triceratops Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Hi Folks, I have the opportunity to buy a Thorens TD-124 locally. It looks to be in nice shape cosmetically--the factory plinth has a few nicks and scratches but the enamel finish on the table itself is very clean. The tonearm is an SME 3009 Type II Improved and the cartridge is an Audio Technica AT14SA. It does not have a dust cover and doesn't appear to have ever had one mounted. The price is $750. Is this a good or great deal, or about the average price these days? On the plus side, it is local--so no shipping and I can check it out before buying. On the minus side, the SME 3009 Type II improved is the same arm I already own on my TD-125 Mark II. I realize that the "improved" arm is less desirable and has nylon bearings, so it is not as sturdy as the non-improved version. Any advice would be appreciated as soon as possible--I will hopefully see the turntable Tuesday morning (8/12/2008). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudret Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Go for it. I think it is a very good deal. As you said the improved version of 3009 is less desirable. You can sell it for $200-300 and end up owning a Thorens TD 124 for around $500. Not having to ship is also a bonus. Plinth and dust cover are minor issues. You can later purchase a better plinth for it and dustcover in my opinion is not necessary. Good luck. Kudret Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garymd Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 John, See Fini's post. Good luck! - Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 John, Hi! From the picture it looks like a nice table! I'd first check to see that it spins. See how long it takes to get up to speed (the strobe is seen in a mirror right on the front). The less time, the better. Turn it off (turn the speed selector yo zero), and see how long it takes to wind down to a complete stop. 30 seconds is good, longer is better. Try out the clutch mechanism(on the left side) with the motor on and the platter spinning, to see if the upper platter (a thin aluminum shell) lifts up and stops spinning (while the main, heavy platter continues to spin underneath). Remove the upper platter (it just lifts off) and inspect it for warpage. Ckeck the main platter as it spins for any wobble, or "run out." Check underneath (make sure you hold the platter in, and only tip the table about 45 degrees, so you don't leak lubricant out of the spindle well). You're looking for leaky gunk around the motor, any corrosion, etc. Ask if you can remove the lower platter. Carefully and evenly lift the platter straight up, and set it upside down on a protective surface. Peer down into the spindle well, and see if there's lubricant in there. Also, look to see if there's a dimple in the thrust pad (a nylon disc at the bottom of the well). Most likely, there will be one. The pads are easily replaceable. Check also to see if the bearings in that well are nylon (dark gray) or bronze (better). Those are easily replaced/upgraded, too. Also, while the platter is off, check the motor mounts (3 rubber grommets), and the wokings of all the pulleys/idler wheel, and linkages. It should all work smoothly. Inspect the idler wheel (black rubber) for any obvious flat spots (caused by storing the turntable with the idler wheel engaged, pressing on the stepped pulley. It might be interesting to check to see if the speed knob is on zero when you first arrive, as a clue to how it may have been stored). See how it plays! You're familiar with the arm, so give it a good look. I agree: You could easily sell it (what to replace it with? I have a vintage Ortofon RS-212, with a Denon 103 on mine) and recoup some of your money. Now, all of these things can be fixed if there is a problem. The fewer problems, the better the deal (duh!), but if there are significant problems (a warped main platter would be major), you might try to negotiate. The plinth (just like the one that I bought) looks fine. If you haven't already done so, check out Steve Clarke's excellent TD-124 pages: http://www.theanalogdept.com/td124_dept.htm Especially check out his TD-124 restoration project. I will be spending time this morning in doctors' offices (pre-op for my wife), but you can call me on my cell (check your email). I'll be busy ~10:30-2 (with a break in the middle), but call anyway. If I don't answer, leave a message and I'll return the call when I'm able. Oh, will the seller give you some sort of guarantee, so you can try it in your home? Good luck!! I know how exciting this will be for you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie dave Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 That is a good price, and local as well! If it checks out, I think you will be doing well to get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 I just heard from John a while ago. He's bringing the baby home as I type this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triceratops Posted August 13, 2008 Author Share Posted August 13, 2008 Yes, as Fini said, I pulled the trigger! Thanks to Gary, Kudret, Dave, and Fini for their timely advice on this turntable. Also a special thanks to Fini for the detailed inspection advice and the on-site consultation by phone! There is one problem with this piece--it does not run at the correct speed according to the strobe. The speed adjuster works but won't bring it into range. Fini noted that there is an internal speed adjustment, so I'm hoping that does the trick. Other than that glitch the turntable looks and plays great, and is very quiet! Coast-down time is about 40 seconds and the outer platter is straight and true. I didn't have the guts to pull out the inner platter, but I looked underneath and everything looked clean and tidy. The table was serviced by a local tech in 2006 for a seized motor and idler wheel (it had been sitting for a while). He got them unstuck, cleaned, and lubed and advised regular usage. I will start another thread and put up photos in the next few days. Again, thanks to everybody. I would not have even been aware of the Thorens TD-124 if I hadn't read about it on this Forum. Best in horns, triceratops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted August 13, 2008 Share Posted August 13, 2008 triceratops, Congrats, and you're welcome! For bedtime reading, here's the info on adusting the speed: The Thorens TD124 Eddy Current Brake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garymd Posted August 13, 2008 Share Posted August 13, 2008 Congrats John! Sounds like you got a very good deal. Are you keeping the A/T cart for the time being? Please keep us posted and let us know how she sounds in your system. Good luck with the speed issue. Does it only happen on 33 1/3 or do you get similar results on 45 and 78? After reading Fini's post yesterday, I tested my platter last night and it was coming to a stop after about a minute. Also, I've been meaning to post that my table now comes to speed after only about 10 seconds. For the longest time, it seemed to take between one and five minutes to stabilize. Any idea Fini why/how this could suddenly happen? Not that I'm complaining. Could it be that I had too much Mobile 1 or the consistency changed over time? Maybe with the warm weather the oil is thinner? Very strange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted August 13, 2008 Share Posted August 13, 2008 Could it be that I had too much Mobile 1 or the consistency changed over time? Maybe with the warm weather the oil is thinner? Very strange. That sounds reasonable. Also, I'd think the more you use it, the less stiff it would be. Kinda like our old bones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triceratops Posted August 13, 2008 Author Share Posted August 13, 2008 Fini- Thanks for the Eddy Current Brake reference--it looks pretty straightforward. I'll have to dig out my old feeler gauges! Any idea how much adjustment is in the fine tuner in the center of the speed knob? Does it turn in a limited range (e.g. one rotation)? Dave- Yes I will try the AT cartridge first. My experience with AT is limited to their inexpensive cartridges decades ago. I can swap out the headshell with my other SME arm which has an ancient B&O SP-12. I bought a Denon DL-103 from the German guy on Ebay a couple years ago and it is still in the box. I bought that cartridge before I learned that it is not a good match for the improved arm, so I never unwrapped or installed it. I may try to sell that as well as some of my other turntables to help subsidize this purchase. In regards to the speed problem, both 33 and 45 rpm are affected. I haven't tried 78 yet. I'll probably wait until the weekend to mess with it. Best in horns, triceratops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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