Lets settle this for once and for all: does more power open up Klipsch speakers?

[Kain]

I have read numerous comments here on the Klipsch forum that using a high-powered separate amplifier opens up and breathes life into Klipsch speakers vs. an A/V receiver or low-powered amplifier. Many people on the AVS Forum and other forums have said that this is not possible because Klipsch speakers are very efficient and do not need much power to reach high volume levels.

So, what is it? Does more power really "transform" Klipsch speakers? If so, why, considering they are so efficient?

[CRAZY4SOUND]

High volume levels and great sound are two different things. one can be achieved without the other. Usually with a seperate amp comes better quality. I push my klipsch klf 30s with a 300 watt per channel cinenova grande 5 and there is nothing like it. Just for shits and giggles i ran them straight from my pioneer elite vsx92txh not a slouch at 130 watts per channel and there is no comparison in quality or volume. IMHO.....

[Guest " "]

this is a puzzling question. for most folks, reguardless of the forum and doctrine associated with those forums, the answers seems simple. Before attempting to answer this question....a review is needed about amps and crossover networks. Amps can be classified as current driven or voltage driven. A lot of inexpensive amps behave more like voltage driven amps and a lot of more expensive amps behave more like current driven amps. Some differences are the larger power supplies and increases in parallel output drivers in current driven amps. On the crossover side a typical L/C parallel crossover network works well with voltage driven amps. Crossover networks that have L/C circuts that are in series are considered to be optimized for current driven amps. So what you have here is a perception of sound change due to moving from an amp that is more like a voltage driven amp to one that has elements of a current driven one while at the same time using a crossover network that has elements of a network optimized for current driven amplifiers. So basically, there's more going on than a separation of function (integrated amp to separates) and increasing the size of the amp function. There are some underlying changes in how the amp functions in terms of being characterized as a voltage driven amp or a current driven one.

[psg]

My take: If speakers have an easy impedance curve (no low dip or wild phase swings), then it won't make much difference what you use to drive them.The Klipschorn falls into this category. On the other hand, if they have difficult impedance curves (like the RF7 and to a lesser degree RF7-ii), then using a seperate amp with the ability to handle the load will sound much better. So it's not a question of power required to open up the speakers (otherwise speakers would have no dynamic range at all and would only sound good at full blast).

My take on power amps: I'd rather take the power rating out of the AV receiver buying equation. Sometimes the only spec that changes within a receiver lineup is the power, and the price doubles from lowest to highest power. Get the receiver with the features you want (including pre-outs), disregarding the power rating, and get separate amps for the power. The amps will outlive several AV receivers.

[Youthman]

Well, I have no idea what speakerfritz just said [] so all I can share is what my ears have heard when I switched to my parasound 220 x 5 external amp.

I agree with PSG in that the impedance dips are probably a big reason to use dedicated amps. Asking a receiver to handle 3 ohms is extremely taxing, especially when it is trying to power 7 speakers, perform digital processing as well as video processing. Talking about multitasking madness!

Below is a quote from My First Impressions of the Parasound HCA2205a thread.

After listening to several different source material (CD's, Bluray,
Concert DVD's), here are my thoughts on the amp.

First off, this
amp is a beast. It weighs 85 pounds. It has two handles on front and
two on back that aid in lifting the unit. The back has 5 speaker
outputs, 5 line inputs and 5 input levels. It has more heat sinks than a
Florida Gator has teeth.

From what I can see, this amp is built like a tank, rugged and durable.
It's not flashy like the Emotiva but the great thing is that with it's
simple designed faceplate, no lights are seen through the grill cloth on
the cabinet door.

With 220 watts x 5, the Parasound adds even
more bottom end to the RF-83's, giving them more authority in the bass
region. I used to not enjoy listening to music in 5.1 or 7ch stereo but
with the new amp, it really brings the surround channels to life. With
movies, the surrounds seem more alive and engaged. At high volumes,
the amp has no problems maintaining the integrity of the source
material. The sound never gets harsh or muddy. Crystal clear no matter
what volume. Musical has more separation of instruments than with the
Yamaha alone.

[CRAZY4SOUND]

85 lbs is a heavy amp. so you can imagine moving my 300 watt earthquake cinenova grande 5 it weighs in at 129lbs. It is definetly the grandfather of amplifiers. But back to the original question, If you can afford to add external amplification it is highly recommended and I can say from owning a couple Parasound amplifiers, If money is an issue, you absolutely cannot go wrong with Parasound. IMHO Parasound is for the money one of the best sounding amplifiers out and have an enormous amount of head room. As youthman said crystal clear no matter what the volume and klipsch speakers love parasound.

[Quiet_Hollow]

So, what is it?

It's an argument that encompasses way too many variables...IMHO

Sufficient quality of sound at the right SPL's are not solely based on power. Power can be a limiting factor, but it certainly is not the only factor.

[derrickdj1]

What
are you looking for in a power amplifier or AVR for you HT system?
Power amps or avr's need, high-current, high voltage, speed (slew
rate) , and stability over the entire bandwidth, are some of the key
features of a good power amplifier or avr. The slew rate, or the
time required for an amp to go from 10% to 90% of it's total output
voltage determines how fast the amp can change under various loads.
The current delivered to charge the capacitor is also a key factor
in the power amps performance. Under high current load an amp
produces heat which must be dissipated to keep the unit from failing.
If the output stage of the amp has a delay in charging and
discharging the signal from the input stage, certain frequencies in
the bandwidth will be out of phase. All of the above parameters are
key to the amps/avr's performance. This is directly related to the
sound quality, SQ. Certain qualities attributable to different types
of amplifiers are a result of how well they are able to perform these
functions.

To
select a high speed, high voltage amplifier for a certain purpose,
one has to look not only at the bandwidth and/or slew rate of the
amplifier, but also at the expected capacitive load, the maximum
sustainable output current and the possibility of overshoot voltages
damaging the load. All of these are required for an optimal sound.

The
number of amps in the HT system, number of transformer, rectifier and
capacitors for each channel also influence the imaging properties of
a HT system in conjunction with the speakers, room, crossover
settings and other parameters. It is a bit like seduction, all
things having to be working perfectly to achieve the ideal sound.

[derrickdj1]

My post was long due to the number of things that an amp must do. To keep it simple, in general, amps are design better to deliver the power part of the equation than most avr's. Weather you need one, well it depends.