andruzzo Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Hi all, I am considering buying one of two amps, priced for the exact same money (quite good): The two options are: Krell KSA-250 and Audio Research Classic 120 I run a Paragon 12 as a pre-amp, and my speakers are Acoustic Research AR7 (which will probably change in the future). Many people have told me that my speakers are more important but the opportunity to buy one of these two amps supercedes the speaker decision at this point. What would you guys buy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicholtl Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 I've never heard Audio Research, but personally, the big, famous, and mighty Krell's are too analytical - or harsh - for me. If it makes any sense, they're "too" clean to the point it's not wholly enjoyable anymore. But then again, the one time I listened to them, I did so through a nice pair of Dynaudio speakers, which may not mate well with the Big K. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnysal Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 the krells I have heard have all been "ballsy" and sounded nice in the treble region. The one I have auditioned in my system (FBP300 + klipschorns) sounded GREAT, only my PP2A3 sounded better and by very little (slightly warmer midrange). I am not a fan of the audio research sound, which is almost SS sounding IMHO. regards, tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEvan Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 May be true of Audio R. overall, but not with the Classic series. I'd like a Classic 60. The 120 gets me vote. Any trouble with the mighty 12? Do you realize the former Paragon designer resides here on this very board? His new line of preamps are sweeeeeeeeet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 ---------------- On 7/13/2005 8:36:05 PM nicholtl wrote: I've never heard Audio Research, but personally, the big, famous, and mighty Krell's are too analytical - or harsh - for me. If it makes any sense, they're "too" clean to the point it's not wholly enjoyable anymore. But then again, the one time I listened to them, I did so through a nice pair of Dynaudio speakers, which may not mate well with the Big K. ---------------- Analytical is the correct term. There's a reason for that, too - they're designed for professional audio people who have to have the absolutely most revealing signal chain possible, so they can fix what's wrong with the source material before it gets to you... Of course, by the time the mastering engineer gets done mangling it at the behest of some jerk in a suit at the label, it doesn't matter anymore, but.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 I always shoot the mastering engineer before cutting the record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 I would buy vintage HK twin powered rec or vinatge integrated tube amp... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 ---------------- On 7/14/2005 9:57:17 AM Maron Horonzak wrote: I always shoot the mastering engineer before cutting the record. ---------------- Not the ME's fault if you're working on a label project. I know, I was lined up for a small-label project out of DC - a prog metal band by the name of Ars Moriendi - the A&R guy came in and told me "I want it as loud as possible" I handed it back to him and said "forget it. I like my integrity more than I need your money..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norcuron Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 The only reason to make it as loud as possible is because so few of the heavy metal bands today have the musical talent of the bands of the past. They just want it loud and forget about any musical nuances. Just my opinion.... Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 I've heard ARC gear and even own an ARC preamp (but it's ss) and they do sound great, but I've heard that they can be problematic from a reliability standpoint (tube types). My preamp being SS, I have never had any problems of course, but I heard other things about the ARC tube gear. The Krell is a very well-known SS amp company with a great reputation, and in my minds "ear" provides some sort of "sizzle" to the sound. I suppose it comes down to the kind of sound that you want. The Krell is very detailed and somewhat treble-oriented IMO. The ARC gear will also provide plenty of detail, but of course, its forte is the "liquidity" of tubes. They can also heat your house, depending on the wattage. This is a tough call, but I would lean towards the Krell from a care-and-feeding point of view. It also would depend on the model, of course, high wattage (and corresponding expense) being better for resale purposes. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonfyr Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Don't let the fact that the Krell is SS fool you into thinking it will be cheaper to operate! This class A monster will probably require you to change out your utility meter several times a year as it spins out of control! Can we say your utility bills will 'change'! ;-) And like the larger ARC units, you certainly won't need to worry about heating the listening room during the winter, but you might want to consider a zoned AC unit for the rest of the year! Both are quality units. And both have distinct personalities. Both will have substantial maintenance costs due to retubing (ARC) and for utility costs (the Krell). Both are 'clean' for their topologies, and the Krell will be more 'analytic' - primarily due to lower inherent distortion. But both sound great on Heritage LaScalas or KHorns. And no, I do not find horns running a quality low distortion signal inferior to a higher distortion tube feed. But just remember the associated care and feeding that you will encounter! But with the Krell it will just come in the mail each month without the random scramble and large all-at-once payout for tubes! Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 ---------------- On 7/14/2005 2:23:38 PM norcuron wrote: The only reason to make it as loud as possible is because so few of the heavy metal bands today have the musical talent of the bands of the past. They just want it loud and forget about any musical nuances. Just my opinion.... Mark ---------------- No, it's the label who insists that it be the "loudest disc in the changer" - whether it's pop, rock, metal, or whatever else (other than classical and jazz, which most labels don't care about anyhow) These guys, rest assured, were talented, and the mix I received from the studio was outstanding. When the A&R guy started leaning on me to ruin it, I decided I wanted no part of destroying an already excellent piece of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osinoff Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 I have a Krell 400xi integrated amp with m1000 interconnects and signal cable biwiring. I just had my Marantz 8260 at high speed while I laid on the floor and dreamed about being on a beach with this large busted, thin, lippy blond and my wife walked in. You can float anywere with Klipsch and Krell. Its a clean sounding brand with great bass and power to spare. Its not as neutral as tubes or some other brands I've heard but its forward sounding and powerful like many Klipsch speakers are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 ---------------- On 7/14/2005 7:00:54 PM Griffinator wrote: ---------------- On 7/14/2005 2:23:38 PM norcuron wrote: The only reason to make it as loud as possible is because so few of the heavy metal bands today have the musical talent of the bands of the past. They just want it loud and forget about any musical nuances. Just my opinion.... Mark ---------------- No, it's the label who insists that it be the "loudest disc in the changer" - whether it's pop, rock, metal, or whatever else (other than classical and jazz, which most labels don't care about anyhow) These guys, rest assured, were talented, and the mix I received from the studio was outstanding. When the A&R guy started leaning on me to ruin it, I decided I wanted no part of destroying an already excellent piece of work. ---------------- Ditto that about it being the label's fault. It's all marketing to them and all they care about is selling the CD...not if it's of any quality. The label would much rather rely on pop culture (MTV) and advertising the artist than try to actually market the product itself. But that is also our, the consumer's fault because we aren't demanding higher quality mixes (though we don't really have a say in the matter). High Five to Griff for walking out on the guy...though you probably coulda just told him that you like to mix quiet and then blasted the crap out of it when he wanted it louder. I know a few guys that try all sorts of tricks like this in order to maintain that last 3dB of dynamic range. The label guys are pretty much deaf anyway so you can always conduct 2 mixes...one for the label and then one you sneak in before it gets sent off to be redproduced Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andruzzo Posted July 16, 2005 Author Share Posted July 16, 2005 For those interested, my decision finally was: The ARC Classic 120 My first impressions: 1) heavy (both of them!) 2) the BASS is unbelievable! I never thought I could hear sound like this. Serious control. 3) mids and highs are just so real and warm...my system used to be very harsh before. ...and the Paragon 12 matches so well... (mark...you were right!) -d ...now if only I could find black faceplates to match everything else....oh well. Thanks for all your feedback everybody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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