Chris A

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B000005YUP/ref=pd_bbs_sr_olp_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1205534017&sr=8-1 $2.50 + $2.98 shipping.

Thanks, I'm not into street racing but I do open my home to folks that want to hear a pair of Jubs since they're pretty scarce in stores. Shoot me a PM - let's set a date for a "shoot out" at my place. Maybe the "Kia's" have a chance in this story. "Kia" Chris

You ought to hear this on Jubs...it's really good.http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/t/20164.aspx?PageIndex=3 Chris

Hey Travis,Seen any new Jubs lately? Chris

I have to agree - some of my favorite material is almost unlistenable by modern standards - recordings from the early 50s and 60s, and virtually all of those are classical performances from performers that are now legends. Even Coltrane's recordings aren't much in terms of audiophile recording quality but they are incredible if you're in the right mood to just listen to what he is actually doing. The list of such notable-but-poorly-recorded albums is a long one indeed.

Remember that PWK reportedly stated that he designed loudspeakers for the 1% or less of the households that wanted good music. One percent of that “hit-driven” market apparently did not translate into higher quality recordings from the record companies then, and their culture apparently hasn't changed even today. The economics of the market are now much different. Nowadays music recording, mastering, and even limited CD production can occur in converted garages using comparatively cost-free gear. I recommend the book "The Long Tail" by Chris Anderson. The big record companies may not survive if they do not adapt to the new marketplace. Meanwhile, the typical consumer puts up with (or even prefers) Loudness War mp3s ripped at low bit rates. Fortunately, the Long Tail has also provided a safe sanctuary for audiophile-quality recordings due to the nearly zero distribution costs of online sales.

Speculation only: in the 50s and 60s, recording technologies such as stereo were becoming standard practice. Advancement in recording engineering practice was apparently occurring at an irregular pace, at least through inspection of recordings from that era. I suspect that some engineers used infrasonic filters in large halls and some did not. I would guess that large-hall reverberation time is what you are listening to, and perhaps poorly isolated mikes, especially if you are referring to recordings in cathedrals and older auditoriums that were built without the benefit of sound reinforcement systems: Carnegie Hall comes to mind here. Some halls are designed for extremely large reverberation times, especially those designed for pipe organ performance. These issues are still an issue in most large venues but the tools of the trade--high-order filters and post-processing--make it easier or cheaper for the recording or mixing engineer to address than was the state-of-the-art then. I'm also thinking that the RIAA-curve problem, i.e., keeping the needle in the groove and keeping ultra-lf feedback from affecting TT cartridge performance, forced many engineers to think about whether to use the low-cut filters or not. TT cartridge technology with near-DC-to-20 kHz+ capabilities really advanced in the late 60s through the 70s. I can also see that there were, even then, recording purists that tried to minimize anything in the recording loop, because the quality of so many devices and interconnects wasn't exactly what you find today. Additionally, most home sound reproduction systems of the day simply did not have the lf performance of many systems today. I don’t remember hearing about “subwoofers” coming into wide home use until the 1970s-80s. Powerful SS amplifiers were coming into widespread use in the late 60s. Before that, it seems to me that we had transformer-coupled tube amplifiers that were designed to block extreme lf content because they couldn’t keep up with that infrasonic content unless using higher-sensitivity speaker systems, i.e., large and expensive speakers. Most home systems couldn’t economically reproduce those infrasonic frequencies, so record consumers didn't notice the issue. One more thought: many papers were written on group delay and modulation distortion in the late 60s/early 70s, including one or two by PWK. Many recording engineers probably did not understand that those infrasonic frequencies were affecting sound reproduction at higher frequencies-so they left the infrasonic content in. Chris

Richard,While it is clearly opinion on whether or not to use the full spectrum of the English language to describe speaker or sound reproduction system performance, I believe there is at least one "50,000 foot" view here: think about art, wine, interior decorating, or even the use of the English language (e.g., W.F. Buckley factor), I think some people actually like the use of language to describe phenomena which I would probably use different, more technically oriented words to describe. For instance, I see comments about "timbre" and "loudspeaker matching". Clearly, these terms just do not compute for me but that is a function of who I am and where I came from. Others like to use the terms "bright", "fast", "punchy", etc. All these terms mean to me is that the speakers are putting something into the music that probably wasn't in the original recording. (This is a domain that Roy D. could probably give you a dissertation on and is probably a big part of how he makes his living.) Think of it this way: if the reference standard were to have perfect reproduction then all the best speakers in the world would sound exactly alike and they would sound just like the real performance (i.e., indistinguishable in "behind the curtain" tests). But people typically interject all these extra terms to describe what they hear. As I understand it, rating high-end speakers that are very neutral-sounding is a somewhat boring profession. I think that the reviewers do everything they can to make it otherwise. To me, my sound reproduction system should reproduce the recorded performance as closely as possible, and I wouldn't like to be the one that rates them. So when you see one speaker being touted over another one, understand it's just like wine or art - it pretty much all boils down to opinion, and opinions are not debatable where I come from - they are what they are - and everyone's got one. Regards, Chris P.S. Note that when people go to buy something that has competitive products on the open market, they tend to use comparative judgments to maximize their apparent value--paradoxically, even if they subsequently don't benefit from those attributes in use--but when we take those products home, we tend to use logic that asks "is it good enough?". Only those chosen few that are constantly worried about whether or not their purchase was the "best one" typically go on to selling/buying/selling cycles, and they probably will never be truly satisfied for long. Those people are typically called "maximizers" where I come from. There was a very good short article in Scientific American magazine a couple of years ago on that very subject.

Flight of the Cosmic Hippo, Béla Fleck and the Flecktones, Warner Bros., 1991

Thanks guys--I had a lot of fun. My offer is still out there for Klipsch connoisseurs to come for a listen. If you can make it to the D/FW area, just send me a PM and we’ll make some plans. Chris A.

See: http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/p/99200/1001594.aspx#1001594

Another source of information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Class_T_amplifier

Chris,You have a PM. Chris A.

You're not the only one. I've only heard them in mono! Well, I think we can remedy that. Send a personal message (PM) my way - lets make some plans. Chris

Ahh, that faint orange glow and that familiar updraft of hot air rising on a hot August night....Well, believe it or not, I think that Mr. Carlton's link is your best bet, because the tube meme hasn't infected me yet (and probably not anytime soon). However, if you want to hear some really killer blackies-in-the-corners, I''ve got a pair of Jubilees running on Crown XTi SS whizbangs. (...bad Chris, bad Chris) You're welcome to come hear those... (...bad Chris, bad Chris). Chris P.S., You might be ruined for life...

I just wanted to reaffirm my offer to audition Jubilees in the Dallas/Fort Worth area. If you are interested, just PM me to set up a date/time. Chris

I haven't dug into the HORNRESP model to understand what it is modeling and what assumptions it is making. I have seen that real horns have response that is typically outside of the passband predicted in the models. I'll leave those arguments to the pundits online here. The first curve posted in the pdf file above is said to be anechoic measurements for both lf bins tested separately in the Klipsch chamber and provided to the forum by Mr. Roy Delgado. I don't remember the thread name or the date, however. Chris

The bass bins only - free response (i.e., no corners or floor).khjub.pdf

I may have contact information that you don't have. Gary was very ill in October when I bought a pair of his corner horns--which are beautifully made. Send me a PM if you are still interested. Chris

Clearly, this phenomenon is at least partly responsible for the resurgence of vinyl. What bothers me is that this is the first time I've heard a big-name jazz artist use compression-Wynton Marsalis. I've started buying "old version" CDs from resalers online. There seem to be a few recording labels that don't seem to do this--I've to yet find a Chesky or Reference CD that does this. I'm sure there are others. One way to help slow the "Loudness War" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war) is to stop buying any music that uses compression and send emails to the recording companies that use it. One way to apparently deal with loudness war music that you have already is to use something to fix the loudness to reference levels: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Replay_Gain . Chris

One unit has more than enough driver area to match two Jubs and it is very compact considering the size of its drivers, but not so compact in terms of WAF--40"x36"x40"--which will get your attention. I'm not sure how to integrate into a room in those proportions. [The Danley DTS-20 looks better from a room integratability standpoint but it doesn't have the driver area, or a competitive price when used in pairs to match mouth areas. I also don't see THD numbers for the Danley.]Actually, the price is good when stacked up against multiple Epik Conquests, although it's higher than I would like to see. I haven't seen any tests to understand its output and THD. They boast about their phase response a bit--it looks like an acoustic suspension (closed box) system. For home use, this would be great, but for commercial use, I would think internal heating would be an issue. I don't see a lot of home enthusiasts talking about them. Do you know anyone that owns one? Addendum: I would also consider the Bag End Quartz (4x18" woofers) at less cost - though not greatly smaller than the Bassault-R. Both units need amplifiers.

Wayne, you're very welcome and thanks for the kind words. I enjoyed meeting you and your friends. When you're through D/FW in the future, drop in. I hope your Jub experience is as satisfying for you as it's been for me. Enjoy.

One issue that has been discussed on these forums is: "what do we do about so-so recorded music". I'm wondering what other people do to enhance their CDs or vinyl that has music we love but that is now more difficult to listen to because we now own other music that has been recorded that is much higher quality, and that we now own much better home music systems than before. What do you do to enhance these "not so good" recordings?

I don't doubt that mixing engineers do their own equalization - I believe the issue is whether or not the reproducing sub has enough capability to do so, such that the at-home listener can hear it without harmonic distortion taking over the sensory experience. I think many people are actually listening to their subs reproduce the octave-above harmonic, but they have trouble hearing the fundamental because their sub's SPL output levels below 20-25 Hz is lower than threshold on the "F-M" curves for human hearing.I don't doubt that people can be taught to hear those harmonics - I believe that I am aware of those harmonics, especially at levels that I typically hear from many off-the-shelf subs including commercial ones. The real issue is what people commonly perceive as "low bass". Most people do not take the time or effort necessary to train their ears to hear the harmonics. Most college music majors are obliged to, however...