projection vs. all others

[tenzip]

And JetJockey is the winner! Congrats. Everyone who replied, and helped me hijack Inventor's thread gets 1000 points. And the points don't mean anything. []

OK, Back To Topic boys.

[falcon20x]

Ouch!!

 I did it again, I think I might be the proud owner of RF 83's ! 

[eq_shadimar]

Oh Trey I cannot use DLP's unless it is a three chip unit. I really don't see rainbows but they make me seasick even with the newer faster color wheels. It really is a strange feeling. LCD all the way for me baby. Of course if you want the best blacks and colors then you have to get a CRT...but that is a whole other thread.

Laters,

Jeff

[westcott]

Oh Trey I cannot use DLP's unless it is a three chip unit. I really don't see rainbows but they make me seasick even with the newer faster color wheels. It really is a strange feeling. LCD all the way for me baby. Of course if you want the best blacks and colors then you have to get a CRT...but that is a whole other thread.

Laters,

Jeff

I thought I was the only one that got motion sickness from DLP. It is a lot worse with front projection than rear projection, but it still occurs. What really is funny is that I love to go offshore fishing for king fish and I rarely ever get sea sick in the Gulf. Maybe when 3 chip designs become more cost effective, I will be ready for an upgrade. I always thought DLP was the way to go on paper.

[sfogg]

"I thought I was the only one that got motion sickness from DLP. "

It is somewhat common, the same thing happens to me too. Along with eye strain and headaches. And when I see rainbows they don't typically like look color trails behind motion... the screen literally breaks down to just flashes of color to me. *Very* distracting.

Only LCD and LCOS/DILA/SXRD for me.

And for some they have no problems at all with DLP.

"Maybe when 3 chip designs become more cost effective"

3 chip DLP is supposed to be dramatically better then single chip in that regard but it actually still has the potential for rainbows and other artifacts like that due to the binary nature of pixels on DLP. They are either full on or full off. The only way for DLP to alter brightness levels of each color is to dither the pixels (turn then on/off very rapidly) which can lead to RBE even on three chip.

Shawn

[JetJockey]

Hey falcon 20...you picked up some 83's?...let us know...how much you looooove them..hehe

Chris

[falcon20x]

I sure will !

They should be in the house sometimes this week end

[InVeNtOr]

falcon, you got some 83's? congrats!!!!!!!!!!!!

[falcon20x]

I know, I know, it is almost midnight but I just got back with my RF 83 !!!

Can t wait to hook them up.

Jet have you  tried different amps with them?

If you did what did you like or dislike?

I got a HK 645 right now which I m going to offer for free in contest to whom ever wants it ( there is catch tho). In order to enter the contest the only thing you have to do is bring you shoot gun with you .

Now the game is simple I will through the receiver from the roof and whoever shoot and hits it first get it. Fair don't you think?

In case you haven't figure it out I don't think very highly of my $1300 piece of junk, so I'm back looking for a good receiver.

[westcott]

Are scatter guns allowed?

That HK can't be that old. What do you not like about it?

Did I miss something?

Congratulations on the new RF83's. I am sure you will really like them. I tried to audition them a while back but the listening room at the dealer was pathetic. I could see how someone could get the wrong impression and walk away hating Klipsch. I would think Klipsch would have some minimum requirements for a dealer and his audio room. I was really disappointed and had driven a good ways to hear them, CD's in hand.

I may have to drop by, next time I am in the Dallas\Plano area and see what they can really sound like. I am sure they are as good or better than my RF's

Once again, congratulations.

[falcon20x]

All right I will allow any guns, just don't bring a tank or something of that caliber, I still need to sale my house 

The Hk is one months old and it is the third one I got.

The first one was broke right out of the box, the second  keept locking up, on this one the video board is acting up (sometimes works sometimes does not) which can be really annoying since the only to fine tune the thing is by using the On Screen Display and running the Ez/Q takes the bass away which makes the system sound.

I agree with what you said about the dealers, it seems they just don't care about klipsch anymore.

I still think that dropping Tweeter was a mistake, I would have  got the Rf 7 or the 83 sooner if I had been able to trade mine in (like tweeter used to let you do) and don't forget that most of these guys actually knew what they were talking about. You could go there seat down and listen the all RF line while getting advise base on your needs from them.

Ever tried to talk to the magnolia kids a BB? What a joke, just mention RF 7 and watch there faces " huh, the what , Klip.... isch , hmm" that's about all you get out of them. At least if they are going to carry the klipsch series try to know the product and sale the all line  ( FYI you can't get the 83's, 63's or RC 64 there).

 I might be wrong on this but if you are going to drop a few thousand dollars into a system would like to know what you are buying,if it is really what you need and if it going to work with what you are trying to do?  I would, It is like going to buy a covette and have a yugo engine put in because the sale's guy did not know what it was doing and neither did you., but the vet still looks good, runs like crap, but looks good.

I might just be a picky customer and I can not stand the attutide of the industry these days which is more or less there is the price, pay for it and we might provide you with a service.

Most of the elecrtonic retailers are good at what they do, all for one  one for all like a fast food, that concept works great for joe who wants to rock the walls out of his 500 square  feet  appartment

and pay as little as possible, but now when you apply the same concept to high end electronics you are probably going to make some people unhappy.

What's really annoying is even the high store are starting to act the same way, and yet they still get away with it.I guess there are more people with more money then sense out there.

oops got to go to work.

[InVeNtOr]

falcon i feel your pain. i went to BB one day looking for a cable. i was getting the cheaper AR type because it was analog. (not going to pay for monster at all costs!). i was just standing there looking at the cables and a sales man and customer were in my way. i waited patiently for them to move, they finally did. after a few more minutes the customer turns to me and asks ME what i thought of the cable choice. well i had tuned out the sales man so i had the customer tell me his budget, what he just bought and what he currently has. 45 minutes later i got the guy to buy the right cable for his needs and current set up. the sales man that was helping him after about a minute or two of me talking quickly walked away and a few other sales men came and listened. the funny part was the sales men that came to listen was laughing because i was telling the customer the truth and not trying to get him to buy some hdmi cable for almost $90 when he barley could afford a $10 cable. the laughing sales man would chime in every few seconds and tell the customer that i was right and he should follow the advice. the customer was very happy because he was finally getting helped and not SOLD. it just goes to show you some kid that doesn't even know a thing about ht is trying to sell stuff he doesn't even know. all he knows is how to read the card and point.

i barley know anything about ht (hence all the questions i have asked) but i am at least willing to tell someone "i don't know, let me ask someone who does." thats why i go to this forum, in fact anyone who want to buy klipsch i tell them to go here.

sometimes i want to go to BB and tell those kids to go wash their face and get back to me after they have actually read on the subject more.

sorry got on the soap box....

[westcott]

I have always been a fan of Harman Kardon. My father had one of the first Tube Tuner\Receiver models in stereo! Worked well with the horn loaded Valencias. It finally failed and my father threw it out![:'(] I was in shock. I would have spent whatever it took to fix it but back then, who knew vintage would still be a great solution!

Anyway, I am sorry to hear that HK is not the company it used to be. I hope it is just that model. It would be a pity to see them lose face after such a long and stellar reputation.

Isn't it eligible for a refund after three failures? (I guess it does depend where you bought it but I would definately try to reach someone at HK that cares. I can not imagine them letting this go unaddressed.

[InVeNtOr]

if he bought the BB warrenty it would be, other than that, SOL. when i do buy stuff theri i always buy the warrenty. i have had to trade in everything i bought there at least once!

[falcon20x]

More then one person told me that HK was not what it used to be, just check Ebay and see how many refurbish units HK is selling and you will get an idea.

The first two were actually AVR 445 only the last one was a 645, so I don't think it is the model.

I got the 445's from HK directly and they were easy to deal with, I did end up getting my money back.

The third one was bought on line so I can't return it, Hk is still working with me and offered to exchange it.

I got to admit the customer support is pretty good, I just whish the product would be half as good as they are. I guess I'm just frustrated with the all thing.

Back to the kids at BB,in my days when I was a kid I was proud of my job regardless of what it was ( and did start in the bottom) I always try to do  the best I could and some.

Today they just don't care, don't even try, all they can say is give me, give me. Ethic is weird word they have heard of at one time.

Inventor I have been in the same situation, where the kid just does not know what the hell is talking about and the customer is so confused that he does not even know which way to run.

I usally stand up right next to kid rolling my eyes, shacking my head and always end up helping out while sales man is trying to figure what's going on.

Well I got to go set up my new speakers lol, so I' will talk to you later 

 

[InVeNtOr]

we should start a poll and see how many people don't get helped from bb kids and are so frustrated just don't go. i usually end up at frys where usually i do get someone who knows a lot more than i do. i do sometimes get some idiots, i then ask for someone else. one time it was so bad i almost went to the manager. i don't want to offend anyone, but the sales man didn't even speak english that well. how on earth can a customer and sales man discuss buying a product when they can't understand each other? i just ended up walking out. i then returned a few days later, got a different sales man (one i have see and spoken to before) and bought the product.

for the most part i just stay away for bb. i come here or cable solutions to get info, i then find the product i want, if it's there i go straight to it, buy it, and walk out as fast as i can.

[westcott]

It is not just BB. Retail business has been destroyed by big business. Their practices are dictated by accountants who do not know the first thing about customer service. In the old days, stores were owned and operated by the same people. They cared about their stores and they took pride in their work and their products. They worked at these stores full time and knew everything there was to no about a product and had the integrity to not sell what was not acceptable. Those days are gone. Now, you have no full time employees to speak of. Most are part timers with no benefits, no overtime, no insurance, no real pay to speak of, and as a result, you get what you pay for (or not pay for). They pay minimum wage and employees come and go so fast that they never learn anything or care to learn. They are not paid enough to care.

Does this sound like good business sense? It does if you are an accountant because they justfy it with complaints about competition.

I think Americans in general have lost their loyalties and principles and accept these business practices without a second thought. If they can save a dime, that is what they will do. All you have to do is go to a business establishment like BB and just watch people make a purchasing decision. First mistake, they trust the sales staff and their advice. Second, they do not do any research. Most of it is impulse buying and that is what these business' count on.

Now, there are those that care and know what they are talking about but they are the exception, not the norm. If you are one of them, you are appreciated so do not take offense. Just wish it was like the old days so support your local mom and pop store and let WalMart and the likes get their business from someone else.

So, the best advice is know what you are buying before you enter the store and do your research at home.

Thank God for the internet. It has been the only saving grace IMO

[falcon20x]

Unfortunately, I have to agree with West scott. He has
come to realize the sad reality of the world we are living in, cancel or
allowed? ( from the Mac commercial)

Sorry, I could not resist lol (being a mac guy myself)

By the way I'm a foreigner as well ( Belgium ) and I will
also have to agree with inventor, but please don't think we all are the same.

I found it annoying when you have someone providing you
with a service and do not know what he is talking about, it aggravates me
when they can't even speak English.

Ever tried to get your lawn service to do something without
talking directly with the owner of the business?

I like to thing my English is sufficient to function in
the society (for the accent there is nothing I can do), and there is a reason
for that, I took the time learn!

I don't
go out give my opinion about things if I don't know anything about the subject.
If I did I would not be in this forum asking questions, would I?

[westcott]

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By the way I'm a foreigner as well ( Belgium ) and I will also have to agree with inventor, but please don't think we all are the same.

I guess I will have to crack open that Duvel in the refrigerator in your honor. If it were not for a trip to Brussels on Carl Sax's Birthday (I felt like I was on Bourbon Street, minus the drunks and bad smell), I would never have experienced real beer. Those Trappist Monks had WAY too much time on their hands!!! Also some of the finest seafood dining in Western Europe.

[InVeNtOr]

HERE HERE!