Dan1045 Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=248-669&ctab=6#Tabs Behringer is making a digital crossover that you can tweak from 6db crossover to 48db crossover to any frequency. $250. I am close to finishing my belle clones and the only thing I am waiting for now is my electronic crossover to be built. But may order this for the same money if it is not done shortly. Has options for butterworth, bessel, and linkwitz-riley configurations. The reviews were positive, only negative its a pro product and will have to adapt the xlr to 1/4" connectors. Experience, suppositions, what ya'll think? Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Does that unit do time correction too? I would look up sfogg on the forums as he has a killer setup right now...only thing is I can't remember what he's using. But ya, active crossover is definetly the way to go with these things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan1045 Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Yes, it has delay for each band, parametric eq also that can be programmed in. And now it has remote tweaking by computer. Yep, I may get this, got the urge to tweak and this may just fill the urge. Already have the amps, so this is a minimal cost, but getting one that you can setup so many different ways would mean no more buying when I change the setup. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 You will need to find one in stock somewhere. Some part in them got discontinued so Behringer had to hold production on them till that got worked out. As such stock most places is pretty scare. Partsexpress likely isn't going to getting any in on 2/10. They just keep bumping that date back ever few weeks and have been doing so since around Oct. As far as using it check out: http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/657888/ShowPost.aspx Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I'm being a little "thick" about this. It sure looks to be a major handy tool. But...... Can someone briefly explain where in the system this unit would plug in, and what do the speakers connect to? I looked at the unit and found the connectors a little surprising. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Basically they go just before the amplifier....so take the outputs out of the amplifier, plug into this unit. Get yourself 2 or 3 more amplifiers and connect each output into each amp. Then remove the crossover from your speakers and wire the output of each amp directly to each driver. Definetly not something you want to do unless you know what you're doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Thanks Doc, This is what I thought.......lots of amplifers required. Still a pretty cool tool. Nice for development work as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan1045 Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Ebay is your friend when it comes to buying amps. I bought all three of mine for about 250 bucks total over a couple of years, waiting and buying right. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popbumper Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Dan: Which amps did you buy? Any brand in particular? Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan1045 Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Bought a hafler dh200 (100w/c), that will be used for the bass in the this application. A rotel 980 (70w/c) for midrange, and a nad amp 30w/c for the tweeter. I used all three testing in a biamp setup using a jbl 2235 woofer in an l200 cabinet and the 2482 driver and 2380 horn. Using the amps with the smaller of the two driving the highs, i liked the hafler on the lows and the rotel on the mids. Nad was good on mid, but the rotel beat it out by just a little. I also used two carver 1.0t amps set to mono (1000w/c) on the jbl l200s and it did not sound near as good as the biamp setup with much less power. The biamp setup would get loud enough to make your ears bleed if you wanted it to, but the detail was much greater than using the passive crossover. Which is why I am a fan of electronic crossover still. My ears tell a lot of difference using passive vs. active crossover. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frzninvt Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 In a two channel array, three two-channel amplifiers would be sweet. I suppose you could vary the wattage output from the tweeter, midrange, and woofer amplifiers but me being the crazy guy I am would run three identical amps. I think that three Yamaha M-80, M-85, or MX-1000u's would do the trick nicely. If you got really lucky you could find two DBX BX-1 Configurable Reference Amplifiers and run them both in 4-channel mode for eight discrete channels. The possibilities are endless, some Onkyo M-508's, M-506's all available used on eBay for great prices and these are but a few of the premium SS of old availble. Sounds like a fun tool, but would require too much amplification on my part to run a total of 21 discrete channels for the seven speakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggerIsBetter Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 When you use different amps, with different input sensitivity, is there an issue matching levels? am not talking about just matching them for one volume but to maintain that balance as the volume goes up and down. Example, match all driver volumes at 80db with volume controls on electronic crossover. Will this balance be maintained at lowered and higher volumes (i.e. does the amp sensitivity mess this up) when the master volume is adjsuted? I would love to triamp at some point and wonder if there is complete flexibility in the amps used or whether some level of amp matching is required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 "When you use different amps, with different input sensitivity, is there an issue matching levels?" Of course, but you also get that just because the sensitivities of the drivers differs too. You need to be able to get everything balanced. "but to maintain that balance as the volume goes up and down. " Nope, that isn't a problem even if you are using different amps input/sensitivities and such. Once you have the individual amps trimmed such that the drivers are acoustically balanced when you adjust the overall volume level the relative levels between the drivers stay the same. BTW... with anyone thinking about trying this... be sure the amps you use (esp. for tweeters and the squawker too) don't have turn on/off transients. Since all the driver is directly wired to the amp if the amp puts out DC on turn on/off that will go directly to the tweeter and kill it quick. Amps with relay switched outputs for on/off transients are a *very* good thing here. As far as what amps are good to use there are many possibilities. Something like a M508 would probably be OK for a woofer but would be a waste of an amp on the squawker or tweeter. A 60-70 pound 225w amp on a tweeter with a max power level of 2 or 4w is just silly. Low noise floor is a good thing in the amp. To keep your life easier amps with input volume controls would be very helpful in maximizing SNR through a digital crossover and for balancing driver levels. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steamer Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 When you use different amps, with different input sensitivity, is there an issue matching levels? am not talking about just matching them for one volume but to maintain that balance as the volume goes up and down. Example, match all driver volumes at 80db with volume controls on electronic crossover. Will this balance be maintained at lowered and higher volumes (i.e. does the amp sensitivity mess this up) when the master volume is adjsuted? I would love to triamp at some point and wonder if there is complete flexibility in the amps used or whether some level of amp matching is required. I overcame this very problem in my system because my Bryston SS amps have input level controls and they had to be backed off to match up the levels to my Decware monos.I can now adjust volume with my Levinson CDP and it stays pretty well matched untill you get to very high volume levels then all I have to do is back off on the low output on the Rane outboard a bit. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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