doctorcilantro Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 Hey all, We are moving in, exhausted, and ready to sleep for a long time. Today I was looking at the breakers and realized that the two guest bedrooms, one of which will become the "audio room", are on one 15 amp circuit. An electrical engineer and I were discussing just yesterday, how usually all the outlets in a room are usually divided onto two circuits. There are a total of 8 outlets in each room. I don't feel I'll need (2) dedicated 20amp circuits in one room but will this be a problem? I have a lot of gear and two PC's, mixer, ai pump for TT, all kinds of gizmos and my neighbor, a general contrctor, said I shouldn't worry about it; that I couldn't hit 15 amps if a tried. I'm not so sure about that. Also, very unsettling to me (although we live in Tampa, the lightning capitol of the world), was that the hot water heater breaker tripped at some point and all we ran today was the dishwasher. rubbing temples, Jonathan Catuccio aka Dr. Cilantro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 the National Electric Code allows up to 17 "Convenience" outlets on one 15 amp circut the nominal value for calculation purposes is 180 Va each.. .unless you have some 1400 watt power amp i wouldn't be concerned, the other room, will have what, maybe a clock and TV..??? i have no clue what your friend is talking about ...residential rooms, split into 2 circuts ...BWWWHAHAHA ! there isn't a Builder in the world that would pay for that....... sounds like your hot water heater is going to expire soon perhaps it has a loose wiring connection Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 The water heater should be on its own circuit (as should other major appliances). You'd better have an electrician over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 ---------------- On 7/17/2005 8:55:19 AM Duke Spinner wrote: i have no clue what your friend is talking about ...residential rooms, split into 2 circuts ...BWWWHAHAHA ! there isn't a Builder in the world that would pay for that....... ---------------- Hmmm....Duke you sound more knowledgeable than I on this subject, but maybe it's "code" in different states. I live in Texas and that is how my house is set up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 maybe a local ordinance ... here in NY ... Cheap Rules ....! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 Besides ... they don't call it the "National Electric Code" for no reason ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royster Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 If the hose has a basement, and it is near or has acess to the room. I would put a seperate electrical box and breakers for your sound room. That is what we did when we finshed the lower level in our home. Did we need to? Dunno.. but it was not a ton of money and we have never had problem. YMMV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 "Dedicated circuit" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 I suggest you add up the wattages of everything on each circuit in question, to see how loaded up they are. Don't forget your computers -- my new Dell uses 300 watts! Do a circuit map while you're at it -- precisely which outlets, lights, etc. are on each circuit. The usual handwritten descriptions on the circuit breaker door lists are usually wildly incomplete if not inaccurate. Here in Maryland, lights and outlets in a room are supposed to be on separate circuits, but may not be. You should also know how much service you have available. Older levels such as 60 amps are inadequate, and I believe current recommendations are more like 200 amps. Perhaps the water heater breaker tripped because demand caused a voltage drop in an inadequate supply. Fini is right. If you do put in a dedicated circuit, I suggest using "metal-clad" wiring or conduit to minimize RFI and EMI radiation into and out of the wiring for your equipment. Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted July 17, 2005 Author Share Posted July 17, 2005 Thanks guys. My apt in Maine & last one in Florida both had 2 circuits in each room. From what I have heard and experienced it is common practice; one person told me it was code here. The house a 150 amp breaker but my neighbor, for some reason, says it will be closer to 200amps....do know how that could be?? Anyway, the water heater is on a dedicated 30? amp breaker; I think they left it switched off when they needed to move it to do some caulking the other day. I don't add up amps? I add wattage? I thought, as when adding up amps to use on a UPS, you would total the amps used and if the amps were say 25amps on a 15 amp curcuit the voltage would begin to drop, or in the case of overloading the UPS with too many amps, it simply would not work and the fault alarm comes on. Same with computers' switching power supplies; the 12v rail usually has 18-20 amps, some more pricy ones can take up too 30amps. You total up the devices and try not to overload the 12v line with all your hard drives, crazy video card, optical drives, etc. From State Farm website: " * Circuits can only handle a specified total wattage of all electrical devices plugged into and running on a branch circuit at one time. Here is a guide from the National Electrical Safety Foundation (NESF) to follow: 15-amp branch circuit can carry 1500 watts 20-amp branch circuit can carry 2000 watts Most home circuits are designed as 15-amp branch circuits. A hair dryer can draw 1400 watts, an iron 1000 watts, a portable heater 1200 watts, a vacuum cleaner 600 watts, deep fat fryer 1300 watts, and a portable fan 150 watts." My system is mostly listed here. I am using 2 PC's, one with a 300w psu and one with 480w along with the audio gear and LCD and maybe router, cable modem, air pump for tonearm, and phone. System link: http://forums.klipsch.com/idealbb/profile/myprofile.asp?userID=26093&mode=system&sessionID={9282A232-20FB-49BA-95F3-6F9D26405800} Maybe we can try to figure out how many amps/wattage I actually using. DR. C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 I think there's some rule about 80%, therefore if a 15 amp circuit would possibly run 1500 watts (thereabouts), you'd only ever want to PLAN on running 1200 at a time. The wiring notation might have been about how wiring is run through walls. Remember when laying out wires, electricians route WALLS not ROOMS, in other words the circuit down one wall will daisy-chain outlets from two adjoining rooms. Makes it difficult to determine which circuit things are on. I agree with previous poster. Just leave all as is and run a DEDICATED 20 amp circuit (that will be bigger wire) to the area where your system will be. That way it's protected from motor/fan/fluorescant light noise that can enter the circuit. Oh, you're in FL land of massive thunderstorms. Put a GFCI breaker in the circuit box for that 20amp and protect all the gear that's plugged into it. Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 ---------------- On 7/17/2005 10:57:07 AM doctorcilantro wrote: I don't add up amps? I add wattage? I thought, as when adding up amps to use on a UPS, you would total the amps used and if the amps were say 25amps on a 15 amp curcuit the voltage would begin to drop, or in the case of overloading the UPS with too many amps, it simply would not work and the fault alarm comes on.... From State Farm website: " * Circuits can only handle a specified total wattage of all electrical devices plugged into and running on a branch circuit at one time. Here is a guide from the National Electrical Safety Foundation (NESF) to follow: 15-amp branch circuit can carry 1500 watts 20-amp branch circuit can carry 2000 watts I am using 2 PC's, one with a 300w psu and one with 480w along with the audio gear and LCD and maybe router, cable modem, air pump for tonearm, and phone. Maybe we can try to figure out how many amps/wattage I actually using. DR. C ---------------- Well, I'm pushing my knowledge level here, but it looks like people are assuming 120 volts, and since volts X amps = watts, 120 volts X 15 amps = an 1800 watt circuit, and 120 v. X 20 amps = a 2400 watt circuit. The NESF figures look like they build in a safety margin. Incidentally, 25 amps on a 15 amp circuit should trip the breaker immediately! Note that some appliances use 220 volts, which reduces amperage, e.g., a 3000-watt A/C might use 3000 divided by 220 = only about 14 amps, but it's still 3000 watts. Those require separate, individual circuits, of course. Now that you mention it, I could have divided my wattage figures by 120 to get estimated amps, but I assumed 1800 watts for a 15-amp circuit, and added wattages instead, keeping the total used on any one circuit well below the maxiumum (as suggested by NESF). As suggested, a room can have two circuits if one side is supplied by one circuit and the other by another. I agree with others that that you could well run a new dedicated 20-amp rather than piling things on busy circuits you have now. Adding separate circuits don't by themselves add to consumption; my house has 150 amp service, which has been plenty for me to add two 20-amp dedicated circuits, one of which powers a pair of 500-watt amplifiers. Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 residential breakers, i.e. non-SWD rated breakers .. should trip at 80% of the nameplate rating.... they do, but rarely unless subjected to 100 % for an extended time period ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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