cjgeraci Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 I recently purchased a Harmon Kardon AVR 525 to replace my Yamaha 1300 (moved upstairs) due to the warmer sound with my Klipschs. I love the new receiver with one exception. The level of the sub output is noticeably lower coming out of the HK as opposed to the Yamaha (at the similar volume levels of the other speakers). This means that I have to turn the LFE setting up to +10 db on the HK (and the gains on the subs up high), and there is still not the impressive sub performance at lower or higher volume levels, as compared to the Yamaha. I have hooked both subs up individually (SVS and HSU) with both receivers and have double-checked with my ears and my meter. Same results. Any thoughts or similar experiences? Are there any recommended external devices to boost the LFE signal (relatively inexpensively or maybe more)? I have a call out to HK and will talk to the SVS crew this afternoon. Any and all responses appreciated. HK AVR 525 Mains: RF3II Center: RC35 Surrounds: RS35 Rear: KLF C7 SVS 20-39PCi HSU VTF-2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Do you have the receiver setup to say Sub-Yes? Are the main speakers set to Small or Large? Are you sending bass to both the sub and the mains or to the sub only? I know these are basic questions, but... DD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted September 9, 2003 Author Share Posted September 9, 2003 ---------------- On 9/9/2003 11:19:14 AM dougdrake wrote: Do you have the receiver setup to say Sub-Yes? Are the main speakers set to Small or Large? Are you sending bass to both the sub and the mains or to the sub only? I know these are basic questions, but... DD ---------------- The receiver is setup to sub-yes; the mains are set to small; and bass is going to the sub only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danechristian Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 check your cables for possible defects. possible solution is use a y adapter to split the signal then use another 2 y adapters to connect your 2 subs using their L and R connection at the back of the sub. that away u can add more dB hope this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabulousfrankie Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 I'm using a HK 325 and I have no such problem. With a Pci sub, you shouldn't need anything to boost the signal going to the sub. If you've set the sub like you said, it sounds like something is defective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAiN5 (banned ) Posted September 11, 2003 Share Posted September 11, 2003 Sorry to go off-topic but, cjgeraci, could you give some more "information" regarding the Harman Kardon AVR 525? Did you also try Denon A/V receivers? The reason why I am asking this is because I am trying to decide between the Harman Karond AVR 525 and the Denon AVR-3803, but the problem is that I cannot audition them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted September 11, 2003 Author Share Posted September 11, 2003 I would be happy to. I auditioned both the H/K AVR-525 and the Denon 3803 with various sets of Klipsch speakers. To me, the H/K is warmer (and more robust) sounding than the Denon with Klipschs, but that is my ear. There are a number of Denon owners on this site who are quite happy with the Denon/Klipsch combo, and I will say, Denon would have been a great second choice. (Anything to remove the earbleed of my Yamaha - again ears differ). There is a power difference between the two since the H/K is rated at 70 X 7 and the Denon is rated at 110 X 7 (and both manufacturers tend to realistically rate their amps). To me, the power difference does not matter much because even though I like to play music very, very loud and watch movies loud, the H/K has enough power to satisfy me. And the H/K will crank and crank for extended periods of time without a problem. Sure, it gets warm and the fan eventually turns on, but you cannot hear the fan if you are listening to music/HT at high volumes anyway. You get less overall headroom, but after all, we all have efficient Klipsch speakers. Thanks to everyone who gave me advice on this forum (and others) about the problem I had with my sub output. Per directions of H/K customer support, I set bass to LFE+L/R (don't ask, its a H/K 525 thing). I also split my signals again into both inputs on the subs and repositioned the SVS and HSU multiple times over until I had better overall response in the room. Situation solved! (Thanks also to the SVS gang, they are truly the best). My only other recommendation for you is to get a quality subwoofer (even an SVS 25-31 PCi or a HSU VTF-2 would do). Even with Reference 7s all around, you will notice a difference. Hope this helps. ------------------------------------------------------- H/K AVR 525 RF3II RC35 RS35 KLF-C7 SVS 20-39PCi HSU VTF-2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damonrpayne Posted September 11, 2003 Share Posted September 11, 2003 I have the AVR 325 with the SVS 20-39 and I have the exact opposite experience. With the volume on the SVS set to "3" I have to turn the subwoofer down -4 to keep it from overpowering everything. Have you experimented with the phase control, manual crossover, etc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabulousfrankie Posted September 11, 2003 Share Posted September 11, 2003 Now you're sending a the LFE signal plus the bass from any speakers set to small to the sub and your mains at the same time. Is this what you want? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAiN5 (banned ) Posted September 12, 2003 Share Posted September 12, 2003 ---------------- On 9/11/2003 11:57:13 AM cjgeraci wrote: I would be happy to. I auditioned both the H/K AVR-525 and the Denon 3803 with various sets of Klipsch speakers. To me, the H/K is warmer (and more robust) sounding than the Denon with Klipschs, but that is my ear. There are a number of Denon owners on this site who are quite happy with the Denon/Klipsch combo, and I will say, Denon would have been a great second choice. (Anything to remove the earbleed of my Yamaha - again ears differ). There is a power difference between the two since the H/K is rated at 70 X 7 and the Denon is rated at 110 X 7 (and both manufacturers tend to realistically rate their amps). To me, the power difference does not matter much because even though I like to play music very, very loud and watch movies loud, the H/K has enough power to satisfy me. And the H/K will crank and crank for extended periods of time without a problem. Sure, it gets warm and the fan eventually turns on, but you cannot hear the fan if you are listening to music/HT at high volumes anyway. You get less overall headroom, but after all, we all have efficient Klipsch speakers. Thanks to everyone who gave me advice on this forum (and others) about the problem I had with my sub output. Per directions of H/K customer support, I set bass to LFE+L/R (don't ask, its a H/K 525 thing). I also split my signals again into both inputs on the subs and repositioned the SVS and HSU multiple times over until I had better overall response in the room. Situation solved! (Thanks also to the SVS gang, they are truly the best). My only other recommendation for you is to get a quality subwoofer (even an SVS 25-31 PCi or a HSU VTF-2 would do). Even with Reference 7s all around, you will notice a difference. Hope this helps. ------------------------------------------------------- H/K AVR 525 RF3II RC35 RS35 KLF-C7 SVS 20-39PCi HSU VTF-2 ---------------- Thanks! I am leaning towards the Harman Kardon right now. However, Denon seems to OVER-RATE their amplifiers while Harman Kardon UNDER-RATES them. Click here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted September 13, 2003 Author Share Posted September 13, 2003 ---------------- On 9/11/2003 4:53:41 PM fabulousfrankie wrote: Now you're sending a the LFE signal plus the bass from any speakers set to small to the sub and your mains at the same time. Is this what you want? ---------------- Yeah, I know. Harmon Kardon customer support told me that the LFE + L/R setting provides the most bass output through the LFE output. Could he just be wrong (or just "mispoke"? His recommendation does seem counter-intuitive. I know that most recommend setting your mains to "small" because then you are sending more clean power relative to the midrange, tweeter portions to the mains. I used to always set my mains that way (with my Yamaha). To be honest, there is not a whole lot of difference in the sound of my mains at high volumes with the 525 on either setting. They maybe even sound a bit fuller set to LFE + L/F. But I know, that's what the two subs are for . . . . . . ------------------------------------------------------------------ H/K AVR 525 RF3II RC35 RS35 KLFC7 SVS 20-39PCi HSU VTF-2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabulousfrankie Posted September 13, 2003 Share Posted September 13, 2003 ---------------- On 9/13/2003 9:04:16 AM cjgeraci wrote: Yeah, I know. Harmon Kardon customer support told me that the LFE + L/R setting provides the most bass output through the LFE output. Could he just be wrong (or just "mispoke"? ---------------- The LFE output gets the same signal in both settings, but overall overall bass output increases because your mains are getting a full range signal as well. It's as simple as that, maybe that's what he was trying to say. When I had RF-3II's I experimented with the different xover frequencies with the mains set to small and no sub playing. When set like this, I thought it was easy to tell the difference in how clean they played when switching between large and small. What did SVS say about this, I'm beginning to think something might be defective? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted September 13, 2003 Author Share Posted September 13, 2003 ---------------- On 9/13/2003 9:38:18 AM fabulousfrankie wrote: ---------------- On 9/13/2003 9:04:16 AM cjgeraci wrote: Yeah, I know. Harmon Kardon customer support told me that the LFE + L/R setting provides the most bass output through the LFE output. Could he just be wrong (or just "mispoke"? ---------------- The LFE output gets the same signal in both settings, but overall overall bass output increases because your mains are getting a full range signal as well. It's as simple as that, maybe that's what he was trying to say. When I had RF-3II's I experimented with the different xover frequencies with the mains set to small and no sub playing. When set like this, I thought it was easy to tell the difference in how clean they played when switching between large and small. What did SVS say about this, I'm beginning to think something might be defective? ---------------- SVS said they have been told by some H/K owners that a poor solder of the LFE connection has contributed to a reduced bass output signal from the receiver. Actually, moving the SVS to a far left corner helped tremendously (previously it was in a corner behind the couch), and splitting the signal again into both inputs on the sub (and the HSU) has given me enough bass levels running both (and when running them individually and now even with the mains on "small.") I confirmed this with my trusty Radio Shack meter. Oh, and Tom confirmed what I already know. Even though my HSU is a nice piece, it cannot compare to my SVS. They both seem to compliment each other nicely, however (with one port plugged on the HSU). ---------------------------------------------------------------- H/K AVR 525 Mains: RF3II Center: RC35 Surround: RS35 Rear: KLF-C7 SVS 20-39PCi HSU VTF-2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 cjgeraci, have you spoken to Harman about this solder joint? Have you asked to have your checke out? I had the 520 and never seemed to have a problem, I still don't with the 7200. If it turly is a bad solder joint I would think you would want to have that looked into. Just my 2 bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.