Metal Studs

[esl_57]

Prior to acquiring a pair of Klipschorns, and joining this forum for support on them, I too started a home theatre project. My choice was steel stud, 16 centers and ½ drywall. Every sheet of drywall was glued to the stud with PL200 before screwing it down and the cavities (spaces between studs) are packed with Rocksol insulation.

The PL200 panel adhesive makes for a very rigid wall and the insulation adds mass which makes the wall more difficult to excite. The room is not completed but I did test it with a 15 bass cabinet and signal generator. Its solid.

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I have most of the taping done, the picture I attached is weeks old.

[mas]

Addressing the issue of the use of steel studs, there is absolutely no problem using them! In fact, in some cases they make the job of acoustically isolating an environment alittle easier. The primary difference is that steel studs are more commonly used in commercial buildings. The building industry, generally, is reluctant to adopt alternative building methods and materials. And we are seeing that tendency here!! ;-) And the techniques that facilitate fire-resistance often compliment acoustical isolation as well.

Hard data regarding soundproofing techniques for wood &/or steel supports is available!

Acoustical isolation techniques and ratings are exhaustively detailed in:

Residential Steel Framing: Fire and Acoustic Details (HUD)

http://www.huduser.org/Publications/pdf/residential_steel_framing.pdf

An additional excellent to the point resource is also found at:

http://www.sdsc.edu/~nadeau/Rebuilding/About/AboutSoundproofingWalls.htm

Table 3.1 - STC of Various Construction Materials

Building Component STC

¼-inch plate glass 26

¾-inch plywood 28

½-inch gypsum board, both sides of 2x4 studs 33

¼-inch steel plate 36

Concrete block: Autoclaved aerated 45

3-inch concrete wall 47

6-inc Reinforced concrete slab (4-1/8 thick) 44

6-inch concrete block wall 42

8-inch reinforced concrete wall 51

12-inch concrete block wall 53

12-inch Brick 56

2x4 wood studs (16 o.c.) with 1/2 GWB both sides 33-39

1-5/8 inch steel studs (24 o.c.) with 1/2 GWB both sides 39

3-5/8 inch steel studs (24 o.c.) with 5/8 GWB both sides 40-44

3-5/8 inch steel studs (24 o.c.) with 1/2 GWB both sides 39

Be aware single dual sided studs are NOT the most effective for minimizing acoustical sound transmission in wood or steel stud walls!

2.) Construction for an STC 55-60 wall

(omitting < STC 57, sorted by total wall thickness)

Wall

Stud

type

Stud

width

Air

gap

Drywall layers

Insulation

STC

Total

wall

thickness

Staggered

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

1.5"

1"

0.5"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

58

6"

Double

Steel

2"

2.5"

1.5"

0.5"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

58

8"

Staggered

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

3.5"

4"

3.5"

3"

2.5"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

59

8.5"

Double

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

3.5"

3.5"

3"

2.5"

2"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

60

10"

Double

Wood

3.5"

1"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

58

10.5"

Double

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

3.5"

5"

4"

3"

2"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

63

11.5"

1.) Construction for an STC 55-60 wall

(Standard and double walls)

Wall

Stud

type

Stud

width

Air

gap

Drywall layers

Insulation

STC

Standard

Steel

2"

Three layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

54

Standard

Steel

2.5"

Three layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

55

Standard

Steel

3"

Three layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

56

Standard

Steel

3.5"

Three layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

57

Staggered

Wood

3.5"

1.25"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

54

Staggered

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

1.5"

1"

0.5"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

58

Staggered

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

3.5"

4"

3.5"

3"

2.5"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

59

Double

Wood

3.5"

1"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

58

Double

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

3.5"

4.5"

3.5"

2.5"

1.5"

5/8" each side

thermal

57

Double

Steel

2"

2.5"

1.5"

0.5"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

58

Double

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

3.5"

3.5"

3"

2.5"

2"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

60

Double

Steel

2"

2.5"

3"

3.5"

5"

4"

3"

2"

Two layers, 5/8" each side

thermal

63

Well, you don't want my opinion of the editing tools here, but the last 2 charts above should be 'reversed' in their order[]

Table 1.) shows a larger selection of potential configurations, while Table 2.) features a subset of configurations, omitting from consideration standard walls and anything less than STC 57, showing effective measures and sorted by total wall thickness.

Also, please be aware as well that the most critical source of noise transmission is not the wall and floor surfaces, although they are certainly the most apparent!

I have more documents, if needed, but I have yet to figure out how to attach them.

...Hope this helps alittle...

[DrWho]

You could always throw the files into a single zipped folder for upload to the forum.

[artto]

Damon, you're one hell of a glutton for this "architorture" stuff, aren't you!?!?!

Probably no audible difference will result under your conditions, however, personally, since you're not in a commercial situation which usually specifies steel studs for fire code or cost reasons, I think the natural damping properties of real wood are perferable.

Also, as has been previously stated, other considerations are the quality of work, intoxicated workers, injury, insurance, etc. Do you want them to build you a home theater, or is it really just going to be party time (with the associated party quality results)?

[mas]

...Can't disagree with the overall suggestion, but if I may, I will take issue with a small technical point just for the sake of 'clarification'.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

One of the strengths of steel studs used for acoustical isolation is the fact that they are more compliant ('more springy' - pardon the techno speak! ;-) then wood studs, and hence they do not acoustically couple spaces and transmit the acoustic energy as well as the wood.

"Since wood transmits sound well, a standard wood stud wall doesn't do well for soundproofing. A steel stud with a "C" shape cross-section does a better job. The "C" is a bit springy and absorbs sound, improving the STC rating by about 5 points over wood." "About Soundproofing"

But, as correctly mentioned, many factors contribute to the selection of the materials for use in the home. I simply mention this in order to allay the fears that many have expressed about steel studs.

Nice job!

[damonrpayne]

Damon, you're one hell of a glutton for this "architorture" stuff, aren't you!?!?!

Probably no audible difference will result under your conditions, however, personally, since you're not in a commercial situation which usually specifies steel studs for fire code or cost reasons, I think the natural damping properties of real wood are perferable.

Also, as has been previously stated, other considerations are the quality of work, intoxicated workers, injury, insurance, etc. Do you want them to build you a home theater, or is it really just going to be party time (with the associated party quality results)?

Yes I am a glutton for punishment.

[Duke Spinner]

...Can't disagree with the overall suggestion, but if I may, I will take issue with a small technical point just for the sake of 'clarification'.

One of the strengths of steel studs used for acoustical isolation is the fact that they are more compliant ('more springy' - pardon the techno speak! ;-) then wood studs, and hence they do not acoustically couple spaces and transmit the acoustic energy as well as the wood.

"Since wood transmits sound well, a standard wood stud wall doesn't do well for soundproofing. A steel stud with a "C" shape cross-section does a better job. The "C" is a bit springy and absorbs sound, improving the STC rating by about 5 points over wood." "About Soundproofing"

But, as correctly mentioned, many factors contribute to the selection of the materials for use in the home. I simply mention this in order to allay the fears that many have expressed about steel studs.

Nice job!

i don't think people are getting the " STC " thing, Mark ....[]

[Duke Spinner]

Sound Transfer Co-efficient

it's Higher for Wood, than Steel .......[]

[mas]

Sorry...[:$]

Yes, the higher the STC rating (typically rated in terms of dB), the more isolation.

Thanks Duke![]

[picky]

{Sigh} Even more on STC here. []

[IndyKlipschFan]

I will speak from my own experience, too, Daymon.. I have no side walls.. no direct ceiling walls... that touch the ceiling up above me..(minus the trey part..) so a room within a room. This is the home run IMO/../ I used a LOT of insulation, Including sound prooffing boards like glen then drywall... and I am very happy. So is everyone else in the house cause it does not go upstairs way loud too.

We could, hypothetically, spend 200k I am sure just on the room iteself.. and it might sound great... to really really bad.. it is a balance.. IMO././ My 2 cents..

[Blazemaster]

excuse my ignorance when it comes to building materials and so on....what happens if you want to hang something on the finished drywall? For example, the side surrounds and real surrounds will all have to be mounted on the wall, with a wood stud, one can easily use a stud finder and drill a hole and mount the speaker on the wall. If it's a steel stud, wouldn't it be more difficult to drill the same hole to mount the speaker with?

[Duke Spinner]

If it's a steel stud, wouldn't it be more difficult to drill the same hole to mount the speaker with?

No

[colterphoto1]

I will speak from my own experience, too, Daymon.. I have no side walls.. no direct ceiling walls... that touch the ceiling up above me..(minus the trey part..) so a room within a room. This is the home run IMO/../ I used a LOT of insulation, Including sound prooffing boards like glen then drywall... and I am very happy. So is everyone else in the house cause it does not go upstairs way loud too.

We could, hypothetically, spend 200k I am sure just on the room iteself.. and it might sound great... to really really bad.. it is a balance.. IMO././ My 2 cents..

Hate to argue with you, but mechanically, all your walls and ceiling directly attach to framing members of rooms next to and above your HT. This not by definition the 'room within a room' concept, regardless of how much insulation you pack into it. The room within a room uses vibration-reducing materials between framing members to float the inner room within the structure of the building, like recording booths.

However, yours is a very well designed and built room and is well isolated from external noise sources (including HVAC and sump pump), and I thing fairly well isolates the HT noises from the rest of the house.

M

[colterphoto1]

excuse my ignorance when it comes to building materials and so on....what happens if you want to hang something on the finished drywall? For example, the side surrounds and real surrounds will all have to be mounted on the wall, with a wood stud, one can easily use a stud finder and drill a hole and mount the speaker on the wall. If it's a steel stud, wouldn't it be more difficult to drill the same hole to mount the speaker with?

very good point

[mas]

Metal mounting plates are available that span the normally 16" stud centers.

Normally manufacturers should have these available for their products (especially if they anticipate the use of their products in commercial environments where metal studs are the norm). If not, various generic mounting plates are available from building supply houses.

Here is an example of a mounting plate:

http://www.audio-discounters.com/wsp-425.html