Cornwall and 45 SET

[mike stehr]

I think you need more gear.....nice sig....

I'm curious to how many other people listen to your stereo? "Your" as in everyone on this Forum.

Other than the wifes, GF's or kiddies.......I visit my friend and listen to his gear, but it's just mostly speaker listening and a BS session. And we have the same interest in audio.

A neighbor has came by, and has listened to my stereo. He appreciates that it can get loud, and sounds really good, but other than that he can care completely less. We like the same music too.......and I have offered him decent bookshelf speakers for free, even a receiver to power them with. He declined. He's more than happy with his POS PC media speakers. Strange that.

But some are content with what they have, or he may feel guilty because I gave him something......who knows.

My close friend is sort of the same way, but he has more appreciation towards a good sounding system. I've helped him build a nice little two channel system with a older cherry Harmon Kardon 330B with the Walnut case. He's the second owner. This is good for him, it's close sounding to a tube amp kinda, he can leave it on forever, and he doesn't have to babysit tubes. But I did cobble up a Motorola SEP 6BQ5 for him to use with his Marantz Imperial 6's. He does like the tube sound, and loves my 2A3 SET amp.

Anyone else who has listened to my stereo was like the neighbor, they liked the fact it got loud and had good sound. Other than that, it didn't matter. No one said it sounded bad, or picked out certain things that weren't right, or ask where to get a tube amp, or big ol' speakers.......they didn't care.

One guy Brian, did drool all over the floor when I played Brubeck through the Cornwalls with the 2A3 SET amp, but his main hobby is high volume alcohol content beer........but he's got the ear for audio I noticed.....Sheltie Dave was here a couple few times, though the 2A3 amp wasn't finished in his visits.

Talk about audio to your friends who don't care, they won't be your friends for long.......

I find it sort of strange when folks dicker over how their stereo sounds better, has more power, underpowered, a distortion generator or whatever else over the internet. How do you know how his stereo sounds in his room, or how does he know how your stereo sounds in your room? I figure my gear sounds good to me, but I know I can do better, my room sucks, etc.....but it's the best I can do within my budget. I will always try to improve upon my stereo, it's part of the fun. Within reason, of course.

Hell, I'm the only one listening to it more or less.

So when I post in a HT/audio section of a car stereo site with various forums, and told that I listen to distortion generators from posters who use mediocre pro sounds amps, and subwoofer plate amps with cones and dome kit speakers, I just shake my head.....whatever....They'll never hear my stereo, and it doesn't matter...

Love to hear a 45 SET amp with Cornwalls sometime. A little SEP 6BQ5 amp can boogie with Cornwalls....can be done rather cheap too.....

[jcmjrt]

Well, I wondered if the 45s could rock..and yes, they can. I've been playing Doors, Dire Straits, Eagles, Talking Heads etc today and it was great.

I had put a good EL-84 amp on the Cornwalls one time that sounded just wonderful with small combo jazz and vocals but just layed their and died when I put on rock 'n roll. It was just too sweet with no edge. The 45s weren't like that at all. 

That said, it doesn't have the get-up-and-slap-you-upside-the-head drive that the MC-240s do...but the 45s still maintain a musicality that the 240's don't have...and man I love my monoblock MC240's. The 45's just don't seem to provide that bass PUNCH but the bass is still there and decent.

I'm going to have to live with this for a while to make any final decisions but so far, I'm liking it and I hope that everyone will get a chance to hear Corns on some good SETs at some point. There really is nothing like hearing for yourself.

[Erik Mandaville]

Mike:

"Sheltie Dave was here a couple few times, though the 2A3 amp wasn't finished in his visits."

As far as I know, he is familiar with that type of amplifier -- one that IMO has design elements (in terms of input/output stages) that work well. I couldn't agree with you more on the SEP issue. Here's one sitting piggy-back on the Moth for A/B listening comparisons -- which aren't as enjoyable as just sitting down and listening to music instead of speakers, electronic parts, and wire.

[Parrot]

I'm curious to how many other people listen to your stereo? "Your" as in everyone on this Forum.

Other than the wifes, GF's or kiddies.......I visit my friend and listen to his gear, but it's just mostly speaker listening and a BS session. And we have the same interest in audio.

A neighbor has came by, and has listened to my stereo. He appreciates that it can get loud, and sounds really good, but other than that he can care completely less. We like the same music too.......and I have offered him decent bookshelf speakers for free, even a receiver to power them with. He declined. He's more than happy with his POS PC media speakers. Strange that.

Great observations.

To answer your question, most of the time it's just animals: Parrot, a cat, and a couple dogs. It's not like when I was a teenager and people actually listened to a new album together, discussing lyrics, whatever. I think that's largely because of grown-up responsibilities, marriage, kids, work. And also times have changed and the vast majority of people no longer care passionately about music like in the 1960s. Most homes I've observed, including many when house-shopping, have only a boombox for a stereo, and even that is pushed off to the side somewhere.

And I've also observed this POS PC deal. Some people are proud of getting their sound through PC speakers and not even having a standard stereo system. One of the Was producers, I think Don Was, was in an ad talking about how his sound system was his PC.

[Erik Mandaville]

Mike:

"He's more than happy with his POS PC media speakers. Strange that. "

So, what. I've heard some computer based audio systems that are not bat at all for background music, with speakers that use pretty decent drivers. There are some people out there who choose your terminology (see quote above) to describe horn speakers of any type or brand.

Erik

[Parrot]

45 SET won't do this kind of music justice:

[ben.]

45 SET won't do this kind of music justice:

Agreed. Sousa requires something like this:

[coda]

I wouldn't quibble over 2W. But you shouldn't fall into the false dichotomy perpetrated by certain people that you have a choice of 1) high quality with low power or 2) lesser quality with high power.

The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it.

Chinese proverb

[Woodog]

45 SET won't do this kind of music justice:

Agreed. Sousa requires something like this:

Now that's funny!

Woo

[mike stehr]

Mike:

"He's more than happy with his POS PC media speakers. Strange that. "

So, what. I've heard some computer based audio systems that are not bat at all for background music, with speakers that use pretty decent drivers. There are some people out there who choose your terminology (see quote above) to describe horn speakers of any type or brand.

Erik

Well, like the sentence mentions below the one you quoted, some folks are content with what they have. Or the guy may feel guilty because I gave him something. He may feel he has to return the favor, and doesn't want it hanging over his head. Nothing wrong with that at all, I just found it strange when I offered him a free stereo. I expected nothing in return, I was just trying to net a little more room around this place.

Yes, I know there are PC based audio systems than are close to high fidelity I would geuss to say, I've never heard any. A local kid uses a PC based system with Adire HF-12's, and I've wanted to hear it, but he's going to school and has a billion things to do with no time. A guy could use any speakers with a PC system, I would think.....

Yeah, some think horn speakers are pieces of sh!t. Some think tube amps are compressed distortion generators, some think kilowatt SS amplifiers are dumb. Some think subwoofers are stupid, some think a little Teac 3 channel digi-amplifier is a great amplifier, some may get bored with it rather quick over time.....but the bottom line is, so what?

[Marvel]

Well, she could have foam ear plugs in too, but not likely.

Paul,

My son plays in an orchestra, and listens to Mahler, and other BIG sound music. He likes the Moondogs on the LS. He understands volume and quality. You just aren't listening to my system. I was, quite honestly amazed at how good some of this stuff sounds.

It also depends on the recording - a lot.

The bass is really there, but prehaps, as mentioned, not as tight. More bass thatn I thought I would get from the LS.

[Parrot]

Well, she could have foam ear plugs in too, but not likely.

Why do you think it's unlikely?

http://earplugstore.stores.yahoo.net/holemaxuffop.html

Ear plugs are cheap and just as effective as the big ear muffs that I wear.

[NOSValves]

Background music - you can hear someone talking to you if you're close to them.

"Normal" level - you can hear someone talking to you if they're really close, or they're shouting.

"Pretty Loud" - you can't hear anyone unless they're standing next to you shouting at you.

"Loud" - you can see someone's mouth moving, but you can't hear what they're saying.

"Really Loud" - You can't hear yourself shouting back "I CAN'T HEAR YOU!"

"Awsome, Dude!" - You don't notice someone slapping you on the back because it feels just like the kick drum.

By your definitions, I would have been listening at normal level. That's fine with me as this "normal" level is pretty awesome sound. There's an airiness about the music that wasn't there before.

BTW, my previous amps were MC-240's run as monoblocks (one refurb'd and one original and working good) ...so lots of power...and sounded good to me...still do...but definitely different. 45 is more musical.

I spent most of today with Janos Starker and Nina Simone. Wow!

Yup that would sound hugely different!! In reality you would of been better off runing one 240 as a stereo amp one side for left and right. Why would you bother bridging them. The extra power advantage would be wasted by the quailty loss of having them bridged. Then one channel rebuilt and the other stock working good seems suspect to balance channel to channel. Not syaing if you revisit the Macs your going to toss out the DRD. But geeezzzz the bridging with no need for the extra power surprises the heck out of me. Take about gain stages per channel. You had something like 8 to ten gain stages in each amp........... Now you have two per amp. I bet you heard one heck of a change.

[NOSValves]

You know this ear damage garbage you folks are constantly spreading is just as bad if not worse then old Paul and his fishing pole. Talk about ridicules. I just had a good friend/customer over for three hours we enjoyed 4 of his CD's he brought over to share with me, he always brings over something new and interesting that I have never heard before. We sat and enjoyed the tunes one after another loving every single minute of these ear splitting 60 watt amplifiers. The entire time we conversed back and forth and never raised are voices beyond normal conversational levels. The idea that its any harder to make a high power amp sound as "good" as "good of tone" or "tranparency" or "liguad midrange" or whatever the catch word we will be forced to use today will be harder then its lower power little brother is completely and utterly false. Will it cost more?? That depends on many other factors other then the power rating. It really isn't the black magic some folks seem to want everyone to believe. I think if they do cost more the few extra bucks is worth the extra just in case I have a house party sometime or have my buddies over and we decide to let are snobby noses down take off the stuffed shirt and act like were young again. If the SET crowd doesn't see it that way then so be it after all they do own there own systems I do believe. No need for the constant silly hearing damage references. To me on a audio forum with music lovers that is just plain rude. Kind of like telling a long distance runner his legs are weak.

Craig

[Parrot]

I probably won't be thinking about amplifiers for a while. I just received this note:

Please join me in remembering a great icon of the entertainment
community. The Pillsbury Doughboy died yesterday of a yeast infection
and trauma complications from repeated pokes in the belly. He was 71.
Doughboy was buried in a lightly greased coffin. Dozens of celebrities
turned out to pay their respects, including Mrs. Butterworth, Hungry
Jack, the California Raisins, Betty Crocker, the Hostess Twinkies,
and Captain Crunch. The grave site was piled high with flours.

Aunt Jemima delivered the eulogy and lovingly described Doughboy as
a man who never knew how much he was kneaded. Doughboy rose quickly
in show business, but his later life was filled with turnovers. He
was not considered a very smart cookie, wasting much of his dough on
half-baked schemes. Despite being a little flaky at times he still was a
crusty old man and was considered a positive roll model for millions.

Doughboy is survived by his wife Play Dough, two children, John
Dough and Jane Dough, plus they had one in the oven. He is also
survived by his elderly father, Pop Tart.

The funeral was held at 3:50 for about 20 minutes.

Please rise to the occasion and take time to pass this on and share this
with someone who may be having a crumby day and kneads it.

[jcmjrt]

I got the second MC-240 figuring that I might very well be rehoming it soon but when I put it in the system and ran them as monoblocks, I was pretty wowed at how much better it sounded. I'm not sure why - it might be increased power but the Cornwalls are so efficient that doesn't sound right...so I'm guessing that maybe it's the separate power supplies. I don't know why but I can tell you that the monoblock'd 240s sound better than one in stereo.

I'm becoming more and more a believer in hearing it for yourself. What you think might work doesn't and what shouldn't work does, what sounds good to you may not sound good to me. I think that LaScalas sound good but there's Tom B who will go on (and on!) about how horrible they are (buzzsaw is usually in there somewhere). I heard some speakers - Zu Druids - that are supposed to be so wonderful (and with a yamamoto amp which should be a good match) and I thought they were absolutely horrid. When I'm in a politic mood, I would call them colored...or say that they have a signature sound.

I was surprised at the fairly consistent negative initial response to running Cornwalls on a 45SET and probably would never have gone further down that road but I HEARD a 45SET on Chorus IIs and then I was pretty sure that it would work well. I don't think that anyone who was negative actually stated that they had tried or heard Cornwalls on a 45SET. I'm here to let people know that I've actually heard it...it's not a rumor and it's not figuring from a piece of paper on what should or shouldn't work...and at least one person thinks it sounds great (actually it was a roomful of folk who heard the 45SET on the Chorus speakers and thought it was great). I'll end up running my combo past some other audiofriends to check basic sanity. But I'll have to say....There's nothing like hearing it for yourself!!

[coda]

jcmjrt, they know your opinion matters, they wouldn't be putting up such a fuss if it didn't . . confirmation that you can dial into the richness of the music at lower volumes can be unsettling for some! But I'm not sure if anyone asked already, how small is your listening room?

Taking the noise induced hearing loss comments in this thread as mostly poking fun, moderation in everything, including moderation. . even so, there have been some casualties reported that wisely may be quietly considered further instead of ignored.

Daltrey: I'm Deaf

Classical Musicians May be More at Risk of Hearing Loss than Rock Musicians

Rock and Roll Hard of Hearing Hall of Fame

Loud Music Takes Toll on Eric Clapton's Hearing

[Marvel]

jcmjrt, they know your opinion matters, they wouldn't be putting up such a fuss if it didn't . . confirmation that you can dial into the richness of the music at lower volumes can be unsettling for some! But I'm not sure if anyone asked already, how small is your listening room?

Taking the noise induced hearing loss comments in this thread as mostly poking fun, moderation in everything, including moderation. . even so, there have been some casualties reported that wisely may be quietly considered further instead of ignored.

Daltrey: I'm Deaf

Classical Musicians May be More at Risk of Hearing Loss than Rock Musicians

Rock and Roll Hard of Hearing Hall of Fame

Loud Music Takes Toll on Eric Clapton's Hearing

Since my son plays trumpet, he is very careful. The good news for trumpet players is that they sit in the back row. Sometimes there is percussion behind them, but not often.

Craig,

I don't think anyone was saying that a 60 watt amp is more dangerous than a 3.5 watt amp. It is the volume at which you listen. If you can carry on a conversation while listening to your system, you don't have them very loud.

Bruce

[jcmjrt]

jcmjrt, they know your opinion matters, they wouldn't be putting up such a fuss if it didn't . .  confirmation that you can dial into the richness of the music at lower volumes can be unsettling for some!   But I'm not sure if anyone asked already, how small is your listening room? 

Taking the noise induced hearing loss comments in this thread as mostly poking fun, moderation in everything, including moderation. . even so, there have been some casualties reported that wisely may be quietly considered further instead of ignored.

Daltrey: I'm Deaf

Classical Musicians May be More at Risk of Hearing Loss than Rock Musicians

Rock and Roll Hard of Hearing Hall of Fame

Loud Music Takes Toll on Eric Clapton's Hearing

 

The room is about 12 X 15. Everybody gets to listen at the level that they feel comfortable with/fun but I wouldn't have thought that my normal listening levels were so unusual - typically conversation can be had without shouting. The 45s will take it (without distortion) to having to speak loudly to have a conversation.

[NOSValves]

jcmjrt, they know your opinion matters, they wouldn't be putting up such a fuss if it didn't . . confirmation that you can dial into the richness of the music at lower volumes can be unsettling for some! But I'm not sure if anyone asked already, how small is your listening room?

Taking the noise induced hearing loss comments in this thread as mostly poking fun, moderation in everything, including moderation. . even so, there have been some casualties reported that wisely may be quietly considered further instead of ignored.

Daltrey: I'm Deaf

Classical Musicians May be More at Risk of Hearing Loss than Rock Musicians

Rock and Roll Hard of Hearing Hall of Fame

Loud Music Takes Toll on Eric Clapton's Hearing

Who the heck is putting up a fuss?? Paul..............that is 100% normal I'd be worried if he didn't.