Alternative 2a3 tubes?

[steamer]

Hello,

I am currently listening to my Wavelength 2a3 monos with Sovtek power tubes.Does anyone have expierience with this tube vs. another brand?What differences did you notice/like?

I find in my system that the highs are a bit rolled off with this tube.I would like to find a tube with strengths in the mids and highs.Bass in not important as the tube only sees signals above 400hz.

The reason I ask is that I also have a pair of Electriprint 300b DRD monos that just stomp all over my Wavelength's for high freq.reproduction.Maybe its a product of the 2a3 design vs. the 300b?

Thanks,Greg

[Daddy Dee]

I found the Sovtek 2A3 tubes to be the best current manufacture tubes in my Wright monoblocks. I thought the ValveArt tubes were pretty good. In the Wrights, I didn't care for the EH 2A3's at all. Don't know how much tube/amp synergy is at work here.

To my ears, and in the Wrights, I thought the WWII vintage RCA's were all round the best. I did also have AVVT 2A3's, which had remarkable midrange. These are pretty pricey, though, IMO.

[steamer]

Thanks for the reply,

I am sure my Wavelength's are gonna sound different from any other 2a3 design.I only posted this question because of the huge difference when I have the 300b amps in the system.

I guess one could only give an appropiate answer if they owned the Wavelegth's and compared different 2a3 tubes with it.

I was looking into some KR 2a3's and spoke with the KR dealer in Canada.I asked him what I could expect for sound.He immediatly said the highs would be better,this without saying anything about what I was hearing with the Sovtek's.

So I guess I'll refrase the question.

Has anyone heard the KR 2a3 vs. anything else?

Greg

[leok]

The TJ Meshplate (2.5V 300B) should work in the circuit and may have a

bit more high end. The "rolled off" sound could be more the absence of

distortion than actual lack of high end. But maybe the TJ has a lower

impedance at higher frequencies .. or something. I have been very happy

with the Sovtek 2A3, but using the small parallel feed transformer

provides excellent high and low extension. I've pretty much lost track

of what a standard SET transformer sounds like.

Leo

[Painful Reality]

Has anyone heard the KR 2a3 vs. anything else?

To me, and it's a well known fact that I'm heck of a good reference, the KR sounds like a transistor in a bottle.

The best sound you'll get from any KR tube is when it is plugged in another one's system, preferably in another state.

No other opinion should be considered.

[NOSValves]

Has anyone heard the KR 2a3 vs. anything else?

To me, and it's a well known fact that I'm heck of a good reference, the KR sounds like a transistor in a bottle.

The best sound you'll get from any KR tube is when it is plugged in another one's system, preferably in another state.

No other opinion should be considered.

[] The Olde chicken man ain't chicken after all

[Erik Mandaville]

I use KR 2A3s in my Moth amp, and have also used the AVVT meshplates, Sovteks, and some others.

The KR tubes sound nothing like a transistor amplifier. They are outstanding tubes IMO. People prefer different sorts of sounds, which makes neither right.

Erik

[Painful Reality]

KRRRRRR

Putting all of these in a beatiful glass glowing package...

[steamer]

Has anyone heard the KR 2a3 vs. anything else?

To me, and it's a well known fact that I'm heck of a good reference, the KR sounds like a transistor in a bottle.

The best sound you'll get from any KR tube is when it is plugged in another one's system, preferably in another state.

No other opinion should be considered.

Painful,

Sounds like you had a painful expierience with the KRs!

Thanks guys,the Sovtecs are the only tubes I have heard in these amps.I think they sound very good,just was interested in a little tube rolling and want to spend wisely.Another tube that intrigues me is the Sofia 300b 2.5 meshplates for 2a3 amps.There are too many damn choices and not enough $$$.

Greg

[Painful Reality]

Sounds like you had a painful expierience with the KRs!

Greg

Yes. What the KR do best is to "decompose" a piano playing music into felt hammer hitting metallic stings and background noises from feet hitting pedals.

Get a pair of RCA 2A3. Black plate if possible. Get them used and "unmatched" from a reliable seller. They should come rather affordable and will last for a lifetime.

[steamer]

Sounds like you had a painful expierience with the KRs!

Greg

Yes. What the KR do best is to "decompose" a piano playing music into felt hammer hitting metallic stings and background noises from feet hitting pedals.

Get a pair of RCA 2A3. Black plate if possible. Get them used and "unmatched" from a reliable seller. They should come rather affordable and will last for a lifetime.

Painful,

Sounds as if the KR's are maybe a little too detailed and less natural sounding?I like the RCA recommendation,in fact I have a bid on some.

Greg

[steamer]

Painful wrote

Get a pair of RCA 2A3. Black plate if possible. Get them used and "unmatched" from a reliable seller. They should come rather affordable and will last for a lifetime.

When you say Black plate are you refering to the filiment color?I have heard this term but confess being relatively new to tubes I have some things to learn.

Greg

[Z4!]

IMHO RCAs would be a step up from the Sovteks, but at a price premium. The Sovteks are the best "bang for the buck" 2A3s.

[Erik Mandaville]

Greg:

I remembered I had an extra KR 2A3 here I would be willing to let you try to compare in one amp.

The 'transistor in a bottle' phrase has been flung around quite a bit. I have a friend who was going to sell me his pair, because someone told him the same thing, and then he tried them for himself, and wrote me back to say "No Way, I'm keeping these things!" This guy has owned practically every kind of modern SE 2A3 amp made, and has used an equal number of 2A3s.

The RCAs are also good, although I don't know what plate voltage of you amps. The 2A3 in this type of amp is rated for 250VDC (max), which is an easy load for most current production 2A3s. However, the vintage stuff IMO needs more careful handling. Maybe Gordon Rankin can give you that informaion, or perhaps it's in your owner's manual?

Z4! is on the mark, I think, with the Sovteks. They are really awesome for the money -- amazing when you compare them with vintage RCAs. The RCAs can be very, very nice, and I have two pair myself -- but they are not cheap. The KRs are more expensive, still.

So, if you are interested in trying one, I would be glad to let you borrow the extra one I have here. I need to get some other shipping taken care of first, and then I'll send it out in a well-padded box. The Sovteks are probably a pretty safe gamble, though.

I've looked at the TJ meshplates that Leo mentioned, and may invest in a pair. I've heard good things about them. People don't have the same listening preferences, and there isn't a right or wrong, so it's a just a matter of finding what you like.

Erik

[Painful Reality]

Sounds as if the KR's are maybe a little too detailed and less natural sounding?I like the RCA recommendation,in fact I have a bid on some.

Greg

The KR are way too detailled for my taste. Every recording becomes some sort of a "cymbal show".

Nothing wrong with "ultra detail" if one's goal is to play a sonic version of "Where's Waldo" and concentrate hard to hear the little creaking from the bass drum pedal he enjoy so much. KR in that case will be THE tubes to go for.

Of course a KRell amp would do as good.

As for your question about "black plate", it refers to the color of the plate. RCA had black plate and grey plate (more recent versions). Sylvanias or canadian made GE would be really good to.

I agree with Z4 also. The Sovtek are definitively the best bang for the buck available at this time.

[Erik Mandaville]

"The KR are way too detailled for my taste. Every recording becomes some sort of a "cymbal show". "

I've heard that before, too. Kelly mentioned something similar, and over the years there has been some good discussion about what sorts of sounds are better not heard to such a signficant (subjective term, there) degree.

When I used to drum, or when I have been right in front of a live band in a club, drums can sound really brash, immediate...whatever you want to call. It's all right there. It's also when mistakes are more easily picked up, as well as some of the non-musical (also subjective) sound of bass drum or keyboard pedal creaking, finger sounds of frets, that sort of thing. I happen to like to hear those sounds if they are on the recording because, for me, it brings that live sense of immediacy into the listening room. My art classroom is right next door to the band hall, and the sounds that come from there are awesome -- and do in fact have many of the types of sound characters mentioned above. It sounds live because it is -- that's what I'm after, not something that becomes rolled off during recording. people make music, along with the little transient sounds, not necessarily always music, but real.

Some like steak rare, others like it medium or well done. It isn't a right or wrong thing, but a personal preference sort of thing.

I know sending one KR tube isn't as ideal as two, but I'm just not willing to subject them to possible damage in shipping. Just trying one might be at least some help.

Erik

[Erik Mandaville]

Another example:

I know a guy who once owned a Ferrari. I asked him how he liked it, and he said, "It's a ton of fun to fly through the gears and be pushed back into the seat, but an absolute PIA to drive on a daily basis. The AC is horrible, always breaks down, and the seating position isn't very comfortable." A Honda Accord is lot nicer.

It's what one is after.

Erik

[lighting guy]

Guys,

I don't want to get this thread too "spun out" but I understood that in my Wright 2a3 monos it was the driver tube (6sn7 in my case) that carried the most sound characteristics. Isn't this the place to do most tube rolling?

Darrell

[Painful Reality]

Guys,

I don't want to get this thread too "spun out" but I understood that in my Wright 2a3 monos it was the driver tube (6sn7 in my case) that carried the most sound characteristics. Isn't this the place to do most tube rolling?

Darrell

KR used to make a 6SN7 back then. Put these along the KRrrrrr 2A3 and you'll hear Patricia Barber's recording engineer moving the faders in the control room.

Now that is what I call music compared to Patricia Barber pseudo-jazz (although Pat Metheny takes the cup with Kenny G. in the boring pseudo-jazz category).

[steamer]

Great input guys,I am hearing what I wanted.

First,I really like the Sovteks.As for them being rolled off in the highs I might have to reconsider that impression.I got that impression after listening to my Electriprint 300b DRD's,different amps/different tube.The Wavelengths are like no amps I have ever heard,scary good in fact,tons of detail(I like detail).They have more clarity than any amp I have ever heard.They do dynamics almost too good,I have never heard an amp that can accurately portray the levels in music like these.An example is,it seems as if I turned the volume down sometimes when the music is playing.At first I thought there was a problem in the system because it was that drastic,but it is not the amps as I would hear it in one side if a problem was there.What are the chances of the same issue happening in both amps?

Painful,

Thanks for your impression of the KR,its exactly what I wanted to hear.

Erik,

No need to send a loaner,I have a good idea of the sound from the discussion in this thread.Thanks for the offer.

Darrel,

I understand the significance of rolling input tubes.In these Geminis I use a Western Electric 417A input tube.I have several others that I got with the amps but the WE's are hands down the best.I am just exploring the other side of the equation here.

Back to the Sovteks,like I said they sound very good.I agree that we all have preferences in sound.I am not looking for a big change to what I am hearing,just wondered what differences there could be in other power tubes.

Greg