maxg Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 I recently saw a market analysis of the most respected brands in America. From memory Rolls Royce was third and Bose was 6th. Go figure!! The only Bose setup I ever heard that sounded good lives in a club my friends and I ocasionally frequent. they have 901's mounted on the ceiling (about 8 of them I think) being driven by about 1000 watts of power amp. There are a few subs around the place too - but not Bose models. The atmosphere in the club is excellent and they play almost entirely 70s and 80s music (my era). It is invariably packed out and most people go there for the music. It isnt the last word in detail and there is no soundstaging to speak of but it does pound out the music perfectly well for its environment. Its been that way for over 10 years now - and to the best of my knowledge they have never had to change anything on the speakers. Say what you like about the company and the product but that for me is testimony to their longevity if nothing else. Bravo Ray - A brave post indeed!! ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundog Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 I certainly fall into the sound quality vs. appearence with my industrial LaScalas and "plain jane" (to some mean spirited people "ugly" Outlaw 1050s). But in the dark I listen to the 1050 and Scalas and say "God forgive them because they don't know what they are talking about" (paraphrasing JC). But I'd defend to death a person's right to choose appearance over substance. In a society where people will pay 10 times the price of a regular tee shirt to have one of the same quality with a designer's name and logo (free advertising!) emblassioned across the front, what do you expect? As a parent of a teen-ager I dislike companies' brain washing teenagers to make $$$. But I tell my son "here's a couple bucks if you want to spend $20. at Old Military for a Tummy Hillbanger go earn the extra money. And he does. As a kid I wore old dirty tee shirts and saved for EICO kits. "What's the matter with kids today?" But then he thinks my systems are "awesome" and "cool" and shows them off to his friends so I'm letting him live. If Bose is engaging in deceptive and dishonest practices they should be prosecuted. But I'm sure Gil will tell you claims like "big sound" are subjective and a matter of opinion and it would be almost impossible to make a case. Some people experience more pleasure from those tiny cubes than we do from big LaScalas. They have as much of a right to buy what they want as we do that. Would anyone want to take that right away from them? After all "Ignorance is Bliss" to some people anyway. Some men prefer empty-headed big-breasted bleach blonds over very bright slender woman who wear glasses and no make-up. Now there's a good debate! Thank God for diversity. The word would be boring without it. "You'll never go broke underestimating the tastes of the American public" "There is a sucker born every minute" P.T. Barnum This is nothing new. Gil - Am I doing better with my paragraphs? ------------------ Soundog's HT Systems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Inspired... and inspiring... HH! A soundog approach to the Spirit of America! Happiness, there is no key to the vault, just a combination of our own making... and if that isn't "new" each day it's only because we haven't reached out to be who we can be. And, Soundog, after all the labels are peeled away, we are all mongrels and there in lies the strength of our survival. P.T. Barnum's pet peeve was people laying that sucker quote upon him... and pray they miss his con. While Dr. Bose looks down upon our world from MIT's lofty intellectual heights... and preys upon our fellow Ears. This Forum gives us the opportunity to lay out the facts and figures as we see them... and transform sound illusions into sound experiences. Remember, lights on or lights off, the curtain we see and the sound we hear only plays in our individual "Theater of the Mind." Thank God for differences... and the ability to enjoy them! HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clint Phare Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Bose does NOT suck- Ha, Ha, Ha!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyKlipschFan Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Funny you mention 901's. I was in a record shop in Broad Ripple here in Indianapolis. It is a huge store. 20 ft ceilings, and a big rectangle. They had I think 4 901's and about 4'-5' from the ceiling down firing against the walls in the corners like they should. Again a huge store...up loud...stereo imaging was cool.... Ok it sounded great..I admit it. I couldn't find the sub but I am sure it was somewhere.(Not pounding but adiquate too.) Possibly this is the only setup they ever sounded this good, but I know they also did the Orlando Magic BBall stadium and at one time that was supposed to be the rockinist NBA house system in the USA. Funny, I never have heard or have seen BOSE do anything in pro sound.. We do not see BOSE in movie theatres...or in concert halls for live sound. hmm wonder why???? I also have been told on many occasions those rooms you demo Bose have been EQ'd, Dampend...and set up specifically for Bose. And why wouldn't they, too, do something to show the strengths of their line. All I can say is, that even at 40 yrs old..a K horn with a great artist coming over the speakers in a good room at moderate or above SPL's( Not killing but you get the point) ...Is about as close to an "ear orgasm" that one can have. Nothing comes close to Klipsch!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Hey, reminds me... I just got a Bose demo CD... It's scratched, but I think I'll be able to play some of it... Anyone interested in what's on it? ------------------ http://members.fortunecity.com/sebdavid - go laugh at my crappy website/equipment http://www.dvdprofiler.com/mc.asp?alias=Sebdavid - go laugh at my puny little DVD collection Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 i guess the 1st thing way back that really irked me about the bose marketing hype was that claim (from bose) that the 901's 9-5" drivers were the equivalent of having a 36" woofer. as pwk would probably say - BULL$@IT. now horned i will go naw on a raw steak. ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLUngurait Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 If you want to draw attention to a thread just use Bose in the title...stirs up the pot more than speaker wire and interconnects! While I will agree that there is plenty to admire about Bose the company (Marketing, R & D, Success, etc..)...it's really the average Bose consumer that I tend to take issue with. Most of the people I know who own the little cubes think that they have bought the end all-be all of audio systems! Some months ago I had a friend of my father's over for dinner. He commented on my speakers(LaScalas)saying Klipsch were pretty good. I asked him if he was into audio gear and if so what did he have. With an extended chest and a proud smile he said he had an Acoustimass system. I think he expected me to be humbled! I didn't want to debate with a guest so I quickly changed the subject...my wife couldn't believe I passed up an opportunity to talk about my system! This same guest brought an expensive bottle of German Rhine wine...I'm sure there are those who really like that sickly sweet stuff...I am NOT one them. I'll curse the day when I see an hour long infomercial dedicated to selling the virtues of wine in a cardboard box. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 So how would we feel if we had to pay $10,000 on Ebay for a decent pair of Klipschorns? Or $8,000 for a pair of Cornwalls or LaScalas? If it weren't for Bose (let us all stand up and applaud them), the middle of the bell curve (+/- 3 standard deviations) would be shopping in our neck of the woods because there's only so much Aiwa and Panasonic and Sony can crank out! We are definitely a minority, and reside in the dark and quiet recesses of the tails of the bell(e) curve, and we can buy and sell these wonderful works of art at reasonable prices FOR THE VERY REASON that everybody else is buying Bose. Now ... don't we all feel so much better ????? ------------------ If you don't like what is coming out, you wouldn't like what is going in." -PWK- --------------------- TWO-CHANNEL SYSTEM AES AE-25 "Superamp" AES AE-3 Pre-amp New Tube 4000 CD Player 1976 Klipschorns (ALK'ed) HOME THEATER Klipsch 1968 ALK Cornwall "II"s (LF/RF) ALK Belle Klipsch (Center) Klipsch Heresy (RR/LR) Klipsch KSW-12 sub Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Cornwalls) Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Heresy's) Denon AVR-4800 Toshiba SD-3109 DVD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Garrison Posted February 28, 2002 Author Share Posted February 28, 2002 1) Cheap innoffensive wine in a cardboard box is not any worse than cheap innoffensive wine in a bottle, plus it takes up less space and won't break if it falls out of the fridge. 2) Actually, there's nothing better to top off a good dinner than a really good Kabinett, Spatlese or Auslese with some rich cheesecake. Particularly from one of the really great vinyards, like Bernkastler Doctor. If you try to drink one of these things with dinner, yeah, it's pretty sickly sweet, but in combination with a good dessert, it's wonderful. ------------------ Music is art Audio is engineering Ray's Music System Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 ...and once again, i am amazed at the diversity of knowledge found among this board's users. ------------------ http://members.fortunecity.com/sebdavid - go laugh at my crappy website/equipment http://www.dvdprofiler.com/mc.asp?alias=Sebdavid - go laugh at my puny little DVD collection Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 for some odd reason, that doesn't seem to surprise me. (can you supply some data to support your statement?) This message has been edited by John Warren on 02-28-2002 at 06:02 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Wine in a box is the best!!! It is always drinkable. Equivalently priced bottled wine can be HORRIBLE! If you get the $10-$15 name-brand bottled stuff, its usually good, but twice as expensive as boxed! You're going to pee it out in a few hours, so spend money on somthing else! Yes, as a company, Bose is a good business modle. Are they a private company? Is Klipsch? Bose isn't alone. Think of all of the cheap crap companies there are. Lots of advertising, little R&D for the products. Korean cars are a good example (if any of you drive a Korean car because of money, I am not picking on you!) they are cheap crap that falls apart and as soon as they are sold, the warranty (10 year, 100,000 mile) is dead. Because only a FEW people will have the car for more than 10-20 thousand miles, they are OK, because WHEN the car breaks at 30,000 miles, they don't have to fix it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLUngurait Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Ray, You said: "1) Cheap innoffensive wine in a cardboard box is not any worse than cheap innoffensive wine in a bottle, plus it takes up less space and won't break if it falls out of the fridge. 2) Actually, there's nothing better to top off a good dinner than a really good Kabinett, Spatlese or Auslese with some rich cheesecake. Particularly from one of the really great vinyards, like Bernkastler Doctor. If you try to drink one of these things with dinner, yeah, it's pretty sickly sweet, but in combination with a good dessert, it's wonderful." Where's the data? Just in case anyone missed my point...I'm not saying there aren't any good Rhine wines...they just aren't my cup of...er..box-o-wine. My point is "Tastes Differ". I prefer an afer dinner cigar (Arturo Fuente or Padron) w/ a glass of Cognac or Port (the cheap stuff is fine for me) Also, I just happen to have had the misfortune of dropping a cardboard container of OJ just yesterday...spilled all over the place...but no broken glass. Cheers! Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 is "Arturo Fuente" Spanish for mouth cancer? Taste's DO differ, I would like to keep mine (my tongue that is). This message has been edited by John Warren on 02-28-2002 at 08:44 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMcD Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Yes Sounddog. Your paragraphs are good. Smile. Bose bashing aside, this is a peeve of mine. Big blocks of text are hard to read. People have intersting things to say. But in big blocks we lose visual interest. If anyone wants free advice on writing, put three, maybe four sentences in every paragraph as a max. Then move on. Gil This message has been edited by William F. Gil McDermott on 02-28-2002 at 09:20 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 William: I couldn't agree more. I don't mind a long body of text if it is a story or a long, nessasary description. I hate when some data is imbedded deep inside the post. If it is stated upfront, and then elaborated later on, thats fine with me. K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Stupid Yes, that HAS been done before. However, there are times where a long body of text is needed, so don't anyone be discouraged from writing, but DON'T bore us with worthless drabble and ranting. there are very few people that do that on this forum, so its not at all bad right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLUngurait Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Really John...I mean you of all people...that was surely a statement that should've (and certainly could've) been backed up w/ some data! May all of our tongues live long and healthy lives! Dave Tongue usually planted firmly in cheek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minn_male42 Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 indyklipschfan....you said that bose doesn't do anything in commercial/pro sound... actually...bose does have a full line of professional speakers for commercial installations....if you go into a disney store at your local mall you will probably see bose speakers in the ceiling as well as other businesses.... and yes, bose does the same thing in the pro field as the consumer market....their speakers are priced 2 to 3 times higher than the competition and they don't sound any better...sound familiar???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundog Posted March 1, 2002 Share Posted March 1, 2002 Thanks Gil. You made me aware of the email bad habit of throwing out all the rules of writing we learned in school. Now if we can only get lawyers to write legal documents that everyone can understand. ------------------ Soundog's HT Systems This message has been edited by soundog on 03-01-2002 at 09:23 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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