Moderators dtel Posted May 21, 2011 Moderators Share Posted May 21, 2011 K-402/K69 I have to agree as well (My choice), all interesting points though [Y] The big problem.......we all hear things differently. [] Bet you won't be disappointed. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bracurrie Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 You do not need K402 horns (ugly as hell). Sorry my wife and I disagree, and she had a choice of cloth or just wood trim or anything she wanted, since she picked out the 402's the first time she heard them it was her choice. If you think the JBL 2435 is better you obviously never heard the 402 setup properly, . I love the BS button. But feel its overplayed as we are in subjective territory as to appearance. I will confess to having never heard the 402 setup but wonder why PWK when pictured with the speaker it had what looks like a wooden horn substantially smaller than the 402. But hey I am a newbie to Klipsch forums and I am not an engineer. I di elevate my horns to a point where they center about where the 402 would center and that really enhanced the overall sound. Of course now that the speakers are so good the source flaws are emphasized. Argh! As to the design choice of 402s I can't help but wonder if they were choosen for large room applications like cinemas. When looking at buying these from Klipsch I noticed a three way setup. Again for cinema applications I am sure. As to the crossovers, the active approach with tuneable crossover points, selectable slopes and equalization pre and post crossover can make any two/three way setup sound fantastic. I was afraid the DSP would affect the sound, but its such a net improvement I will have to wait until I can get a 1/3 octave or really fine parabolic EQ to couple with my passives to AB. Thanks for the reply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THXAUDIO Posted May 22, 2011 Author Share Posted May 22, 2011 bhendrix, I was wondering... the measurements of your Jubilees.., as you have them right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhendrix Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 bhendrix, I was wondering... the measurements of your Jubilees.., as you have them right now. Jubilee with K402 66" high x 42" wide (woofer is 42"w, 402 is 39.5"w) x 24" deep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bracurrie Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 How tall are your bass cabs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhendrix Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 I will confess to having never heard the 402 setup but wonder why PWK when pictured with the speaker it had what looks like a wooden horn substantially smaller than the 402. Hi bracurrie. Welcome to the Forum!! I'm curious as to why, If you have not heard to 402, you would say in your first post that you don't need the 402? The pictures you have seen of PWK were taken with early versions of the Jubilee with the K403 wooden horn that were manufactured for testing. Only a few were made. As I recall, PWK died before Roy had completed the final design of the K-402. Again, as I recall, Roy had convinced Paul of the benefits of the tractrix ( or modified tractrix ) and was working on the 402 that Paul never heard. The large size of the 402 is actually a benefit in home situations. Because of it's size, the 402 does a better job of controlling coverage and directivity of the lower frequencies of the horn. It prevents the frequencies at the bottom range of the horn from "spilling out on the floor and ceiling", as Roy puts it. I have heard the K-403, the K-510, and the K-402 in the same room. My choice was the K402 for its superior sound qualities. I'm sure someone will correct me if I have misspoken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhendrix Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 How tall are your bass cabs? Jubilee bass cabinets are 39.5" tall x 42" wide x 24" deep K402 assembly is 26.5" tall (including mounting board, horn alone is 25.5" tall) x 39.5" wide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bracurrie Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 I will confess to having never heard the 402 setup but wonder why PWK when pictured with the speaker it had what looks like a wooden horn substantially smaller than the 402. Hi bracurrie. Welcome to the Forum!! I'm curious as to why, If you have not heard to 402, you would say in your first post that you don't need the 402? The pictures you have seen of PWK were taken with early versions of the Jubilee with the K403 wooden horn that were manufactured for testing. Only a few were made. As I recall, PWK died before Roy had completed the final design of the K-402. Again, as I recall, Roy had convinced Paul of the benefits of the tractrix ( or modified tractrix ) and was working on the 402 that Paul never heard. The large size of the 402 is actually a benefit in home situations. Because of it's size, the 402 does a better job of controlling coverage and directivity of the lower frequencies of the horn. It prevents the frequencies at the bottom range of the horn from "spilling out on the floor and ceiling", as Roy puts it. I have heard the K-403, the K-510, and the K-402 in the same room. My choice was the K402 for its superior sound qualities. I'm sure someone will correct me if I have misspoken. Thanks for the welcome. Its really fun to exchange ideas and opinions with people that have alot more experiance and knowledge than I have. I was warned off the 2 in throat of the 402 as they are said to beam under certain circumstances. Now as the solution I ended up with, JBL 2435s and wooden Tractrix horns, it was a much cheaper solution as I found the drivers on EBAY. I thought if it worked out the speaker would be less massive. I am VERY happy with my gear after the inclusion of the DBX Driverack PA+ as it corrects problems that possibly wouldn't be there with the 402. So yes, I need to hear 402s someday. But for now I am quite happy to have bass that is so accurate my standup bass playing son is impressed. Maybe my old ears can't hear the problems with my top end. BTW I have a chance to buy a pair of Heresy 1s in near mint condition. Your thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhendrix Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 Maybe my old ears can't hear the problems with my top end. BTW I have a chance to buy a pair of Heresy 1s in near mint condition. Your thoughts? Man, I can relate to the challenges of aging hearing. Gotta protect what we have left!! [:S] The Heresy is a great little speaker. My response to your question would depend on your intended application and the price of the deal. I have had many pair of Heresy's over the years, from raw to finished first gen to the pro versions. All were fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bracurrie Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 $350 for the pair. Intending to use them in a tight home theater setup as fronts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhendrix Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 $350 is a good price. Keep your eyes open for a single Heresy to use as center channel and you'll have a sweet little "front-three". Once upon a time I had a 5.1 all-Heresy system that was quite good. I have since replaced the front Heresy's with KP-302s that I like even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyrc Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 I have long wondered it the tweeter in the 3-way cinema version of the Jub is actually better -- within the tweeter's range -- than the mid horn/driver in some way other than power handling / SPL. How do they compare in distortion, frequency response, etc.? Hopefully the Jubs, in some configuration, will continue to be available under the new ownership, because after I recover from the recession ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted May 23, 2011 Moderators Share Posted May 23, 2011 I love the BS button. But feel its overplayed as we are in subjective territory as to appearance. Your right appearance is kind of personal, it was really meant about the " you don't need the 402 horn". No you don't need it that's for sure but hearing it compared with speakers costing 3x more and is the winner, to my ears gave me the bug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted May 23, 2011 Moderators Share Posted May 23, 2011 I was warned off the 2 in throat of the 402 as they are said to beam under certain circumstances. Not at all, it's just the opposite to my ears. One of the first times I heard them I was in the room about 16 x 25, about 2 feet from a side wall 3/4 of the way to the back. Comparing them to other speakers I noticed they sounded MUCH better. I couldn't figure out why the "other" highly thought of speakers didn't sound better. It wasn't until I moved around the room that I noticed the other two pair of speakers sounded more like I expected them to as I moved away from the sidewall and closer to the middle of the room. The 402 filled the room with much wider with the fullness that the other two only presented to the center of the room. So if anything " to me " they sounded less focused on one area of the room and filled in wall to wall. It all comes down to what sounds better to you in your room, I just like big horns and big bass bins, well, because they sound big, sounds dumb but it's true. [] Originally when our search started I was thinking Klipschorns. What kind of threw me was I listened to them in probably 5 different rooms, and each room sounded different. I know every room sounds different but the Klipschorn really uses the room more than most speakers because of the design. Then one day I (really my wife and daughter) heard the 402 with the MWM and said that's what we want ! So that's what happened, I really like the Jube bass bin but it was more than we could spend considering we had no shortage of speakers already. You probably notice with the JBL's that the sound is more open and bigger than what a smaller horn can do. To me I like it when you can not point directly to the horn with your eyes closed but more just a gereral area. To me that was the big difference with the 510 compared to the 402, not as wide of an area with the 510. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bracurrie Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 Well because of your comments here and on another thread I started "My Jubilee setup", I now wish to experiance the 402. Thanks Brad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted May 23, 2011 Moderators Share Posted May 23, 2011 I was just saying what I thought about them, I have not heard better, but they are big, although I don't think ugly but may not be for everyone that's for sure. Try to listen to some and judge for yourself, if you were closer you could come here, there not on Jube bass bins but the horn sounds the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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