001

i have owned a 504 for almost 20 years & for what it is & its price, it is a very good amp. its been hooked up to my kg5.5 & fortes in the past & it sounds excellent. but then again, almost any amp will sound good on fortes! i just bought my first pair of k-horns about a week ago & hooked them to the onkyo first for only a few hours, they sounded good but i am not used to the k-horns sound yet, they are a totally different animal than any other speaker. i plan to hook the onkyo back up asap for a better testing. i have used an adcom 555ii & rotel rb990 on them for a few hours each just to get a comparison on first impressions, the rotel sounds best so far but the onkyo would be a close second in initial sound quality. the adcom has power up loud but doesnt have the same sound quality to me with my system in the mid-high range. just not as clear, almost cheaper sounding. i will say that i first used an onkyo 805 avr as a preamp & while it sounded "ok." i swapped in a basic adcom 500 preamp & it was a night & day difference, all amps sounded better, more bass mainly but better all around compared to the receiver as a pre. the 805 is a very nice AVR & has great reviews, just not as good of a preamp as the oldschool adcom. with the right gear i think the onkyo m504 would be a great budget friendly s/s amp for k-horns. they go for about $400-$500 on ebay. but im sure for that price you could find an equal or better used amp... like the rotel. but the big green meters of the onkyo cant be beat at this price range..

i have a decent set of component video cables (red, blue, green) that i used for my older dvd player but now use HDMI. my question is are these ok to use as audio cables? i see some new ones advertised as both audio & video use, just wondering if i can use 2 of the 3 cables for decent audio cables? are they made of different wire that would not be good for audio use?

yep love old genesis & solo phil collins, hes a great drummer. i like the self titled album "genesis" too. home by the sea & a job to do sound great up loud on your favorite klipsch speakers! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzWpXBanNQY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbFFlSbViRY

i'm no cap expert by any means & while i do understand caps can go "bad" after time, i feel strongly that if the speakers sound good & the tweets still produce nice crips high notes that the caps they are hooked too are most likely fine. likewise for the mids. but on the other hand, i have heard an older speaker that it was obvious the tweets werent working right, when pulling the tweeter & hooking it up to the other speaker it sounded fine... so that indicated the capacitor was indeed bad. ordered a cheap equal quality one from parts express & it fixed the problem. moral of the story, if it sounds good, it probably is. as a forte 1 owner myself, these things sound awsome, even at 25+ years old. i bought mine from the original owner, an elderly gentleman that was selling his stuff to move to a retirement home, he said they were barely used in the last 10 years & he only listened to classical at what i assume was "lower" volume levels. he didnt even know the grilles came off untill i pulled one when i was looking at them, it was so tight i had to gently use a butter knife to pry it off. definantly had never been removed. long story short, they were in literally like new cosmetic condition & sound downright amazing. probably never had any rock & roll played through them untill now & i bet the woofers never actually moved. i have since cranked them up to pretty decent levels & am blown away at how good they sound. better than my kg 5.5's in every way. could only imagine what the ti tweets would do for them. might upgrade them soon. if yours sound ok, i wouldnt worry about the caps for awhile.

agreed on the nice warm sound, my rotel rb990 sounds soo much better than my adcom 555ii, both rated at the same power of 200wpc, but the rotel has a damping factor of like 1000 vs the adcom in the mid hundreds. that probably only effects the bass but the rotel just sounds so much better on the def tech speakers i tested it on briefly. have yet to hook up the rotel to my new to me k-horns, im hoping it will sound much better than the adcom. dont get me wrong, the adcoms are good amps, especially for all out power & bridgeability, but they just dont sound as good as the rotel IMO.. or my onkyo m-504 for that matter. i'm also considering trying the bi-amp thing with the rotel running the tops of the k-horns & an adcom on the bass bins. congrats again on the la scallas, im keeping my eyes out for a pair to add to the k-horns someday.

nice rotel pre, i like rotel stuff too, i have a rb99bx amp i got for a great deal from a local auction. 200wpc & it sounds very nice, much better than my adcom 555ii's. are the rotel preamps rated good? havent looked into their preamps yet, but i'm considering trading the adcom gear for rotel stuff too based on how the 990 amp sounds.

very nice! i see some adcom gear, what are you running the scallas with?

great article, but i am confused a bit. why wouldnt breaking up the tops & bass bins be beneficial? one amp (possible better sounding) to the tops (mid & tweet) & a seperate amp to the bass bins. in theory doing this would improve the sound for 2 reasons, 1> you are putting less load on each amp, one is designated to only mids & highs & is not stressed by sending bass signals. 2> you are essentially doubling the power sent to each speaker, instead of one amp sending lets say 200watts to handle bass & mid/highs, you have 2 amps sending 200watts each, total of 400 watts. again, one designated to only bass & one for only mid/highs. last i knew or understood seperating the signals greatly reduces stress on the amps. now imagine the "top" amp is a high quality tube amp or a mcintosh etc for much better mid high sound, then the bottom is a designated brute for bass. how or why wouldnt that improve the sound the speaker puts out? i agree bi-wiring is pointless, but it seems like true bi-amping would have obvious improvements. but again, im no professional, just looking for opinions. thanks for the input. also, can you elaborate on why the crossovers are "in desperate need of rewiring" & what i would replace the horns with?

What big def techs? You mean the speakers dwarfed by the KHorn? yes very true, i used to think they were big, now they look tiny next to the behemoth k-horns.

moving them is possible. the right one would stay where it is & the left one would go down the end of the long wall. but that gets in the way of the rear/surrounds for the theater. the k-horns are only 3 days old to me so they will stay where they are for now. a new tv is in the works & the basement is mainly a movie watching hang out. always wanted the k-horns & had a good deal locally i couldnt pass up so i had to get them. their final location will be worked out down the road or in a different house. can i get some ideas on how to use the gear i have??

i have a pair of oak kg 5.5 for sale in eastern iowa, zip 52403. $450obo in excellent shape overall & work & sound like new. one speaker has slight discoloration on the top but easily fixed with light sanding & restain. price is negotiable somewhat to a serious buyer. also willing to meet within 120 miles of 52403 for small fee to cover fuel cost.

im aware of that, the big def techs are only temporary, they were there first as part of the theater set up. i lay them down when doing any critical listening. but the k-horns are too close together im sure, just over 9' from center to center of mid horn.

no, not as of yet, i was able to expand the prongs on the plugs a bit & that made for a tighter fit, seems ok for now but i have not really pushed them yet. my zero dollar fix is to just cut them off & connnect the bare wire to the screw in terminals on the bass bin, have done that for years on all my other speakers with no issues at all. i'm not a big fan of the pin type ends & bare wire seems to get a good solid connection when crushed by the screw in terminals. 99.9% sure the noise i mentioned at first was due to the banana plugs coming out & barely making a connection. that initial noise is gone as long as the plugs stay pushed in.

heres a couple pics of the room & speakers. as you can see they are on a very short wall & the ceiling is way to low im sure... but they are gorgeous oiled walnut in 9.5 out of 10 condition.

im working on sealing them with pipe foam. they fit in the corners pretty good as is but the back edges of the tops & the side panels on the bass bins with the grille material hit the corners before the tailboard & horizontal edges of the bass bins im sure. thanks for the suggestion on the pioneer, but im looking for opinions on the best arrangement using MY components.

hard to say on the recordings, just standard cd's that all sounded fine on my previous set ups, fortes & ~100wpc onkyo receiver. but some that used to sound fine, dont sound fine on the k-horns. the current player im using (not mentioned in the list) is a onkyo dvd player that will play SACD & DVD-A, but i dont have any music in those formats yet. my main test cd's that have always sounded good in the past are led zepplin 2, pink floyd dark side or the wall, steely dan greatest hits, eagles greatest hits ("those shoes" up loud is incredible) & some toto. i also use some "newer" stuff that are excellet recordings based on previous setups like collective soul, kings of leon, a perfect circle, slower pearl jam songs etc. dont get me wrong, both amps sound good so far, i just expected a huge improvement with the k-horns, but so far they are a little overwhelming compared to my other klipsch speakers with the same gear hooked up. the terms used to describe sounds are so vauge & can have different meanings to each person. just expected a big WOW factor with the k-horns that isnt quite there yet. & keep in mind the room they are in is far from ideal, 25x13 with a low 7' 6" drop ceiling & they aare on a short wall about 9-10' apart & im about 10' away from them. thats probably most of the "in your face" issues im hearing, where as the fortes etc can be placed/angled much better & are more forgiving of recordings & room size. so even if i have to live with the room limitations with the k-horns i will, a new larger house is hopefully in the near future. just trying to optimize them with what i have for now... so, can anyone provide some suggestions on what they think the best amp set ups would be? i know i have to listen for myself, just looking for ideas on what y'all think would be the best way to go. many speakers have bi-amp capabilities for a reason, as it can have its benefits. but i dont think bridged mono is needed on such efficient speakers. thanks

yes, forgot to mention that, i plan to audition each amp briefly with the same preamp & player. right now im using the receiver as a pre amp in stereo mode only. using some decent 16awg wires, onkyo dvd/cd player hooked up optically. mainly looking for opinions on the amp set ups, hypothetically what would be the best combo for k-horns? i think i wll go with the adcom preamp for 2 channel mode if it sounds as good or better than using the onkyo recveier as a pre amp & keep the theater system totally seperate. my initial impressions in 2 days of listening for a few hours first on the onkyo 504 amp so i could see the power output (big green power meters) it sounded "good" pushing up to about 5-10 watts average, about 1/3 on the volume knob. then i swapped to the adcom 555ii & instantly noticed a worse sound overall, kind of "echoey" & "shrillier" than the onkyo if that makes sense. it has good bottom end but not as musical in my few hours & limited recordings. next i will try the rotel amp which gets great reviews on its sound quality & when i tested it on a different set of speakers a few weeks ago (only had it a couple weeks now) i noticed the same thing compared to the adcom... just way more musical & a nicer sound. the adcoms may have the big power levels but so far i dont think the sound is as good as the onkyo or limited time with the rotel. is bi amping a popular thing for k-horns? maybe the rotel or onkyo on the mids & tweets & an adcom on the bass bins? or even bridged mono adcoms to the bass bins? just thinking out loud. will definantly audition the amps more before i play with other combos.

hi. i just bought a pair of k-horns 2 days ago & am very excited to get them hooked up the best way possible with what i have. i'm looking for suggestions on how to best hook them up. they are 1995 vintage with ak-3 x-overs. i will list the components i have & would like to hear opinions on the best ones to use & best way to use them. its all solid state stuff, no fancy tubes or super expensive brands.... yet. just some mid-fi stuff i feel should be ok for now. just want to get the best performance with what i have. i'm open to bi-amping or bridgeing if the extra power will help. i listen to classic & modern rock usually at high volumes. & some oldies & loving good jazz the more i hear it. i dont have any fancy wires or cables yet but am open to decent priced stuff... no $100 speaker wire etc. heres what i am working with. my receiver has pre amp outputs to act as a pre-amp or i have a seperate preamp too. mainly lookig for 2ch suggestions but will consider using the k-horns for home theater as well, but i have built in sub def techs bipolars that are pretty darn good on movies so for now 2ch with the k-horns is priority. onkyo 805 7.1 receiver 130wpc. makes a decent preamp in 2ch too. adcom gtp 500ii tuner preamp 2 adcom gfa 555ii amps. 200wpc & 600watts bridged mono rotel rb990bx amp. 200wpc. not bridgeable. sounds very warm compared to the adcoms. onkyo m-504 amp. 165wpc. also a nice warm sound. adcom gcd 600 cd player onkyo integra dxc730 cd player. best amp & pre amp arrangement for the k horns? then any opinions on the cd players, heard great reviews for both of them. open to all suggestions & will experiment with any of the ideas. thanks in advance!

i appreciate that but pretty sure they are a straight forward hook up. pos to pos & neg to neg.... the main wires from the amp goes to the bottom 2 terminals & the tops wires go to the top 2 terminals. am i missing anything with that??

hard to describe sound differences & every listener is different. im my opinion the fortes are just so much smoother & more enjoyable to listen to than the big KLF's & especially the gold woofer stuff. take the terms used with a grain of salt, best i can say is the Rf & KLF's are brighter & possible "harsher" than the fortes & others of that series. comparing my fortes to my KG5.5's the same applies, i like the kg's & have owned them for well over 15 years, but at higher volumes they get a little too harsh for my tatse, the fortes just seem to sound better & better the louder you play them. & the single 12" with passive radiator has equal bass as the dual ported 10" woofers of the kg & i assume klf 20's. fortes are just an overall awsome speaker. & even though the chorus may show not as low on paper as the fortes, you wont notice a few hz when they play so much louder than fortes, the 15" woofer will have more kick & impact than the 12, thats why they are bigger & more $$. but the mids & tweets are the same, just different x-over points. if i come across a pair of chorus 2's i will be adding them to my fortes for a 4ch system made in heaven. & i just bougt a pair fo k-horns 2 days ago! be carefull, this hobby can be addictive once you get your first taste of klipsch sound!

yes all but the bannana plugs that connect the tops to the bass bins are soldered. im good with soldering so thats not an issue, but like you said, i dont want to change the caps/x-overs just yet, they sound ok. im just getting used to how big the k-horns are in my smaller basement. its a perfect rectangle with nice corners but a low ceiling. room is 25x13, ceiling is a drop style with panels about 7' 6". my couch is about 12' from the speakers. so they are very close together & just seem overwhelming at higher volumes. im sure the recordings are a lot of it, some stuff sounds good other stuff is kinda harsh up loud. im used to my fortes, epcis & kg5.5's i guess. i will be posting my components in another thread soon. looking for suggestions on the best way to run the k-horns. thanks!

hi, welcome, im new here too but am a long time klipsch owner. IMO, i would go with the fortes, hands down. they are not too big like the KLF & have a much better sound than any of the gold woofer stuff today, not that some big expensive rf-7's aren't a good speaker, but for the price you cant beat the heritage line. fortes, chorus, etc. lots of people like the klf-30 & 20's but they are very large, & can have known box problems (boxes rattle up loud due to poor build) nothing sounds like the older heritage series, or even the KG series like kg 4.5 & 5.5 etc. basically a 2 way version of the klf 20's. that ebay link to the klf 20's are a good price if they dont have issues. your onkyo receiver will be plenty of good power for any of the ones you listed, obviously there are higher quality components & seperates etc, but for you budget, stick with the onkyo for now, i run onkyo receivers for home theater & 2ch. my forte 1's on a 90wpc onkyo 605 are down right amazing. i listen to good rock music too & they do everything quite well, bass, mid & silky smooth highs. not sure where you are located but i have a very nice pair of oak kg 5.5's for sale. they have dual 10" woofers & a tractrix mid/tweet, they sound great for music & home theater & cant be beat for the price. asking $450 but price is a little negotiable. i am in iowa. havent posted them here yet but they are on craigslist. good luck in your search!

OK, but January of 2015, you're screwed. not if they are late 95's? i'm sure its not like once you hit 20 years they stop working or instantly go to crap. should be fine. i have 1989 forte 1's that sound excellent. caps & x-overs will be the last concern. thanks for the diagrams & pics, the pipe foam should be simple enough to get them to seal better. so i assume the vertical side boards with the grill material isnt what i want to seal/touch the wall? with the pipe foam on the backer board, that area & the sides of the tops wont actually touch the wall? which is good because when i push them all the way back it marks up the wall. max2: thanks for the offer on the x-over trade, my ak-3's are all soldered connections, not push on connectors, so swapping them might be more of a hassle than its worth if they are ok, but i will consider that afer awhile of playing with the speakers a bit. but if the 20 year things is true... your 1989 ak-2 x-overs are shot! thanks again for the help guys!

yes it is, 2014 - 1995 = less than 20 years. caps should be fine. so use the pipe insulation to seal the backs tro the walls? where exactly do i put it on the backs? the side panels with the grille material is what touches my walls, or do i want to have the backer board seal to the wall? also any basic tricks for calming down the mids a bit? can anyone post some pics of where to seal them? or maybe i can post pics of what mine look like on the rears.

thanks, can you elaborate on how to use pipe insulation? i'm hoping the caps are ok as these arent 20 years old & have minimal useage over the last 5-7 years. bob crites says the ak-3 x-over uses good caps & should be ok for at least 20 years, so i will try some more basic stuff before i get into that. as for sealing them to the walls, thats kind of what im asking in the original post... how do i seal them? they dont have the original neoprene strips i mentioned so what is the best option to do this?