. We had a chance to audition them extensively in his LR prior to purchase. I must say I was quite favorably impressed. The room was much smaller than my LR, and I did not have my Fortes there for a direct comparison, but I definitely noticed the strong family resemblance. The midrange was a little more forward than the Fortes (not as forward as KG-4's), the bass not QUITE as clean and deep, the imaging not as precise (small room reflections). Otherwise a really close match at the level required to saturate his small LR and risk a noise complaint from the next door neighbors (he does NOT live in an attached dwelling!). The greatest surprise for me was a CD of a Guilmant (sp?) pipe organ concerto that I was sure would leave the KG-3.2's gasping trying to reproduce the pedal notes blooming forth in cavernous Liverpool Cathedral. Not so! The result was quite exhilarating, perhaps because it was so unexpected. I conclude that I may one day be searching out a pair of these for rear channels to go with my Fortes, though I imagine Heresy II's would be an even closer timbre match. Or perhaps mains for the TV room? They have to be one of the best speaker bargains around. Amazing bass depth and loudness for 8" drivers! Count me impressed, and my buddy and his wife very pleased indeed. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 Klipsch has built many impressive speakers over the years. Tube amps make many of them tolerable. Just my opinion. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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