rplace Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 In an earlier post http://forums.klipsch.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=57146&forumID=69&catID=19&search=1&searchstring=&sessionID={E5D6FA1F-26D3-4FA2-B179-9A1A5E6EE564} I got a lot of great information about building a 19 rack for my equipment. Well this morning I got all my parts together and went to build it and have either run into a problem or dont understand something basic about rack mounted equipment. Please set me straight. I purchased some blank spacers for the rack so I could get my rails the correct width and keep everything square during construction. With the rails and spacers assembled I measured the center to cent space of the rails it is 18.25 inches. Just to be sure I measured the distance between my equipment holes center to center with the rack handles removed it is 17.75 inches. The equipment happens to be 3 Carver TFM-25 amps, a Carver AV-60 Four amp and a Carver CT-17 preamp. All Carver all the same width. I dont have any other rack mountable equipment to compare to. When using rack mountable equipment dont you simply take the handles off, put equipment in the rails and hold it in place with the screws??? Am I confused on how to mount the equipment or does my Carver equipment have non-standard spacing? Thanks, Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 Relax, you're okay. Lots of heavy duty consumer electronics have handles for easy lifting. There should be an accessory kit for rack mount 'ears' that will bolt to the sides of your units and extend outward 3/4 inch or so on either side, providing the width and the holes for mounting. They probably leave these off so if the units sit on a shelf their 'ears' don't stick out. It's a cosmetic thing. Either contact your manufacturer or measure the distance between the bolts on the front sides of your unit, you may be able to get generics for less $$ but the brushed finish may be slightly different. Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minn_male42 Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 the carver consumer equipment that you have does not use the standard rack spacing for their handles.... you will either need to get shelves for your carver equipment or drill holes in the rack ears..... personally, i would recommend getting some rack shelves for your equipment.... resale value is maintained..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 I check the onliine catalog you were referred to, they sell the shelves but no rack ears. I know you were set on rack mounting. If you have several units of this width, why not just cut down your rack rails and create a slightly narrower sub-section for this equipment. The 'rack' look and integrity would be maintained and you wouldn't have to buy those shelves, which probably are only meant to hold cassette decks anyway, not heavy amps. I read your post again, If ALL your equipment is Carver, just change your rack spacing to accomodate this. You might check the vertical hole-to-hole spacing first, in case they didn't abide by ANY standards. Funny, we used to use some Carver stuff in a PA rig and I thought it was all standard. Good luck Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minn_male42 Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 ---------------- On 12/5/2004 5:16:46 PM colterphoto1 wrote: I check the onliine catalog you were referred to, they sell the shelves but no rack ears. I know you were set on rack mounting. If you have several units of this width, why not just cut down your rack rails and create a slightly narrower sub-section for this equipment. The 'rack' look and integrity would be maintained and you wouldn't have to buy those shelves, which probably are only meant to hold cassette decks anyway, not heavy amps. I read your post again, If ALL your equipment is Carver, just change your rack spacing to accomodate this. You might check the vertical hole-to-hole spacing first, in case they didn't abide by ANY standards. Funny, we used to use some Carver stuff in a PA rig and I thought it was all standard. Good luck Michael ---------------- Middle Atlantic rackshelves are designed to hold much more weight than a cassette deck.... up to 85 lbs for a 4 space shelf http://www.middleatlantic.com/rackac/storage/shelves2.htm the carver consumer equipment that already has ears (amplifiers) will sit on the shelf and the current "ears" will cover up the shelf ears.... you are right - carver professional amplifiers do use standard rack ear spacing - but carver consumer equipment does not use standard spacing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rplace Posted December 5, 2004 Author Share Posted December 5, 2004 Well, at least I am not going insane in my thought patterns. I built the rack with the standard spacing thinking I can use any standard shelf/vent/spacer/etc. It is a shame it is not standard spacing. Sort of deceiving on Carvers part in my book. I remember buying some of that equipment back in 1992 thinking some day I will have a wall of rack mounted equipment. Well, good marketing on their part. Live and learn. Now how can I get some one to fabricate me just the right sized piece from aluminum? FYI for any other carver TFM owners. The vertical spacing matches up as you move it around the railsnot every setyou have to play with it a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 Why do you need a custom piece, unless it's panels between the amps? Is the spacing that far off? Can you use the standard rails you've purchased and shim them in from the rack sides so they fit your equipment? It looks like 1/4 inch per side, that's about three washers. That is kind of kooky of Carver. It's like they make it look like professional gear, but don't take into account pro standards. Kind of like Klipsch and their non-standard dual-banana jacks on their speakers. They claim it's because in Europe the standard dual banana is an AC jack. How many speakers do they sell in America? my .02 Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minn_male42 Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 How tall exactly is the front of the TFM-35 amplifier? Rack spaces are 1.75" per space..... If I remember correctly, the TFM-35 was 3 rack spaces (at least my caver A-500X was 3 spaces) you might have to remove the feet to get the amp to occupy exactly the rack spaces if it sitting on a shelf.... the worst offender of non-standard sizes is sony consumer equipment....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomski Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 Rplace-I work in the telecom industry,I install phone/data networks. The copper data is allmost allways terminated on patch panels on 19inch racks,the data panels are allways either a 3hole or 6 hole in width,Now granted these are usually about 7feet tall,but allways use multiples of 3holes when using 19 inch racks. This will avoid any misalignments farther down the rack. Tomski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 ---------------- On 12/5/2004 7:45:11 PM minn_male42 wrote: the worst offender of non-standard sizes is sony consumer equipment....... ---------------- Don't even go there...I've seen Sony gear as wide as 20" and as small as 16" (Had to put the 20" one in sideways). I can't see any justification for engineering equipment that doesn't fit the standard rack space. Sorry for venting; I could go on for hours. For what it's worth, I would think it'd be better to mount your equipment on rack shelves anyway because it makes it much easier to pull equipment out to mess with the cables and all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rplace Posted December 6, 2004 Author Share Posted December 6, 2004 My original plan was to rack mount the Carver stuff and buy shelves for the rest. I thought that would keep with the rack look and provide for all of my needs. If I space the rails narrower to fit the Carver stuff I cannot then use standard spacers/vents/panels. So far it looks to me that a shelf for every component will add up quickly (4 amps, preamp, DVT, HTPC, Music Server, etc.) as the shelves are not all that cheap. I like the rack mounted look and as minn_male42 pointed out the ears might still give that rack look when in a shelfnot a bad idea. colterphoto1 had a great idea to make in effect two racks. One narrower for Carver stuff and one standard width. I think I will give this some thought and exploration. I would think with some creative trimming where the rack meets the drywall I can make it appear as one rack. Access is really not an issue the rack is being built in the side of a closet that is pretty deep. Tomski, thanks for the heads up on the spacingwould not want the Carver stuff to offset the rest. I cant really figure out why the carver stuff lines up on some sets of holes and not on other, but my Midatlantic rails do look like the holes are grouped and not evenly spaced. FYI the TMF-25 amps are about a 3 space height. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 ---------------- On 12/6/2004 11:13:12 AM rplace wrote: Tomski, thanks for the heads up on the spacing…would not want the Carver stuff to offset the rest. I can’t really figure out why the carver stuff lines up on some sets of holes and not on other, but my Midatlantic rails do look like the holes are “grouped” and not evenly spaced. FYI the TMF-25 amps are about a 3 space height. ---------------- All rack gear will only line up on certain sets of holes. It's the way the rails were built so that you don't end up being off by 1 hole when putting your components in. You'll notice that your blank spaces only line up on the sets of 3 as well. Does everything have to be on shelves and mounted to the rack rails? It is a very common practice just to rest the amps on the bottom of the rack, even without attaching them to the rails. I'm not sure where your heating and cooling happens with your amps, but this would be something to consider to reduce the number of rack shelves you buy (though it kinda defeats the purpose of having the rack in the first place) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rplace Posted December 6, 2004 Author Share Posted December 6, 2004 Due to some basement equipment (pump diaphragm for my well) I needed to move to open up the room but could not move it to where the furnace/etc. is I had to construct a closet to hide it. Then it dawned on me that putting the rack in the wall of that same closet would kill two birds with one stone AND get the equipment to rear/side of the room away from the screen. However the pump diaphragm takes up most of the foot print of the closet up to a height of about 2 feet. So my rack is actually mounted up high enough so the bottom piece of equipment will clear the diaphragm. Maybe I could construct something to cover the diaphragm that would also function as a shelf. Then put all the amps at the bottom of the rack resting on that newly created shelf. As stated earlier the ears would more or less cover the actual rails and with the handles still on the amps should look nice. Keep those ides coming guysand dont forget to give me your .02 worth on my Heresy surrounds in the ceiling or on speaker stands see Ceiling mount or speaker stands? post please. Thanks for all the input! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minn_male42 Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 another option would be the custom rackshelves from middle atlantic.... http://www.middleatlantic.com/rsh/rshcus2.htm With our innovative RSH custom rackmounts, you can install virtually any component in a standard 19" enclosure without making any modifications. Custom cut to provide a perfect opening for the face of the component you are mounting, each RSH unit provides a neatly-trimmed installation with a perfect fit and no gaps. With accurate details on over 6,000 components in our measured database, chances are we have yours on file. Middle Atlantic Products guarantees your custom rackshelf to be manufactured in 48 hours. Assembles easily in minutes, rear brackets are included to prevent the mounted component from sliding back. A ventilated bottom promotes cooling. Depending upon your needs, the units can be ordered with a black textured finish (model # RSH4S), a black brushed and anodized finish (model # RSH4A) or a silver brushed and anodized finish (model # RSH4C). Bottom depths are automatically provided in 11 1/2", 14, 15 1/2", 17 1/2", or 20 1/2" styles. Custom rackmounts will accept any component up to 18 3/4" wide.Individual fascias less rack ears are also available in a black textured finish (model # SFACE), a black brushed and anodized finish (model # AFACE) or a silver brushed and anodized finish (model # CFACE). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyKlipschFan Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 LOL I was just thinking why not custom it too. Great suggestion. As always, in a rack... make sure somehow you have access to the rear too. I will tell you this again, make sure you have some kinda access to the rears. There is nothing worse than trying to re cable or check something one unit at a time basically because you have to screw out, screw back in every piece your looking at in the chain of the problem. Great suggestions on this post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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