Matching Klipsch Speakers

[IDOXLR8]

I have a set of KG 5.5, KG 1.5 and a RC 35, SW 10, Velodyne F-1800R, and a SW-10. The RC 35 does not seem to match the sound for some reason. I thought about going to a RC7 or a Academy center channel and thought this may match better then the RC 35. Any thoughts on this? AL.

[theplummer]

The referance series speakers do have a different sound. They sound good, but they sound different than What I would call your KG series. I refer to them as Extended Heritage. An Academy would probably fill that bill nicely, though their kinda pricy. Do you have room for another KG laying on its side.

[bhendrix]

The Klipsch web site shows the KV-3 as a matching center:

http://www.klipsch.com/products/discontinued/details/kv-3.aspx

[IDOXLR8]

How would the Academy center work with the KG 5.5?

[IDOXLR8]

Wow! I wish I did! Have heard a Academy center played near a KG 5.5? I'm looking into a Academy center now because I think the KLF-C7 is a real hard find, AL.

[colterphoto1]

KLF-C7 will SMOKE an Academy. Sorry gang, I have both and have A/B'd them

[bhendrix]

KLF-C7 will SMOKE an Academy. Sorry gang, I have both and have A/B'd them

I agree with Michael. I have both and the KLF-C7 is better.

[theplummer]

KLF-C7 will SMOKE an Academy. Sorry gang, I have both and have A/B'd them

I agree with Michael. I have both and the KLF-C7 is better.

by looking the C7 runs a little hotter and doesn't dig quite as deep. Isn't it amazing how image doesn't always follow performance.

[IDOXLR8]

KLF-C7 will SMOKE an Academy. Sorry gang, I have both and have A/B'd them

I agree with Michael. I have both and the KLF-C7 is better.

by looking the C7 runs a little hotter and doesn't dig quite as deep. Isn't it amazing how image doesn't always follow performance.

I tried to understand your last post, as far a running hotter, do you mean power usage and dig deeper do you mean bass and are you saying the KLF-C7 are better in imaging and or performance, sorry for the missunderstaning, Thanks AL.

[SilverSport]

Interesting...I had both and found the Academy a bit better (but not much)...of course the popbumpered Academy against the KLF C7 was even better...

Bill

[theplummer]

KLF-C7 will SMOKE an Academy. Sorry gang, I have both and have A/B'd them

I agree with Michael. I have both and the KLF-C7 is better.

by looking the C7 runs a little hotter and doesn't dig quite as deep. Isn't it amazing how image doesn't always follow performance.

I tried to understand your last post, as far a running hotter, do you mean power usage and dig deeper do you mean bass and are you saying the KLF-C7 are better in imaging and or performance, sorry for the missunderstaning, Thanks AL.

I'm glad you asked, I'm not a professional sound man, engineer, or anything else that matters in this field, but I am a student of the human intellect. What I mean by that is, when I don't understand something that interests me, I tend to investigate things heavily and come to my own conclusions before I ask any questions.

This leads me to the following. I'll pre-warn you this could get lengthy.

The term "Running hotter", I've found to be slang for "more efficient". (from Memory) The academy is 94db efficient, where at the KLF-C7 is 99db efficient. In a direct a/b comparison, the C7 is going to perform better because it will be louder because it's more efficient (it takes less power to drive it to a certain volume). During a A/B comparison, there is no decrease in amplifier output, only switching speakers. So, when comparing two different speakers with two different efficiency ratings, the lower efficiency one is going to appear to be lacking.

Now, if you compare the frequency range of both speakers, the Academy out performs the C7, because it "dig's Deeper". Meaning, that it will re-produce a lower Hz frequency than the C7 does, +/- 3db. This is quickly becoming a very unusable spec to me. Because, the standard cutoff for where a speaker tends to drop off is -3db. the specs don't take into account that the speaker may produce the sound an entire octave lower at -4or5db. And that's not an audible difference. I'll give a direct example. When comparing a Chorus speaker to a Forte, it is a common misconception that the Forte produces a lower frequency than the Chorus does. I'll argue that all day long. I will agree that the forte has a flatter frequency response lower than the Chorus, but it falls off faster then the chorus when it does finally fall off. I don't have any statistical measurements to back this up, but, I own both speakers and I will tell you that the Chorus has a much deeper range than the Forte, it's just not as flat as the Forte.

To back up this theory, take a look at many subwoofer specs. Many subwoofers only go down to somewhere in the 30hz range, +/-3db, but then you'll see a side note that the sub goes down to 19hz +/-10db. What that means IMHO is that the sub is flat to the 30hz range, but it only drops a little as the range falls to the 20hz range, this is still a very usable sub. That's exactly what I feel is happening with the Forte Chorus arguement. I'll bet you could have the same arguement between the Academy / C7 comparison. It'd be interesting to see a complete graph of both speakers to see exactly what is going on.

[IDOXLR8]

Now I confused, popbumper? this is a new one on me. I've heard of a "popper stopper" to delay amplifier power up but a popbumper? My big thing here is to match a set of KG series towers to a center channel speaker and the RC-35 was a not a good match. The differences I've seen between the Acadamy and the KLF-C7 was the driver size and the Acadamy has a much smaller horn. As I posted earlier the RC-65 sounded "muffled playing next to the KG towers. Now to decide between the Academy or the KLF-C7 center, eather way it would be a better match then the RC-35 and between the the Acdamy and the KLF-C7 I really can't go wrong, could I? Thanks AL.

[IDOXLR8]

KLF-C7 will SMOKE an Academy. Sorry gang, I have both and have A/B'd them

I agree with Michael. I have both and the KLF-C7 is better.

by looking the C7 runs a little hotter and doesn't dig quite as deep. Isn't it amazing how image doesn't always follow performance.

I tried to understand your last post, as far a running hotter, do you mean power usage and dig deeper do you mean bass and are you saying the KLF-C7 are better in imaging and or performance, sorry for the missunderstaning, Thanks AL.

I'm glad you asked, I'm not a professional sound man, engineer, or anything else that matters in this field, but I am a student of the human intellect. What I mean by that is, when I don't understand something that interests me, I tend to investigate things heavily and come to my own conclusions before I ask any questions.

This leads me to the following. I'll pre-warn you this could get lengthy.

The term "Running hotter", I've found to be slang for "more efficient". (from Memory) The academy is 94db efficient, where at the KLF-C7 is 99db efficient. In a direct a/b comparison, the C7 is going to perform better because it will be louder because it's more efficient (it takes less power to drive it to a certain volume). During a A/B comparison, there is no decrease in amplifier output, only switching speakers. So, when comparing two different speakers with two different efficiency ratings, the lower efficiency one is going to appear to be lacking.

Now, if you compare the frequency range of both speakers, the Academy out performs the C7, because it "dig's Deeper". Meaning, that it will re-produce a lower Hz frequency than the C7 does, +/- 3db. This is quickly becoming a very unusable spec to me. Because, the standard cutoff for where a speaker tends to drop off is -3db. the specs don't take into account that the speaker may produce the sound an entire octave lower at -4or5db. And that's not an audible difference. I'll give a direct example. When comparing a Chorus speaker to a Forte, it is a common misconception that the Forte produces a lower frequency than the Chorus does. I'll argue that all day long. I will agree that the forte has a flatter frequency response lower than the Chorus, but it falls off faster then the chorus when it does finally fall off. I don't have any statistical measurements to back this up, but, I own both speakers and I will tell you that the Chorus has a much deeper range than the Forte, it's just not as flat as the Forte.

To back up this theory, take a look at many subwoofer specs. Many subwoofers only go down to somewhere in the 30hz range, +/-3db, but then you'll see a side note that the sub goes down to 19hz +/-10db. What that means IMHO is that the sub is flat to the 30hz range, but it only drops a little as the range falls to the 20hz range, this is still a very usable sub. That's exactly what I feel is happening with the Forte Chorus arguement. I'll bet you could have the same arguement between the Academy / C7 comparison. It'd be interesting to see a complete graph of both speakers to see exactly what is going on.

Excellent Response!!! Thanks! I'm will be buying one of the two (really can't go wrong with these to top of the line models). The models are no longer in production so I can't be real picky. In your option what would be your pick to match the KG 5.5 and KG 1.5 for a suround system. The RC-35 sounds like #&^% next to the KGs, AL.

[rockbobmel]

CAUTION!, I bought 2 KLF-C7s and had to send them both back. The magnet structure on the woofers (Both in 1) (1 in the other) shifted and they sounded blown. This was because of shipping, I think. When you have a heavy speaker like this shipped (especially with stamped steel frame woofers), they damage easily. You may want to have it insured and double wrapped and double boxed.........expensive. I ended up with an RC-7. Not to rain on your parade, just caution.

[theplummer]

I believe that either speaker will do very well for you, I'd probably let price motivate that purchase. Again, would it be possible to use another Kg 5.5 laying on its side, under your television. This would be the absolute match, both in efficiency and timbre match, not to mention a pair of Kg's could probably be had for less than either of the Academy's or C7. I just saw a Academy go for $503 on ebay and there is another in St. Louis listed right now. if you'd buy that one, maybe I could help you in obtaining it, inspecting it or whatever. I don't know where your from.

[IDOXLR8]

Thanks! I sent this guy a few questios and seem to a excellent member. No questions the unit will be big $$$$ at the finish, AL.

[IDOXLR8]

Okay now I'm really going to stir something up. What it I took my RC-35 and removed the two main drivers and replaced them with new Klipsch 330-0107 drivers, any toughts? AL.

[IDOXLR8]

Well, I found a KV-3 and will play it against my KG-5.5 and KG-1.5 and hope it works out as far as a good sound match. I have not got it yet and I will post on how this sounds when I do. Klipsch notes on the web page that this (KV-3) is the one that matches what I have. Has anyone played a set up with KG-5.5, KG-1.5 and a KV-3?

[guitarman]

Rather than start a new thread, I thought I'd jump in on this with a question of my own. I have Forte II for my mains and a Tangent Theater for my center. Is there anything I can do to the Theater to help it match the Forte's? BTW, I do have Bob Crites building some new crossovers for the Forte's. (You are building them right, Bob?[]) Also ordered the new titanium diaphragms. So I'm guessing the sound of the Forte's will change slightly. This does mean I'll have two (albiet 3-way) original crossovers on hand (parts?) and two original tweeter diaphragms.

No, I don't want to replace the Tangent with an Acedemy (too expensive) or anything else. I'm thinking along the lines of changing the crossover frequency to better match the Forte's and/or replacing the tweeter with the one from the Forte (I will need a horn.....where can I find one that will mount the old diaphragm?...and I don't mind cutting...).

Is this exercise even worth the time? If it becomes to involved/expensive, I'll just live with what I have.....Thanks for the help....

FORTE II specs

frequency response

32Hz-20kHz±3dB

power handling

100 watts maximum continuous (500 watts peak)

sensitivity

99dB @ 1watt/1meter

maximum acoustic output

119dB SPL

max acoustic output

119dB SPL

nominal impedance

8 ohms

crossover frequency

HF 7,000 Hz
LF 650 Hz

tweeter

K-75-K 1" (2.54cm) Polymer diaphragm compression driver

high frequency horn

90°x40° Exponential Horn

midrange

K-61-K 1.5" (3.81cm) Phenolic diaphragm compression driver

mid frequency horn

90°x40° Tractrix® Horn

woofer

K-25-K 12" (30.48cm) Fiber-composite cone active / KD-15 15" (38.1cm) Fiber-composite cone passive

enclosure material

Medium density fiberboard construction (MDF)

enclosure type

Bass reflex via passive radiator

dimensions

35.4" (89.92cm) x 16.5" (41.9cm) x 12.25" (31.1cm)

weight

67 lbs. (30.42kg)

finishes

Walnut Oil, Oak Oil, Oak Clear, Finished Black

built from

1989

built until

1996

TANGENT THEATER specs

frequency response

45Hz-20kHz±3dB

power handling

75 watts maximum continuous (375 watts peak)

sensitivity

95dB @ 1watt/1meter

nominal impedance

8 ohms

tweeter

K-87-KV 1" (2.54cm) Polymer dome

high frequency horn

Dhorm

woofer

Two K-1014-KV 6.5" (16.51cm) Poly cones

enclosure material

Medium density fiberboard construction (MDF)

enclosure type

Bass reflex via rear-mounted port

dimensions

23.1" (58.7cm) x 10.9" (27.7cm) x 9.6" (24.4cm)

weight

28 lbs. (12.7kg)

finishes

Matte-finish Black vinyl

built from

1993

built until

1994

[guitarman]

Well, I just got the crossovers from Bob. Wow, they are really nice! Thanks Bob. Very high quality. So now I've got something to do this weekend........