Ski Bum
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Looks pristine! [Folks, this is a good one. Gobs of power-several hundred clean watts; very useful tone controls and eq features, almost ideal for Heritage monkey coffins.] GLWS!
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I'll post THIS link again since it's relevant to the topic of imaging/soundstage. It's quite effective.
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Cane grille Heritage (??) in AMC's Preacher, s1e6:
(That particular episode has one of the best opening scenes I've ever seen, hilariously over the top.)
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23 minutes ago, mkane said:
Get Better Sound by Jim Smith is a good read.
If you like fairy tales, perhaps. (Ok, some of it is actually worthwhile, but he treads deeply in audiophool BS.)
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Try the fortes fairly deep in the corners, heavily toed in. Choose whichever wall, long or short, such that the speaker axes cross in front of the listening position. Fortes may not provide bass as tight, but 'Scalas will never dig as deep. The small room and application of a bit more wattage should do the trick.
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Fortes should be great in that size room. What specifically seems to be lacking?
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17 minutes ago, dtr20 said:
The tangent 400 uses heresy II drivers/crossovers. I have h700s (heresy I, essentially). I do not know how to "model" this, I don't even know what that means. Does it have something to do with software?
Ok, you're just fine with that (Klipsch has already done the modeling for you when they developed the product). Modeling simply means calculating the low end response based on driver t/s parameters and the specifics of the cab, and yes, there are programs for that.
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Low end extension is all the drivers and cabs. The networks would only cut higher frequencies from the woofs.
Do the Tangent cabs normally come equipped with the same woofer as the ones you'll be using? (Too lazy to look myself) Woof's t/s specs dictate cab parameters. If they're in fact not the same drivers, you may want to model this to see if it's worth pursuing.
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Not in agreement on the idea that parafeed (as Doc B. used the term) do not have the clarity of traditional SET. Quite the contrary in my experience, actually. I built Lessard's Horus....what was it, something like ten years or so ago now? And discussed my observations about it's absolutely stellar performance in terms of those very elements - extreme clarity compared to the other SET amps I had been using before I built the Horus -- and then a modified version of the same circuit. The other amps were the classic Welborne Labs Moondogs, which I still own. I also bought the Moth Audi si2a3 from Moth Audio's Craig U. (now of Eddie Current) in the form of a chassis, transformers, and box of parts. The Moth is direct coupled, and came closer to the sound of an OTL, but not so much as the Parallel feed Horus.
DRDs are also very fine, and I built both the 2a3 and 45 versions for users in other countries. DRD combines direct and interstage coupling, along with the so-called Ultrapath connection on the output. That was designer Jack Eliano's term for it, but it is not new (nor is parafeed, for that matter). Both go back to the very early years of tube audio. I mentioned all of this years ago here, when writing under another handle.
Sorry Eric, I was referring to the Vaughn authored pieces, mainly the second one where he goes into some detail about the benefits and limitations of the various types of opt for pp vs. se amps. The inference (which I drew) was that the parafeed type would suffer the same sort of zero-point hysteresis as pp types. Happy to be wrong about the sound in that case. As to the terms "kooky clarity" and "better" and such, I'm in full agreement. Those terms could very well be referring to high distortion, given my preferences and what I've seen on the scope! I do prefer SE types, but the desire for stronger bass has me wondering about the parafeed approach (larger room these days).
Do you still have all the amps you've built? Care to sell the Horus to a lazy bum? (Just kidding. Ok, half serious.) There may not be much discussion here, but when Maynard and Eric are contributing, it's quality. Thanks, dudes!
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Interesting comments from Vaughn on the parafeed style output (last page of the second article). Is it true that parafeed amps don't offer the clarity and detail of a traditional SE arrangement (presumably due to DC offset in the opt, keeping it charged at all times, unlike a parafeed, which has to switch polarity just as the pp opts do)? Seems he prefers traditional air gapped se opt (or otl, reading between the lines).
Whatever happened to that guy, anyway?
I've been curious about the parafeed approach, considering building a cheap version, or, if more money appears in my account, maybe a full blown Horus with the Magnaquest iron, but not if it can't out-do that kooky crystal clarity of a plain ol' tranny coupled SET. Thoughts? I know that you guys have lots of actual experience with these variants.
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Those single ended practice amps like the Fenders are kind of fun (Champ? Chief? Can't remember the model name). They don't get too loud, but the trade off is that they'll overload at low, practice type volumes, which is really fun.
Don't laugh, but I've also had a lot of fun with the newer dsp "modeling" amps like the Fender Mustang. While not quite the tone-meister as real tubes, they did a remarkable job trying, and the thing is gobs of fun to play with.
They're both cheap options, but would get you rolling.
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Northern Colorado: The Sound Doctor in Loveland...authorized repair for all the biggies, so there is invariably a back-log of work (about two weeks generally, which isn't bad). He likes to work on the old stuff too, including tube gear, although he's more of a ss person. He has an Ampzilla in his own primary rig. Real nice fellow too.
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seems like all the pro amp manufacturers fudge the numbers
What is the required input voltage for full output of the Crown amp? Do your pre-outs provide that requisite voltage?
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It necessitates a network mod.
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Despite the salesmanship, you're asking a fairly good chunk of change for it. Don't get me wrong, the price seems fair. Have some patience, that's all. It's only been four days at a low traffic forum.
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Wow. That's a lot of speaker for the money! Good luck with your sale. Really cool! How do you have the Vifa ring radiator tweeters integrated? Crossover?
I have them crossed over at a specific frequency using an oil-filled cap. I have 2 sets of caps available to tweak the crossover point. There's also a pot so the volume can be adjusted. I play them so you can just start to hear them. They really add a little "shimmer" to the top end. Honestly, the Omegas are fine without them, but they don't hurt anything. And it was a fun little project.
Any bsc or other passive bits contouring the main drivers?
I've often wondered why aperiodic loading isn't used more, it makes for nice, tight, dry, non-bonky bass. Good looking setup! GLWS.
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That amount of power will get louder than you expect, but won't have the bottomless reserves of a big amp.
Not sure about the nobsound amps as a good match for Klipsch. They have very high input sensitivity (at least the one I checked, which was 300 mw for full output). That would allow an ipod to drive them to full output, but it's pretty far from ideal from a s/n standpoint, and could yield more hiss/noise than a less sensitive amp. Also, their explicit warnings on poorly mounted controls and how to re-install them once you get the amp is quite the sales pitch.
Also, the one I looked at was 25w, so a pp type, or a hybrid with ss output. Both of those sound different than single ended amps, which are my own personal preference after playing with all sorts.
For the amount of power you quoted, I would look for something else. For example, there was an Inspire by Dennis Had listed in the garage sale forum for $800 or so. That's the sort of thing that I would keep an eye out for if I were you. He also sells them on ebay. Or consider DIY, but that takes some time and learnin' if you're not already an experience solder slinger.
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Decware is down the road from my home town. Micro brews and tube amps galore, and frequent jam sessions.
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So question, when you guys use tone generators with computers hooked up to the avr, how do you hook it up? I'm using a laptop, hooked up via 3.5mm to composite cable, and that gets me poor results.
Using your laptop's headphone output as you are involves extraneous DA conversion and gain stages in the signal path. Use a digital out from the computer directly to the AVR if possible. If you can't do that, burn the test tones to disc and play via cd/blue ray player, or put them on a usb thumb drive and play through usb input on the AVR.
The "40hz" comes out of my fronts even though I'm crossing over at 80hz.The high pass filter is not a "brick wall" filter (one that completely eliminates output below the hpf setting), but rather produces a gradual roll-off below the hpf setting. What is the slope of the filter? Assuming the typical 80 hz hpf with a 24 db/octave slope, the mains would be down 24 db at 40 hz. If the slope is only 12 db/octave, they would be down 12 db at 40. Your room will have a large influence down here, so your sweeps may indicate more output than the calculations suggest (room mode at mic's position, or overall cabin gain in the lowest octaves).
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The discussion of cryo'd tubes and other discredited audiophool nonsense in your thread over there makes my head hurt. It's a wonder they don't get dizzy and fall over from chasing around the audiophool laser dots.
Are you still not satisfied after your tube rolling experimentation?
Does that amp have different output taps? It could be just an impedance mismatch, with less than optimal power delivery. Dual woof speakers almost always present a 4 ohm or lower load, and usually sound more properly balanced when paired with the 4 ohm taps on the tube amp.
Maybe some sort of eq, something you could use for the offensive recordings and bypass for the high quality ones? I see that amp does have some sort of treble control, although it may not address the offending frequencies. And unfortunately, the quality of production on many recordings leaves a lot to be desired. The better your rig, the more the sub-par recording's flaws are revealed. Some can be salvaged using editing software (Chris has a thread on remastering using Audacity here on the forums, if you're so inclined).
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he is most likely experiencing more of the phenomena of the Fletcher-Munson curve and equal-loudness contours
OP, does your Yamaha have "YPAO Volume"? That specifically was designed to address this quirk of human hearing, similar to Audyssey's Dynamic EQ. Give it a try.
edit...oops, doesn't seem that's the kit you're working with, sorry. Does the Onk have a similar feature?
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So the question is, would more power make these more dynamic? Not that I want them loud, I get the feeling though, as efficient as they are, the woofers need more power to really move at lower listening levels.
Maybe. I can tell a difference between my old Yamaha receiver, 50 watts with not much to spare, and more powerful amps. Better bass, better transients. A lot depends on your room. A big room and/or open floor plan may be a bit too much to ask for modest power.
Agree w/ the other posts. Fortes do have the bass, so double check the wiring to the woofs, and use those corners.
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That Forbes article tells us absolutely nothing, more FUD than insight.
Sure, if you're rich you may want to follow the advice "Once you've hit a home run don't go back to second base" and take a more conservative position. That's just common sense. All the high net worth folks I know have large proportions of their investable wealth in cash.
And the article is wrong that it's "hard to make money in the stock market", although it may be hard to make it in the short term. That's the problem, that all articles tend to focus on a trader's perspective, not an investor's perspective. Passive income, where your money works 24/7/365 for you, is about as easy as it gets, at least compared to the old fashioned method (work).
"Loudspeaker-Room" Maximum Performance Acheived
in 2-Channel Home Audio
Posted
True, but how many of us are using such large horns? Bill's trick may work much better on an old pair of Heritage speakers. The tractrix mids in the forte II, Chorus II, for example, are quite a bit hot on axis compared to a K-402. In those cases, it does indeed work.