Reference 7.1 setup to go with a pioneer vsx2021 reciever... please help

[unspeakable]

I have been researching speakers for awhile now and have narrowed it down to the reference line that i would like to have in my home theatre package.

I have been looking at the rf42s and 52s or even the 62s and dont know if the reciever will be able to handle these speakers?

http://www.pioneer.com.au/au/products/22/98/405/VSX-2021/specs.html

vsx2021 details are:

Price $1700 -1800 aud

Power output per channel 150W@6ohm and 110@8ohm x7channel

Condition 1kHz, 1% THD, 6Ω

Rated Power Output 150W + 150W

Input (Sensitivity/Imp.): LINE 350 mV / 47kΩ

Frequency Response: LINE 5 Hz - 100 kHz +0/-3 dB

Signal-to-Noise Ratio: LINE (DIN)103dB

Power Requirements AC 220 - 230 V / 50/60 Hz

Power Consumption (in use / standby) 550 W / 0.40 W

Auto Power Down Yes

Bi-ampable Yes

Subwoofer inputs: 2

would i be able to get away with this setup or would i have to buy another amplifier/preamp?

[mustang guy]

That receiver is very powerful. There is not a speaker Klipsch has ever made it couldn't drive. Might I suggest buying RF-82's? They are 150watt speakers and this is a 150 watt receiver.

The center speaker would be RC-62.

The rears and the sides, could be the smaller RF-62 or RS-62.

[cornfedksboy]

You could easily drive those speakers with a $300.00 receiver. What is your room size and goal for your speakers? Are you planning on buying any additional speakers?

[SuBXeRo]

Klipsch speakers are very efficient and dont require a ton of power to push. They are so efficient because of the horn tweeter and the corn concentrating the sound waves from the tweeter. With that said they are some limitations to receivers that will cause them to perform poorly with with larger receivers. What am i getting at? Well, if you were to go with the rf-42 II's you could stick with a receiver and be fine really, not much limitation at all by getting a receiver. If you get the rf-52's, rf-62's or rf-82's you will really start being affected by limitation. In any case to answer your question, yes that receiver would drive any of themodels you listed.

You are probably like "wtf is the limitation you keep yapping about?!!!". When you have a speaker with larger woofers they require more power to reach the lower extension of the frequency range. Receivers are inferior in the size of their torroids and capacitors and really lack the ability to supply power needed to speakers with larger drivers. Why? Well, there are a lot of things going into a receiver, much of which can be affected by large electromagnetic fields causes by the capacitors but more so the torroid. When a speaker is pumping, the impedence is constantly in flux. Klipsch speakers have a nominal impedence of 8 ohms but sometimes, especially in the rf-82's and rf-7's their impedence will dip down to 3-4-5-6-7 ohms depending on how how the sound is. The limitations of the receiver that you can perceive are untight bass at low and high frequencies, clipping (when the audio signal is cut at the top and bottom end creating distrotion which can damage your speaker, this happens when the receivers runs out of power) and overall sound clarity. Receivers are also often overrated, that means when it says 100 x 7 in 95% of the cases it means like 50-60 watts x 7 of actual useful power. Some are actually underrated or dead on but those are very rare.

if you are going to drop $1700 on a receiver, please please please consider buying separates as in a separate power amp and a processor. I would only suggest getting a receiver at that price point if room constraints really prohibit you. We do a ton of receiver bashing around here but its because at a certain point its well worth it to invest slightly more and get a power amp. Power amps can last for decades and rarely need to be upgraded because, well, the technology hasnt changed much in decades. If anything, they are more refined then ever before. Processors, well, those things are constantly outdated because of new sound formats, connectors, room correction etc. With a receiver, everytime you need new connectors or a format changes and your receiver doesnt support it you have to buy a whole new unit which means you are also paying for the amp inside as well which is most likely still good. Check out emotiva and outlaw audio, both are highly recommended amongst people in the forum as well as B&K, parasound, marantz, rotel and there are many more. Emotiva and outlaw audio are amongst the most affordable. My Emotiva XPA-5 power amp weighs i think 73lbs, that is just the amp. Most receivers, the high end ones top out at 40lbs, thats processor and amp all in 1 case. Its always better to have power on hand then to run out of power. Most of us like to have around 50 watts of overhead power as in 50 watts over the recommended rms of your speakers, this helps to avoid clipping at all costs. Processors can be a bit pricey at times, the emotiva umc-1 is on clearence right now for an excellent price and they give you a 40% of card to upgrade to the next emotiva processor, part of their business model. I have the umc-1 and now that almost all of the software glitches have been ironed out its a a great unit. I would only buy another brand to just compare but i can say that i am very happy and the xpa-5 is a brutish amp, provides all the power i need ever really.

I threw a lot of information at you, i always do this to people. Dont feel overwhelmed, just ask questions, its how we can help you best. What size room are you in? Whats your total budget? Are you in a home or condo/apt? Do you do mostly movies or music? Is size a constraint? Do you have to worry about the "Wife Acceptance Factor WAF"? Do you want a subwoofer?

[StephenM]

That receiver is very powerful. There is not a speaker Klipsch has ever made it couldn't drive.

FWIW, the Pioneer is rated 150 watts into a 6 ohm load at 1kHz at 1% THD. On the spec sheet, it also has a "rated power output" of 110W + 110W without any other conditions.

For comparison, looking at Onkyo's international site, the 609 has a rating of 160 watts a channel into a 6 ohm load at 1kHz at 1% THD with one channel driven. It also has an RRP of 1399 AUD.

http://www.intl.onkyo.com/products/av_components/av_receivers/tx-nr609/index.html

Because the OP is in Australia, it's hard to say what is available and at what price. Unfortunately it seems their pricing is considerably higher than over here in the US.

[mustang guy]

That receiver is very powerful. There is not a speaker Klipsch has ever made it couldn't drive.

FWIW, the Pioneer is rated 150 watts into a 6 ohm load at 1kHz at 1% THD. On the spec sheet, it also has a "rated power output" of 110W + 110W without any other conditions.

For comparison, looking at Onkyo's international site, the 609 has a rating of 160 watts a channel into a 6 ohm load at 1kHz at 1% THD with one channel driven. It also has an RRP of 1399 AUD.

http://www.intl.onkyo.com/products/av_components/av_receivers/tx-nr609/index.html

Because the OP is in Australia, it's hard to say what is available and at what price. Unfortunately it seems their pricing is considerably higher than over here in the US.

Thank you for the clarification. The earlier poster mentioned pre/pro seperates if financially viable. I went from a 110wpc AVR to a similarly rated pre/pro, and it made a HUGE difference in too many ways to mention. The avr was about a $1200 and the pre/pro setup is more like $3900, so I am sure that has a LOT to do with it. But I feel a spent my money wisely.

[K5SS]

I would think that the mentioned receiver would drive the mentioned speakers with no problem at all. I would set the x-over at 80hz and add a couple of subwoofers to take some of the " strain" off the receiver. I am no expert but that is how I am driving my reference system with a pioneer SC-35 and it will literally get too loud for me to take it. I watch movies att -20 to-15( there is no way I cold ever reach reference 0 on the receiver)and it is PLENTY loud and it sounds killer( for a modest system).

[unspeakable]

Klipsch speakers are very efficient and dont require a ton of power to push. They are so efficient because of the horn tweeter and the corn concentrating the sound waves from the tweeter. With that said they are some limitations to receivers that will cause them to perform poorly with with larger receivers. What am i getting at? Well, if you were to go with the rf-42 II's you could stick with a receiver and be fine really, not much limitation at all by getting a receiver. If you get the rf-52's, rf-62's or rf-82's you will really start being affected by limitation. In any case to answer your question, yes that receiver would drive any of themodels you listed.

You are probably like "wtf is the limitation you keep yapping about?!!!". When you have a speaker with larger woofers they require more power to reach the lower extension of the frequency range. Receivers are inferior in the size of their torroids and capacitors and really lack the ability to supply power needed to speakers with larger drivers. Why? Well, there are a lot of things going into a receiver, much of which can be affected by large electromagnetic fields causes by the capacitors but more so the torroid. When a speaker is pumping, the impedence is constantly in flux. Klipsch speakers have a nominal impedence of 8 ohms but sometimes, especially in the rf-82's and rf-7's their impedence will dip down to 3-4-5-6-7 ohms depending on how how the sound is. The limitations of the receiver that you can perceive are untight bass at low and high frequencies, clipping (when the audio signal is cut at the top and bottom end creating distrotion which can damage your speaker, this happens when the receivers runs out of power) and overall sound clarity. Receivers are also often overrated, that means when it says 100 x 7 in 95% of the cases it means like 50-60 watts x 7 of actual useful power. Some are actually underrated or dead on but those are very rare.

if you are going to drop $1700 on a receiver, please please please consider buying separates as in a separate power amp and a processor. I would only suggest getting a receiver at that price point if room constraints really prohibit you. We do a ton of receiver bashing around here but its because at a certain point its well worth it to invest slightly more and get a power amp. Power amps can last for decades and rarely need to be upgraded because, well, the technology hasnt changed much in decades. If anything, they are more refined then ever before. Processors, well, those things are constantly outdated because of new sound formats, connectors, room correction etc. With a receiver, everytime you need new connectors or a format changes and your receiver doesnt support it you have to buy a whole new unit which means you are also paying for the amp inside as well which is most likely still good. Check out emotiva and outlaw audio, both are highly recommended amongst people in the forum as well as B&K, parasound, marantz, rotel and there are many more. Emotiva and outlaw audio are amongst the most affordable. My Emotiva XPA-5 power amp weighs i think 73lbs, that is just the amp. Most receivers, the high end ones top out at 40lbs, thats processor and amp all in 1 case. Its always better to have power on hand then to run out of power. Most of us like to have around 50 watts of overhead power as in 50 watts over the recommended rms of your speakers, this helps to avoid clipping at all costs. Processors can be a bit pricey at times, the emotiva umc-1 is on clearence right now for an excellent price and they give you a 40% of card to upgrade to the next emotiva processor, part of their business model. I have the umc-1 and now that almost all of the software glitches have been ironed out its a a great unit. I would only buy another brand to just compare but i can say that i am very happy and the xpa-5 is a brutish amp, provides all the power i need ever really.

I threw a lot of information at you, i always do this to people. Dont feel overwhelmed, just ask questions, its how we can help you best. What size room are you in? Whats your total budget? Are you in a home or condo/apt? Do you do mostly movies or music? Is size a constraint? Do you have to worry about the "Wife Acceptance Factor WAF"? Do you want a subwoofer?

I already have the vsx2021 receiver.
I live in a house with small rooms and will be moving a couple of years down the track but the rooms will be small again. Only problem is i like loud movies (action, thriller, comedy, sci-fi),and music (any Rock, and light Metal).

So because you said " Most of us like to have around 50 watts of overhead power" i would be ok with the 42's to avoid hurting the receiver, .
I like the cherry look which does not come with the 42's... would i still be ok with the 52's?
would i have to set the receiver to 6ohm setting? as they come set at 8ohm in box.
With the subwoofers in these sytems, because they have an internal amplifier, would that help to power the speakers aswell?
I will stick with 1 subwoofer, if i feel it does not have enough bass i will get another 1.

My budget for speakers would be somewhere up to $2,500 but $3,000 aud if it is a bit more. The WAF is not worried about it, so that is a plus.

[unspeakable]

I would think that the mentioned receiver would drive the mentioned speakers with no problem at all. I would set the x-over at 80hz and add a couple of subwoofers to take some of the " strain" off the receiver. I am no expert but that is how I am driving my reference system with a pioneer SC-35 and it will literally get too loud for me to take it. I watch movies att -20 to-15( there is no way I cold ever reach reference 0 on the receiver)and it is PLENTY loud and it sounds killer( for a modest system).

Which reference system do you have?

[cornfedksboy]

"Most of us like to have around 50 watts of overhead power" i would be ok with the 42's to avoid hurting the receiver, .
I like the cherry look which does not come with the 42's... would i still be ok with the 52's?

You wont hurt that receiver with any of the Reference lines unless you have the desire to go deaf.

Best bang for your buck for a combo movie/music set-up would be 2 X RF-62, RC-62, 2 X RB-61 (just my opinion). Definately need a decent sub as well.

[elitedemo]

My budget for speakers would be somewhere up to $2,500 but $3,000 aud if it is a bit more. The WAF is not worried about it, so that is a plus.

so i was looking through neweggs ad in the mornings (its my morning newspaper)

1. Klipsch Reference RF-62 II Floorstanding Speaker (Black Ash) Each x 2
2. Klipsch Reference RC-52 II Center Speaker, black ash wood grain vinyl Each
3. Klipsch Reference RS-52 II Surround Speaker, Matte Black Vinyl Each x 2
4. Klipsch Reference SW-310 Subwoofer, Black Satin Each
5. Pioneer VSX-1121-K 7.1-Channel A/V Receiver
6. Apple iPad 2 16GB with Wi-Fi - White MC979LL/A
Combo Discount: -$2,269.93 Combo Price: $2,299.99

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.755210&nm_mc=EMC-IGNEFL101411&cm_mmc=EMC-IGNEFL101411-_-EMC-101411-Index-_-Combo-_-755210-LE6A

less than your budget, but what you could do is sell that center when it arrives and buy a rc62ii, that should about put you on your low end budget (you could also sell that ipad that is in there not quite sure why they determined that was necessary)

free shipping too and it looks like the ad runs until the 20th of this month

[unspeakable]

My budget for speakers would be somewhere up to $2,500 but $3,000 aud if it is a bit more. The WAF is not worried about it, so that is a plus.

so i was looking through neweggs ad in the mornings (its my morning newspaper)

1. Klipsch Reference RF-62 II Floorstanding Speaker (Black Ash) Each x 2
2. Klipsch Reference RC-52 II Center Speaker, black ash wood grain vinyl Each
3. Klipsch Reference RS-52 II Surround Speaker, Matte Black Vinyl Each x 2
4. Klipsch Reference SW-310 Subwoofer, Black Satin Each
5. Pioneer VSX-1121-K 7.1-Channel A/V Receiver
6. Apple iPad 2 16GB with Wi-Fi - White MC979LL/A
Combo Discount: -$2,269.93 Combo Price: $2,299.99

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.755210&nm_mc=EMC-IGNEFL101411&cm_mmc=EMC-IGNEFL101411-_-EMC-101411-Index-_-Combo-_-755210-LE6A

aud means aussie dollar, WHICH MEANS I LIVE IN AUSTRALIA, newegg does not do international shipping.
But if you find another exactly the same/very similar deal that posts to austrlia that would be awesome []

[elitedemo]

id be lying if i said i didnt skip most of the post as it was pretty close together with alot happening in it, not sure i can help you with companies who ship to aussies, kind of suprised newegg doesnt to international

[unspeakable]

id be lying if i said i didnt skip most of the post as it was pretty close together with alot happening in it, not sure i can help you with companies who ship to aussies, kind of suprised newegg doesnt to international

No worries. I'll probably just have to buy the speakers separate in eBay or somewhere. But I will it admit it is a awesome deal with newegg. If only I lived in the u.s

[derrickdj1]

I agree that the pioneer avr will drive those speakers without a problem. Due to the effiency of the Klipasch speaker, power is usually not a problem with use in the HT. Music lovers may need the extra power of an amp. I use my HT 90% for movies and TV. I have a pioneer SC 35 and watch blue-ray at a volume of -35 to -25.

Pioneer SC 35

Klipsch VF 35 Front

Klipsch VS 14 Front Height

Klipsch VS 14 Surround

Klipsch VC 25 Center

Klipsch VB 15 Surround Back

Klipsch SW

Samsung 51in 3D TV

Samsung 3D BD

Wii for netflix and exercise (lol -not a gamer)