How's this for coincidence?!

[BigBusa]

I went to compusa tonight and happened to see the Klipsch 2.1 & 4.1 promedia sets on display. I went over to listen for the first time ever and guess what ...? The speaker that has the conrtols in it on the 2.1 did not have any sound coming from it. Only one speaker and the sub was working. The salesman checked everything but could not get it to work! BaaHaa!

Then I move over to the 4.1 and click it on. Guess what I heard? You got it ...High pitched squeals that sounded like air being let out of ballons!

That's pretty sad when both the display models are showing obvious defects. The 5.1 was still boxed up but I would have loved to have set it up and seen what was wrong with that set.

What are people thinking when they buy these things? The freaking display units are even bad!

------------------

My system thus far:

1980 Cornwalls (mains)

1990 Heresy II's (rears)

2001 KLF-C7 (center)

2001 KSW15 (Subwoofer)

NOTHING-Thanks for NOTHING UBid!(No reciever)

Kenwood DV402 (DVD)

Sony KV 27V55 (9 year old 27" TV still kickin')

:eyes

[AudioMan2703]

I tottaly agree on that!After i heard all the complaints on this forum i tried tried not to laugh at "some" of these people.(I said Some)Some people have so much faith as even to be on their 4th or 5th set!Does that seem "odd" to you?

------------------

~You laugh because im diffrent,i laugh because your ugly~

GreenDay Rules!

[justin_tx_16]

Interesting how i have been on this BB for nearly a year, have answered hundreds of posts and hundreds more emails and NEVER, NEVER has anyone EVER said they had a squeal form teh 4.1's... could some one be lying again... i will have to say yes. I have NEVER heard of that. I was at Best Buy yesterday trying to find a camera for a christmas present and tested their speakers (wanted to test out the new Harman/Kardon Champange) and listened to the 2.1's... they sounded TERRIBLE, then i listened to teh Z-340's... they too sounded terrible. I got a Best Buy guy to come over and he messed with the cd player they had playing the source sound and then all of a sudden beautiful sound started coming from the 2.1's. It took about 5 minutes to get teh box that the cd player was hooked to to work.

it is getting sad that you are starting to lie about things that of thousands and thousands of sets has never happened, the problem withteh squeal is a transister problem. a totally different thing than the pm 4.1's. you are full of it.

------------------

-justin

I am an amateur, if it is professional;

ProMedia help you want email Amy or call her @ 1-888-554-5665

Klipsch Home Audio help you want, email support@klipsch.com or call @ 1-800-KLIPSCH

RA# Fax Number=317-860-9140 / Parts Department Fax Number=317-860-9150

[noobzilla]

Wow, you are my hero, BigBusa. You seem to have found some defectibe Promedias. Too bad nobody has a prize for you.

What are people thinking when they buy these things? They are thinking about getting great sound. What did you think they were thinking about? The pretty wires? Really, I don't see what the point of your posts are. People can come to the same conclusions that you have about Promedias without reading your posts.

[gabriel11]

Another thing I have noticed begs to be explained. The fact that Klipsch speakers are offered as the primary speakers packaged with systems from Falcon Northwest, Alienware etc. I'm sure it's because these outstanding manufacturers are seeking a way to damage their otherwise pristine reputations by peddling crap speakers with their top of the line gaming systems. Yeah that's it...they want to screw over every sucker that calls to order a PC. Hey, what the heck? Repeat business is grossly over-rated huh? What brilliant business strategists everyone that is involved with Klipsch (including Klipsch themselves) are. Pure genius is more like it. Wow! How could I have been so blind? Please tell me it's happening because Klipsch nearly gives the speakers to these other firms for free, so they can get poor saps like me to order them since I've been duped into believing that they are worth buying and owning. Falcon Northwest, Alienware and all the others, the resellers, the independant testers writing reviews, the THX guys...why hell, they're all in this together...It's a huge conspiracy to screw customers. Hey maybe ABC will buy the rights and make a mini-series. Sorry if this seems a little farfetched, but it seems appropriate here, considering what other patent B.S. I've read.

[BigBusa]

Justin, I can call you at home from comp usa and let you listen to the 4.1s ballon/farting/zipping noises over the phone if you like. Of course when you hear them for yourself you'll say something like ..."Those can't be 4.1s. You must be lying! They're not even Klipsch you're letting me hear!"

You "PM can do no wrong" guys are dopes ...the reason that the PM reviews sound so great and companies combine them with their own packages is because the reviewers don't test speakers for extended periods.

Plain and simple!

They are given the PMs to test and review. You all know almost all the PM's sound great right out of the box. "The problems only show up after "Hours and hours of use." (a quote from mark, head of the PM dept.) Ocassionally the sub won't work right out of the box but that seems to be the exception rather than the rule.

Even the head guy of the PM dept. acknowledges the fact that the problems are not evident right away!

You have these possibly biased reviewers unpacking sets of PMs and glorifiying them over a very, very short period of time. Saying how truly wonderful they sound. The public buys them because of the review and then finds out for themselves a month or so later about the defects. Then more glowing reviews and more people buying because of them and more angry customers with defective goods that were supposed to be the best. It's a vicious cycle.

Hell, I almost bought a set but I was lucky enough to know about this board prior to purchasing. I came here first to see what the owners were saying. One quick read though even one of the 3 forums here and I was convinced the PMs are not worth buying. If I had gone only by what the reviews and the reviewers said I'd be whining and contacting Amy right now.

This message has been edited by BigBusa on 12-21-2001 at 04:55 PM

[gabriel11]

You're kidding? You say that there are display speakers out there they don't work? Wow! I suppose next you'll tell me that you saw floor model speakers at Circuit City with the voice coil dust cover domes poked in too?... Seriously though, you failed to address the issue I raised...What about the companies that choose to go with Klipsch at the risk of their own reputations? Why don't you drop a dime and see how many thousands of dissatisfied Falcon Northwest, Alienwear, or Compaq customers there are... I'll save you the time and expense because the answer simply is, THERE AREN'T ANY!!! And most reviewers, if they are good, don't accept specialized products to review, but only those that were produced for retail sale. I think most companies would always send some handmade, GOLDEN version of whatever it is they were submitting for testing, but that is simply not the case, most of the time. Also, I figure, the actual posts about dead speakers etc. amount to about 5% of the traffic here. Otherwise, I read about soundcard questions, or 1 speaker didn't work or whatever (generally operator error), til someone in the thread posts a fix to them and they go merrily on their way. So I would have to say that the real dopes in this story, are the people like yourself that keep showing up here, like a bad penny, to save the rest of the Klipsch wanting world from a fate (rare) that you have (nearly alone)suffered. Sorry guy, but that is just plain sad. I don't need self appointed saviours, thank you. If Klipsch had a "HAPPY AS SH*T WITH MY KLIPSCH 4.1's" board (and that isn't a bad idea) what conclusions would you be drawing then? Here's a thought...if you work for a living (?), I want to to think how many times your boss praises your good work, when in reality he most likely focuses on the 1 wrong thing you've done lately. That happens all of the time. Bad news travels the quickest, and carries the most interest, it's a matter of fact. Live with it.

This message has been edited by gabriel11 on 12-21-2001 at 07:23 PM

[BigBusa]

What does the customer satisfaction rates of falcon northwest, alienware and compaq have anything to do with klipsch producing and distributing defective 2.1, 4.1 and 5.1 promedia speakers?

Where do you get you information to make the conclusion that only 5% ofd the boards posts are about defective speakers?

I just counted the first page of just the 4.1 forum and of 40 total posts 15 are from individual users about their defective speakers. What's the defect rate according to those real numbers?

This message has been edited by BigBusa on 12-21-2001 at 08:10 PM

[gabriel11]

Wouldn't those companies I mentioned have dumped Klipsch by now if they sucked as badly as you would have us all believe? I think so. Also there are 216 posts on this page. And if you notice only the NEGATIVE posts have the largest response/viewed numbers. The guys that post technical questions have the least viwer/responder traffic. Hmmm? I guess that solidifies my Bad News theory? And they have gone merrily on their way to being happy Klipsch owners, as are most, as I suggested. So a few have had trouble as compard to the many that haven't, and before you refute that, let me explain. Klipsch has sold millions of dollars worth of these 4.1's this year (2001) alone. Many of those units to people who owned the 4.0's or to the friends of theirs that heard the supposedly inferior 4.0 sound. Now if they have sold millions at wholesale to vendors, as well as MSRP to direct buying customers...then what does that tell you about the potential of the amount of Klipsch owners as a whole? The fact of the matter is this. There are grossly more good units than bad. It can't be reasonably viwed in any other way. Taken in those terms you can't support the "every other unit must be bad" posture that you have taken. The shear magnitude of the figures weighs heavily against your flimsy argument. And I seriously doubt that those millions of dollars worth of units out there are merely "ticking timebombs" waiting to explode. So do the math and then get back to us. Your serve.

[BigBusa]

Hit your back button to the main 4.1 page and count down to the bottom. You'll find 40 threads. Of those 40 15 are complaints about faulty speakers. This is before even opening up the individual threads. There's more complaints by unique users inside!

That's 38% defect rate if you wanna go by the posts. Not 5% like you "figured".

Are you saying that those above mentioned companies sell the pm line and they have no customer complaints? Therefore, Klipsch does not produce defective Promedias? I still don't understand your thinking.

Fore!

This message has been edited by BigBusa on 12-21-2001 at 09:48 PM

[Creacher]

Sigh. I was at best buy just last weekend and went over to the speaker section. i tested all the setups there, and finally came to the 2.1's.. turning them on, i heard nothing. Turn the volume up, i thought -nothing. And to my surprise the 4.1's on display did the same thing.. no sound from either setups from klipsch. of course, the employee I brought over didn't know why they werent working either. All of the other speaker setups working just fine, so the source wasn't the issue. Just thought you guys might want to know..

God. I'm actually on busa's side...

*pulls out gun*

[Amy]

BigBusa, I'll ask again, do you honestly think we would still carry the ProMedia line if they all failed?? Or if 30%, 20% or even 10% failed?? Ludicrous. And do you honestly think we'd continue to have a bulletin board available as an open forum if the failure rate was that high? We would have negative posts in the 10's of thousands. Your logic (?) astounds me.

Creacher, I can't explain what was going on with the floor samples. 9 times out of 10, you can bet the soundcard settings are wrong, however, or the system has been misused in some way. Also, the ProMedias are analog... If another display has digital speakers and you try the ProMedias on the same set up, they will not work properly unless you change the settings to analog. Those are just theories... I can't know for sure unless someone at Best Buy actually contacts me to get an answer (which none have ever done for a floor sample).

------------------

Amy

ProMedia Tech Support

promediatech@klipsch.com

[noobzilla]

I don't see anyone with an attitude that Klipsch can do no wrong. I do see you with an attitude that Promedias can do no right though.

a 38% defect rate going by the posts... pretty impressive. Why do you think people come to these boards? Most people don't care if things work right. How many people call a video card manufacturer to say how impressed they are with their new video card? How many people will call if their video card catches on fire? If something isn't broken, don't fix it. Likewise, why would someone come here if they were satisfied with the product that they bought? Most pc message boards out there have people asking how to tweak, what drivers to get, etc. Not too many posts saying how much they love their system.

I just took a look at epinions.com. 3 people out of 60 did not recommend the Promedias. Guess how many of those people had the speakers break on them? I have counted zero so far.

I am not saying that Promedias are perfect. They do have faults. Maybe even more than some other makes of computer speakers. But are they unreliable? I'd say not. Try thinking about the facts before you jump to conclusions.

This message has been edited by seftonm on 12-21-2001 at 10:35 PM

[Creacher]

amy - I agree.. there's probably some serious misuse done to those speakers... just look at the other peripherals on display (mice and keyboards for example.. or even their pda's). And I've been to many other best buys, and both their systems tested fine.

*shrug* must be central FL shoppers

[skonopa]

I as much as I hate to get into these types of arguments, I'll have to side with 'Gabriel11' here. Just look at the latest issue of Computer Gaming World. FIVE of top EIGHT high-end gaming systems all have KLISPCH bundled with them!! These are the systems from Voodoo PC, Falcon Northwest, Alienware, Hypersonic, Dell, GMachines, Zephyr, and Gateway in that order. Of those eight, only Dell (Altec Lansing ADA490), Zephyr (Cambridge Soundworks FPS2000) and Gateway (Boston Acoustics BA7500) did not package Klispch ProMedias with thier systems. If these speakers has such a high failure rate, would you think these companies would continue to use them? I know Falcon Northwest and Alienware have been packaging ProMedias since the original V2.400s came out nearly three years ago. Would find it hard to believe they would still continue to package these speakers with thier systems if they had such a high failure rate.

Steve K.

------------------

Steven Konopa

Fredericksburg, VA

This message has been edited by skonopa on 12-21-2001 at 11:07 PM

[justin_tx_16]

I live in Houston Tx... there are literally hundreds of electronics stores at my door step, especially where i live, Compaq Land (that actually is the name!. I have done my shopping around, 5 different best buys, over 4 circuit city's and 4 compusa's. I am a serious comparision shopper, which is how i found out about ProMedia's. The first store to actually have the speakers setup correctly was teh CompUSA i went to today. Nearly all of teh best buy's have a problem with their control box.... it is just screwy. CompUSA uses teh same control box but seem to do it better. Circuit city.... i laugh at their cd player techinique but it works. Anyways, you can not blame anything on a speaker without confronting its source. The chances of two products by teh same maker being broken at the same time and then magically fixing themselves at the same time is just impossible... never ever has that happened to my knolege... however, it seems VERY feasible that the problem was infact in the source of the sound, eg, the control box, the audio's output, or many other things, and the problem fixed itself with the fiddling of the best buy guy... that happened to me a while ago.

i have a friend who worked at a best buy for two summers. he was the one that gave me my first listen to the v2.400's... i did not know you could get them at a comptuer store LoL! i went to a Home Theater store to special order them! he told me horror stories about the abuse that the speakers went through. he was so surprised that the Klipsch's were not the ones blown apart mostly because they were the loudest, bassiest, and coolest system they had. that was pretty much the selling point for me, even though i had allready ordered them from Tweeter. I never buy anything unless i MUST or if someone i can trust has assured me that the product is worth while. that is what this board did for not only me but for other Klipsch buyers... if it were not for this board, i would still have a BOSE lifestyle home theater. Sound God forbid! If it were not for this BB i would have gotton the speakers Office Depot (Office Max?) suggested... the Cambrige Sound Works, the old manilla colored cubes. The sales man showed them off to me and i was amazed... all that sound from those! made me think of my wonderful BOSE system in our living room.... well, when i did some more shopping ( i think it took a year to make my decision) i did a search on ZDnet.com i believe and saw Klispch.... i was thinking, oh no, not another PPMO speaker system... did some more research, went to this BB and was sold.

when i first signed up for this BB i had another name... something like justinow, or justin_tx_14 or something like that... really can not remember. But, i do remember hounding Paragon, Gondor, Hofy and the rest with questions. They helped me and this is how i repay the favor, helping out other novices to the ProMedia line of speakers. This BB is not just a place to post questions, it is not just a place to insult others and it is CERTAINLY not a place for people like BigBusa to come to attack Klipsch, its loyal users including myself, the people that come here to help others for free (also like myself) or to make evil and false statements against Klipsch products or anything else for that matter. I hate to jump onto the America is so beautiful bandwagon, (we should not have to hop on in time of need but should ride through times of good and bad), but does anyone here get onto the internet to read people's lies or does anyone come to this BB to watch one person attack an another innocent person like Amy or even someone who bought a PM speaker? NO. People come to this BB to help and get help. Note the keyword there... Help.

I just bought an MTV palm sized radio for my 2.1's. Now, would it seem logical for me to go to MTV.com, sign up to join their BB and pos one thread saying that the product worked and for them to not worry about me cause all is well? NO. Let's just say that i bring home the MTV palm sized radio and find out that the power button sticks and i can not get it to turn off... NOW would i sign up on to MTV.com's BB and post a comment? Why yes of course. Ok, another situation. Lets say i visited the MTV.com BB and saw that 7 ppl posted problems with teh pwoer button sticking and there were only 15 posts shown at the time due to default settings on the UBB preferences. Would I just jump in and start complaining on behalf of the 7 out of 15 posters who are having sticky power buttons? Would i claim that 47% of the MTV palm sized radio's were defective and MTV shoudl make a recall and send everyone, even those who did not have a problem, the new India Aire CD? No WAY! I would say... let's look into this a little deeper and see if it is out of 15 NEW posts or did 7 people or less just post their problems into older threads and now that the problem has been fixed, have started to talk about the new Mya appacella music video just released the night before. Theni would realized that only 5 people had actually had a problem, 2 of them posted the problem twice.

This could go on and on, just like the lies and attacking you BigBusa seem to never cease to put out, but I will stop now before i get even more off topic. Stop and decease your STUPID posts. If statistics seem to always be on your side... let us do a little vote right here, right now. Go to EVERY PROMEDIA FORUM (there are more than the 5 listed here.. there are archives at your desposal), read EVERY positive post, from EVERY poster, then compare it to the negative posts, and then subtract from the negative posts those that have been resolved to computer or other type problems. Give us that number. Then lets do another tally... how many ppl on this BB think that you are right in all aspects of yourself, lies and attacks included. Now, lets compare that number with those who stand by myself and the other Klipsch owners who believe that Klipsch has changed teh multimedia world with amazing speakers, and also feel that you are out of line. Once again, i believe Klipsch will win.

It is people like you that make me want to leave this BB and find another. And just to settle the reason why i spend a lot of time on this BB so people like CivicRyder can give me a break. I have epilepsy. I have 3-5 cists, 2 large ones, on my brain and it has changed my life completely, went from head trupmeet in teh marching band, top 5% of my class, basketball and soccer player to nothing. I spent over weeks in the hospital last year from august to december, overnight stays. I missed more of the 1st semester of school than i was in it. for over 4 weeks i could not walk. I lost many friends to this who beleived i was faking migrains, epileptic attacks, and schitzophrenia type actions. The BB was all i had. This is the first year in about 2 that i have been able to live a somewhat normal life. The medicine i take has terrible side effects, some where i can not get up in the mornings. What else would i do all day in a house all alone, just me and my cat and dog? So i would go to this BB and learn, teach, and help. PPL like theears and CivicRyder thought i just wanted more points on my counter, when i was just trying to somehow get a support group, even though they might not know it. I felt useless, this made me feel useful. i have made more friends on this BB than anywhere else, friends that do not turn on me and tell my other friends lies about my health. and i will not give that up because of people like you who just do not get it.

this is not meat to be an iron lung post but i figured i might was well get it out into the open why i spend so much time here and why there are more pesimistic posts then optimistic and why you, BigBusa need to stop what you are doing. Nothing good can come from it. It was not easy for me to say what i said in the last part of my post, only two people on this BB know anything about that.

I am finished now, and i hoep you BigBusa are too.

------------------

-justin

I am an amateur, if it is professional;

ProMedia help you want email Amy or call her @ 1-888-554-5665

Klipsch Home Audio help you want, email support@klipsch.com or call @ 1-800-KLIPSCH

RA# Fax Number=317-860-9140 / Parts Department Fax Number=317-860-9150

[clandeggen]

My 4.1s works Great and sound good, had em for about 6 months. Whats the Beef?

You cannot confirm that mine works, but I cannot confirm you went at a bad go of it.

Or are you just the compitition and just bad mouthing? But again I cannot confirm it and you cannot disprove it.

BTY Big Busa, I notice yer from Up State NY, I grew up in Binghamton NY.

This message has been edited by clandeggen on 12-22-2001 at 12:37 AM

[gabriel11]

You go Justin...

[gabriel11]

Sorry Big...I was counting the number of replies to the 40 posts. My mistake.

[BigBusa]

Justin I'm not messing with you personally. I understand where you're coming from. I think you've made quite a good name for yourself here helping everyone here that asks. You are a still a klipsch groupie though!

------------------

My system thus far:

1980 Cornwalls (mains)

1990 Heresy II's (rears)

2001 KLF-C7 (center)

2001 KSW15 (Subwoofer)

NOTHING-Thanks for NOTHING UBid!(No reciever)

Kenwood DV402 (DVD)

Sony KV 27V55 (9 year old 27" TV still kickin')

:eyes