robster Posted October 10, 2004 Share Posted October 10, 2004 Howdee, I have a Cayin TA-30 integrated tube amp,got it from Bizzy Bee Tube Audio design,with all the mods,auricaps,focus control,Fro-Zen 12AX7's in the pre-amp section. First sounded on the harsh side,giving me a low level headache on my Forte 1's. Spoke with Craig w/NOS Tubes,very helpful and very kind by the way. Per his advice changed the feedback caps from the stock #22PF silver micas to a larger cap to #68 PF silver mica,did smooth out the highs some,but still a tad on the harsh side. I was told the auricaps take a while to burn in. I have about 15-20 hours so far on the amp. Oh yea I'm using it with a Sansui TU-9900 tuner APS modified by Ed Hanlon and a APS-9b antenna rooftop antenna. I mainly listen to the radio and cd's with the Cayin,both CD and radio are a tad on the harsh side.I've read the past posts on break in,psychoaudio blah blah and rolling tubes. So I would like to hear from the folks who have the Cayin TA-30 and what exactly they have done to smooth out the sharpness,harshness on heritage speakers. So I can try a next step,or maybe the auricaps will burn in and my brainwill get used to the harshness,but I'm running low on Ibuprofin (Sp?) Cheers and many thanks in advance. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 10, 2004 Share Posted October 10, 2004 First get a few hundred hours on the amp. Then if your still getting the 16 penny nail syndrome up the value of the cap again. Also where are you running the focus control ? I liked it best at or near 12:00. Also if your still running it in single ended mode you may want to add that to your situation for advise. I personally never ran mine that way but from a design and engineering stand point I have no clue how that could possibly be ideal and I'm not talking about power here. A push pull amp is a push pull amp. A single ended amp is a single ended amp. No such thing as both. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 10, 2004 Share Posted October 10, 2004 Robert, what were you using before you had the Cayin? Were you experiencing this "harshness" that's annoying you now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas42 Posted October 10, 2004 Share Posted October 10, 2004 I'm a former owner of a Cayin TA-30 (probably the first to own one on this board). I think it is a very well built, nice looking amp. However, having said that, I eventually found it a bit too strident for my tastes. Sounded more like a good solid state amp (not that there is anything wrong with that...). I ended up keeping my Scott 299B because I preferred the warmer, lusher "tube sound" of the Scott. The Cayin is probably a bit more accurate and has better bass than the Scott but I found the Scott less fatiguing and a bit more musical. Different tubes might help or it could just be amp-speaker combination. Also, sometimes amps just seem to grow on you as you get used to their sonic signature and I'm sure the Cayin will open up a bit more after it has a few more hours on it. Best of luck and hope it works out for you... Regards, Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 10, 2004 Author Share Posted October 10, 2004 Thanks guys..I'm using it in push pull mode,not single end any longer. I'll give it more break in time. Before I was using a Marantz 2325 receiver that needed a costly repair,so I sold it and went with the Cayin. Cheers, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 10, 2004 Author Share Posted October 10, 2004 also I have the focus control around 11:40 to 11;50 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 10, 2004 Author Share Posted October 10, 2004 also I have the focus control around 11:40 to 11;50 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 10, 2004 Share Posted October 10, 2004 Robert, you didn't answer the second part of my question. So, was the Marantz better in this regard (harshness)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 10, 2004 Author Share Posted October 10, 2004 well..the Marantz 2325 125 wpc receiver was not as sharp,but lacks,excuse my non use of proper termnology,dynamics,of the Cayin tube amp with a separate tuner. I really liked the Marantz,but If I can get over the sharpness with the Cayin,I like the Cayin many times better hands down. But the Marantz was soo kewl!! But I was going to have to ship it off for repair so I decided to sell it to a dealer who would deal with the repair. Cheers, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 10, 2004 Author Share Posted October 10, 2004 also I have another pair of Forte 1's in or music/computer room hooked up to a Bizzy Bee modified Fisher 400 (X) tube receiver converted to EL-34 output tubes,I like the Fisher 400 receiver better than the Cayin,warmer smoother sound on the Fisher,but it's in a much smaller room with low ceiling and carpeted floor,the Cayin is in a big den with cathederal ceiling and hardwood floors. I'm saving up my bucks to get a pair of amps from Craig. Cheers, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 10, 2004 Share Posted October 10, 2004 Robster, What tubes do you have in the Cayan?, the Fisher? Some EL-34s like Sovteks are "edgier" than others. I like the Winged C SEDs of the new stuff but the best I have found yet without braking the bank for NOS Mullards are the Electro Harmonix 6CA7s. You have individual bias? Try setting them lower can't hurt. Swap the tubes from the Fisher. Including a pair of the 12AX7s. Have some fun! You are going to make me get my 2325 out, clean the pots and give it a listen for a while. Maybe on the KG4.5s in the back room. Even after all these years I can't seem to part with that Marantz. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 10, 2004 Author Share Posted October 10, 2004 Hi Rick, Hi have Electro Harmonix EL-34's on the Fisher 400 (X) and I did put them into my Canyin,no noticeable sound difference. The Cayin has Valve Art EL-34's and the 12AX7's in the pre section which I have been told by Paul Gryzbek owner of Tube Audio Design that they are FRO-ZEN and in his blind test sound very close to Telefunken smooth plate 12AX7's. I miss my Marantz 2325 with wood cabinet,but it was going to cost well over $200 to repair and ship. So I ahd to sell. Cheers, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbsl Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 Hey Robster I own a TA 30 also and my first advice is stop using the focus control. To me with Klipsch speakers the focus control makes things too harsh. On speakers that might need more "focus" in the midrange it can help but with Klipsch speakers it sounds bad to me. Klipsch speakers have can have such strong midrange that to me it does not need any extra focus on the midrange. As far as different tubes go it can make a difference in the sound but so far to me it has been important but suttle changes. I went from the Cayin EL-34s to Svetlana EL-34s and that helped with the harshness. I then bought 2 Fisher 12AX7s but with the Svets I did not like the sound, again suttle differences. 4 Electro Harmonix 6CA7s arrived on Friday and they have been burning in since. They have much better bass other than that they sound like the Svetlana EL 34s. Once the Electro Harmonix 6CA7s burn in they might overall sound better than the Svets or they might just have better bass. Once the EH 6CA7s burn in I will try them with the Fisher 12AX7s and see what happens. Another thing that has helped with the sound quality is that I bought a Luxman preamp. With a good preamp the Cayin sounds much better. I know alot of people don't like tone controls but without the preamp the bass is allright but with the preamp with tone controls I can get much better bass and I can control the treble to my liking. I work nights so I get home at 4:00 A.M. so I need to be able to turn down the bass to be curtious to my neighbors and during the day I turn it back up. So a good preamp could help also. Another thing that happens when you start to change your system around is that if you had a sound you liked you might not like the new sound after you add in the new components. I bought 2004 La Scalas and realized after I got them that I need a bigger living room. They sound very good up to that point but when you put in AC/DC or Audioslave and really crank it up they get rrrreeeaaallllyy loud but they don't sound good because I'm 9 feet away and they overpower my living room. With my KLF 20s in the same spot and putting the same power into them they sound better in this room. At the lower power levels both speakers are very close in sound but the LS fill the room a bit more. As far as which speaker is better I don't have the proper room size for the LS while 15X15 works very good with KLF 20s. I used a Monarchy Audio SM 70 with the KLF 20s and loved the sound. So I bought 2 SM 70 Pros monoblocks for the LS and did not like the way it sounded. So I took a chance on the Cayin and with the Luxman and La Scalas it sounds very good. Which reminds me I'm going to put a post on the forum about selling one of my SM 70 Pros. The Cayin may not work for you and you will try something else that's how this hobby goes! Xman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 11, 2004 Author Share Posted October 11, 2004 anybody try a Peach pre-amp with a Canyin Ta-30? if so how did that sound? Cheers, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robster Posted October 11, 2004 Author Share Posted October 11, 2004 Check out 2baudio.com and in the description on the Cayin TA-30 the focus control is explained,I can't even try to explain it,something to do with feedback from the transformers. Got a peach available? Cheers, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 Mark, The "Focus Control" is a romantic name for "Adjustable Feedback" I found it to be a real pain in the butt. Just another knob to fiddle with. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZplyonZ Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 I am using my TA-30 (plus all mod cons) with an Anthem PRE1 tube preamp. Ditto the remarks on the addition of a good pre, preferably tube driven... with this set up the LaScalas sound really wonderful for the most part. I run about 90% vinyl 10% CD though, so YMMV. System is not perfect. Vocals can be a little "wooly", meaning too warm in the lower registers (Focus set around 12:00)... any advice on this will be welcome. I also found everything with the Cayin got a lot better after break-in. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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