mike stehr Posted June 2, 2002 Share Posted June 2, 2002 I'm using a pair of Eico HF-f 12's with the integrated parts eliminated. (Well, one is down.) I'm not sure if this is a series Push-pull, but I know it's a EL-84 Push-pull with a feedback loop. I geuss this would be around 14 watts max? Anyways, this is no super-audio setup, I'm just getting this tube setup started. With a cheap portable CD player,(I needed volume control!)and just the amps hooked-up to a pair of '95 Chorus II's. Compared to a 440 watt MX-1 Yamaha, it was like I stuck my foot in the *** of those Chorus II's, I could get the cabs to resonate. I can do it with the Yamaha, but by then, the horns are in death mode, and sound terrible. On the Tube amps I have to watch myself, or I'll keep turning it up and up, and the horns don't scream. I never pushed the portable CD player more than a little around half way volume wise. Plenty of power for me, doesn't sound perfect and have many gremlins to kill, but Tubes and high-efficiency speakers go hand-in hand. The Ella might be easier to source Tubes for, especially if you wanted to roll NOS tubes. Looking for 4 NOS 2A3's could be a real chore. Hell, I don't know, I'm new. I'm just waiting for the Basie to have the Phono option and I'm in. THANX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted June 4, 2002 Author Share Posted June 4, 2002 Hey Mike... Just noticed your tag on this thread. You know, ironically enough, or maybe not... I have found the EICO integrateds to sound better with the preamp section intact, stock or not. This is coming from someone that has had separates since 1980 or so besides some flirtation with integrateds as second systems. I am quite positive that the HF-81 does indeed sound better as a whole. I have run it with a quality passive unit as well as a few preamps, including my modified Cary SLP-70. The only way I liked using a separate preamp with this unit is when I would run the mod Cary phono section into the line in of the EICO, effectively just bypassing the intergral phono stage. Otherwise, the HF-81 sounded more of a whole and better with its own preamp then with the Cary with a set of IC, not matter what the quality of the IC. Of course, your results may vary here. This is just what I found via my testing. I dont know the condition of those units and their preamp section is actually a bit different from the HF-81 I believe. Did you ever try running them intact? JOBMAN, I actually saw that listing and thought of you. Let us know how it turns out. I will second the notion once again that George WRight does great work for the money involved although this is his most costly (though full featured) preamp to date. Have not read any comment on it so yours will be some of the first. Drop me a mail as well. kh ------------------ Phono Linn LP-12 Vahalla / Linn Basic Plus / Sumiko Blue Point CD Player Rega Planet Preamp Cary Audio SLP-70 w/Phono Modified Amplifier Welborne Labs 2A3 Moondog Monoblocks Cable DIYCable Superlative / Twisted Cross Connect Speaker 1977 Klipsch Cornwall I w/Alnico & Type B Crossover system one online / alternate components / Asylum Listing f>s> This message has been edited by mobile homeless on 06-04-2002 at 07:19 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted June 4, 2002 Share Posted June 4, 2002 crash827 I think 107 db is a little optimistic with 13 Watts unless the room is very small. I use Heresy's with a 20 Watt PP EL84 amp and 107db is on the ragged edge and real loud. Heck that's above Rock concert levels I believe ! I think your ears would split with that level for long any ways. Of coarse this also all depends on the room size the setup will be in too. Craig ------------------ HH Scott 299 Amp HH Scott LT-110B Tuner HH Scott P-87 Turn Table JVC JL-F50 Turn Table Sony CDP-CA7ES CD Drive 1985 Walnut Heresey I W/Layne Audio Woofers KSW-15 Subs>c> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anarchist Posted June 4, 2002 Share Posted June 4, 2002 Hi Nos, Dang it. I just pulled the plug on an Eico HF-81 with 14 watts. Oh well, we shall hear how it sounds. If it sounds good but low, I will just move on to the Ella. At least the Eico is a cheap-in to the tube scene before plunking down 6 or 7 bills on a new amp. Rock concert is much louder or at least they were when I was younger. I like it loud. Sit hear and have folk tunes playing averaging 104 on the RatShack meter. It is a little loud for conversations or extended listening. ------------------ Home Theater KSP 400's KSP C6 KSP S6's Yamaha RXV995 (Current) Bryston 9BST (On the horizon) Bryston SP1.7 (A little further on the horizon) Music Room Heresy's KG4's KSW200 Ella PP EL-34 (Coming soon) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 Well, I hope the Eico HF-81 works out. Mobile, I did try one of these Eico HF-12's 'Intact'. Seemed to sound nice. The pots were noisy. It would have been nice to still have Bass/Treble, but oh well. I mostly ditched the integrated sections of the amps to get out of two tubes, a lot of wire, and save a few bucks on parts. (And also to try to get the power transformers to cool down, it helped a little bit, I think.) Though one amp had a 12AU7 tube, and the other had a 12AX7, these were the tubes for the tone/volume circuit. Both use the 12AX7 for the driver tube. The one I listened to was the one with the 12AX7. Didn't try the one with the 12AU7, it was soldered pretty weak, and didn't bother. It's all new to me, I haven't had 22 years experience. These amps could sound terrible for all I know, but they sound good to me. More interesting than the Yamaha solid scrape, less fatigue. It's a interesting hobby. I wonder how a Basie Pre-amp would work out with these amps? Who knows? THANX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 crash827, You may find the HF-81 is way under rated wattage wise. I had one that was in real bad shape but personally thought 14 watts was way off on its output. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted June 5, 2002 Author Share Posted June 5, 2002 Tube watts go much farther than solid state due to various reasons, one of the main being the excellent clipping characteristics. That being said, watts is one of the sure-fire ways to misjudge an amplifier's capabilities. My 3.5w 2A3 amps have better bass and more extension (when used with appropriate speakers) than any of the EL-34 OR EL-84 amps I have had in my system. Of course, I have not had anything over 50w in tube PP here in quite a while. Still, as I have tried to say, looking at capability just in watts is misleading. NOS is right in that the little EICO sounds far more powerful than a 14w would lead you to believe. Then again, when I tell people we are listening to 3.5w, there is TOTAL disbelief. Much of this has to do with the quality of the transformers, especially the output iron. Also, one must factor in the design and stiffness of the Power Supply circuit. Still, the little EICO WILL run out of steam if pushed. I must mention that the benefits of tube amplification bring a different way of listening to music that forces one to go past (or you miss the boat) more standard criteria you see such as room shaking bass and window rattling capability. I sort of wished you had waited on the EICO ebay purchase but now done, I hope to all hell you lucked out. kh ------------------ Phono Linn LP-12 Vahalla / Linn Basic Plus / Sumiko Blue Point CD Player Rega Planet Preamp Cary Audio SLP-70 w/Phono Modified Amplifier Welborne Labs 2A3 Moondog Monoblocks Cable DIYCable Superlative / Twisted Cross Connect Speaker 1977 Klipsch Cornwall I w/Alnico & Type B Crossover system one online / alternate components / Asylum Listing f>s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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