Klipsch La Scala vs Pioneer CS-63DX

[raphaelmsx]

Hi people,

I am trying to decide which pair of used speakers should I buy, either Klipsch La Scala or a Pioneer CS-63DX.

How can you compare these two speakers in particular? I know they should sound very differently, but how can you describe them?

It will be used on late 70's pre and amp separates, probrably from Sansui or Pioneer, only for music, not HT.

My main musical tastes are: jazz (smooth and fusion), rock, pop, new age... all of them basically from the 70's and 80's.

I do not pretend to add any kind of sub-woofer.

Oh, and I hope this is the right forum to ask this question. []

Thank you for your advices!
Raphael

[russ69]

I am trying to decide which pair of used speakers should I buy, either Klipsch La Scala or a Pioneer CS-63DX.

This is the Klipsch forum, dude. Get the LaScala for sure............duh.

[Dennie]

No question about it, the La Scala is the one to choose!

BTW, Welcome to the Klipsch Forums!

Dennie

[Klipsch_Geek]

Two things

1) If you wanted the "Not Klipsch" answer, you need to ask it on the "Not Klipsch" Forum

2) If the price is equal, and the La Scala's are legitimate, there is no way you should turn them down.

[raphaelmsx]

Hi,

Thank you for your answer.

I didn't want any "Not Klipsch" answer, I just wanted unbiased opinions from people that actually had listening experience with both speakers mentioned.

Just because this is the Klipsch forums, if I asked which one is better for a big room, a Klipsch RB-41 or a JBL 4435, everyone here would say "of course the RB-41" ?? I sincerely don't think so.

I hope I could made myself clear now. []

Thank you again.

Two things

1) If you wanted the "Not Klipsch" answer, you need to ask it on the "Not Klipsch" Forum

2) If the price is equal, and the La Scala's are legitimate, there is no way you should turn them down.

[Coytee]

Listen to all of you cool-aid drinkers...

Dude comes to the forum and asks an honest question and all you can do is blindly recommend LaScalas?

Pfffffffffffft on that crap.

Sorry OP.... you gotta deal with these narrow minded pinheads from time to time.

My thoughts???

Given I've never heard the Pioneer's... I'd say LaScalas all the way baby!

As you can see, there are at least a couple of us who are open minded around here... []

[Y]

[Coytee]

How big is your room? How big is your budget?

There are other alternatives to the LaScala that will sound even better (including some derivations of the LaScala itself)

It's true though that I have never heard the Pioneer's (that I'm aware of)

[Guest Anonymous]

I would think that Jazz would sound awesome on the horns of the La Scala for sure. Some songsand genres just match well with horns.

Also, dont be afraid to use a sub. there great.

I've never heard those pioneers...

I have two sets of la scala's and if i had more room, i get another pair for 7.1 or even 8.1.

[runninshine]

It's hard to beat a 3 way fully horn loaded speaker. Get the La Scala!

Welcome to the forum.[Y]

[Klipsch_Geek]

I have heard several of that generation Pioneer speakers, and there is no comparrison. A few questions though:

What era LaScala? What kind of amplification? What is the room like?

There may be better options, though we don't know enough right now to suggest any. One thing I can tell you is, if the LaScala's are as old as the CS-63DX's, either or both pairs will need work on the crossovers and drivers. Once we know what age LaScala's you are dealing with there are many here who can mak recommendations. Progably have to check out AudioKarma or another site if you are looking for help rebuilding the Pioneers.

[garyrc]

I have not heard those particular Pioneers. I love jazz on horn speakers, including La Scala. My guess, based on other Pioneers I have heard is that they: 1) Will need a bit to a lot more amplifier power than the La Scalas for the same volume, 2) May have more bass extension, but the bass may be a bit less clean.

I'll bet that the best of all options would be La Scalas near or against a wall (also try them in corners) with tweeters at ear level when you are sitting down, and aimed at your listening chair(s) .... and ... even though you might resist this, a subwoofer crossing over rather low --- below 60 Hz, or perhaps below 40 Hz. That way, you have a shot at getting the super precise sound of the La Scalawith deep sounding bass.

Bec, and others on this forum, can help you to decide whether to replace the crossover caps (depending, in part, on age), and also how to cut in a sub at a very low frequency, if your existing electronics don't do this for you.

Right now, keeping your speakers away from a wall is chipped in stone for some audiophiles, but I, and some other Klipschites, are not among them. I think it's likely that you gain something and lose something whenever you move your speakers to a new position. One forum member (one of the Johns??? or not) has a bass energy simulation that shows that, contrary to rumor, corner placement provides the most even distribution of the bass. You may or may not loose a little imaging precision this way, but this effect is less pronounced if you aim the speakers right at the center seat, or just to either side of the center seat.

La Scalas lovingly placed are hard to beat if you also get a sub.

[Guest Anonymous]

either or both pairs will need work on the crossovers and drivers.

Why would the drivers need work, the 1974, and 1979 La Scala's i have sound fantastic.

One pair has new capacitors installed, one does not...either way, the drivers were fine. There is something to be said by a good audition.

[Klipsch_Geek]

Must have been good climate control wherever your speakers were. I have rarely had ~35 year old woofers that didn't need a little cone or foam work. As for crossovers, I like to make my changes on both sides of a pair so they have a better chance matching sonically. Some say it matters, some say it doesn't, but I have found I prefer it when they match (could be all in my head, since I know if both sides are done or not ).

[Coytee]

I gotta say... my '79s that I bought new in 1979 are also still going strong. I have however, replaced the crossover.

[garyrc]

I gotta say... my '79s that I bought new in 1979 are also still going strong. I have however, replaced the crossover.

Ditto. I put the AK4 in my Khorns a while back (AK4 does not include a woofer replacement) and inspected the woofers at that time. They looked fine and still sound great, even though they were purchased in 1982. I've had some problems with the other drivers, but not these woofers. So, climate and climate control inside the house may really count.

[Coytee]

Mine have lived through outdoor parties (block parties in college), wedding receptions, jamming with guys in my college dorm (and apartment when I moved on) as well as frat parties that I played for an old room mate.

Then again, the frat party was for Evan's Scholars.... so perhaps it was more cerebral than jam....

[^o)]

[Forever-Audio]

A little late to the party but I just picked up another set of 63DX's and so did a little research because I was trying to verify what they cost new. They were around $700 in 1970 as I recall, Pioneer's finest. The CS-99A's followed. I've owned several sets of both. As well as La Scala's, Khorns, Belles, and even Shorthhorns. Just sent a set of JBL 4333's to Russia.

You see, I'm a dealer.

With that said, I've owned and heard most of them. My current home system consists of a set of Khorns stuffed in the corners and a set of modified Belle's as daily listeners. I didn't use to be a big Klipsch fan, my M&K's just did so much more for what I preferred to listen to. But the K's grow on you a bit.

Back to the 63's. TWO DIFFERENT ANIMALS when compared to any Heritage K's. If you throw the price away, all things equal, the LS are the best bet. Sort of. Depends on what you like. Keep in mind the 63's have SIX SPEAKERS in each cab. That big 15" woof does a great job but it's packed into a relatively small cab when compared to the LS. One large piece of 4" thick insulation fills each cab, cut to the size of the cab itself. Does what it's supposed to. The LS has a big airy sound; the 63 is tighter.

But the LS has only one tiny rather uneventful tweeter. The 63 has two super-tweets and an awesome horn tweet. The highs are incredibly out there and defined. Next you have two 5" mid cone drivers, each in their own engineered and balanced plastic enclosure. You don't have the broad 'horn sound' of the LS's, but you have very well defined and complete sound from the mids on up, leaving nothing to question. The woofer can be tight and broad, not all that strong in the deep low end. The speakers are rated at 80 watts a side. Good luck getting them there. They'll blow you out!!

There's a reason these things are still around and being used in garages, for parties, and looking a bit beat up. It's because they're LOVED by folks who just can't justify ever letting go of them, EVER. The first set I had (and still HAVE) was water damaged, had swollen and open joints, and still blew me away. THEY ARE MY FAVORITE ROCK AND ROLL SPEAKERS, BAR NONE. They just love to be cranked up for the old rock sounds. Great for jazz too, another favorite of mine. Pioneer really did their work when they designed this set. Not as bright as the HPM-1500's, of which I've had two sets, but overall just a fun set to own. I retired mine to my home gym area, perfect for cranking that environment.

So don't let anyone sell you short on the speaks. The weakness is the crossovers, just give them a great cleaning and you should be able to rock on. You'll be making no excuses when your visitors hear them playing while they drop by... They are not airy, they are clear, tight, and authoritive. Highly undervalued in today's market. Sand them down, paint them black, cover the grilles with black cloth, attach the grilles with velcro instead of screwing them down, and everyone will think you nailed down an awesome set of some of today's newest and finest.

And for my K loving fans? If I had to choose? If it came down to JUST sound and not space, price, or anything else? I'd generally go with the LS's, for their efficiency if nothing else; their ability to perform at even low volumes while broadly reporting everything that I was wanting to hear.

But as a last thought; the 63's I just picked up had major crossover issues and one woof was frozen up (though still working) and one of the horn tweets was dead; only four or five of the twelve total speakers were actually producing sound (moisture issues). With that, most casual listeners would have thought they were hearing a fully functioning set of quality speakers! It was hard to believe...