Diggs Posted March 12, 2001 Share Posted March 12, 2001 First off, I have to admit these speakers are great. However my Denon reciever seems to have blown the bottom woofers (not the top though...hmmm). I don't understand how this happened since first off we all know Denon doesn't exactly pump out pounding bass. My bass has been set on +8 out of 12. When I put on a CD with just a bass guitar playing (like the Smashing Pumpkins) you can hear a buzz from both speakers and when I gently laid my finger on the buzzing woofer the buzz was gone for a few seconds then came back. When a lot of instruments are playing there is no distortion or it is drowned out. Does anyone know where I can get replacements cheap? None on ebay, and I dont want to pay a local dealer mucho $$$. Any alternatives maybe for a different brand of woofers or are these woofers "what makes the speaker" Help needed! ------------------ Denon AVR-2800 KG-4 mains Polk C-175 center Infintiy RS-10 Surrounds Audiosource SW-15 subwoofer All in a 12x12 apartment bedroom. "What?! I can't hear you!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted March 12, 2001 Share Posted March 12, 2001 Diggs - Greetings from a fellow KG-4 owner. I have a Denon 3300, and have found that it puts plenty of bass into my KG-4s - enough to vibrate my couch without having to boost the bass! You say you hear a buzz from BOTH speakers, but only on the bottom woofer? Hmmm... you might borrow a friend's receiver and see if it works any different. It might be the Denon's problem. Unusual to have the same symptoms in 2 different speakers... If I misread your description of the problem, and it's just one speaker having the problem, then try switching speakers to see if the problem follows the speaker. If it does, call Klipsch at 1-800-KLIPSCH and ask about ordering a replacement woofer. Any other ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erdric Posted March 12, 2001 Share Posted March 12, 2001 I think that Doug is on to something here. You only hear this sound at one point on the CD and it is coming from both speakers? Sounds like it's something other than the speakers. I know that on occasion I hear things that make me jump up and stick my ear in the speaker to see if it is distortion. It always turns out that the speakers are putting out sound so clearly that it is picking up background information that is not always discernable with less clear speakers. The other day I was listening to a jazz cd that I was unfamiliar with. I swore that I heard something in the background that was not music and I was worried. As it turns out it was the musician mumbling along with the music. My friend tells me that this particular musician is known for it. I was amazed that the klipsch were producing such soft and incoherent sound so clearly, sound that was obviously buried deep in the mix. Sorry for rambling on. The moral of the story is check to make sure that the sound you are concerned about is not coming upstream of the speakers. Good Luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted March 12, 2001 Share Posted March 12, 2001 Good point, Erdric. Better check to see if you get the buzzing with other music sources, not just the one CD. I recently added Forte's to my speaker mix and played a cd with piano solos on it. Heard a rhythmic soft thumping sound that I hadn't noticed before. Upon closer listening, I determined it was the sound of the foot pedal on the piano as the player was pressing it to the floor!! Yeah Klipsch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggs Posted March 12, 2001 Author Share Posted March 12, 2001 This can only be heard when there is no other background noise but a low bass noise. My Denon never has put out much bass. I have the mains set on large and if i turn up the bass to 12 it isn't very powerful. So I've kept it at 8 which sounds the same and just to keep things on the safe side (once in a while there will be a heavy bass note). 6 sounds too weak. The buzz comes out of both speakers and can be eliminated with a slight pressure to the woofer. I didn't have this problem from the KLH speakers they replaced, so I know it's not the receiver. Maybe I just need to keep the volume down from now on. Are there any other comparable brands of woofers instead of the Klipsch or will i be lessening the quality by replacing them with another brand? I got these off ebay for $175 and one of the woofers had already been replaced, and replacement woofers are $80 apiece! So much for getting a deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted March 12, 2001 Share Posted March 12, 2001 Diggs - I can't offer much more myself, except to mention that just because you didn't hear it with the KLH's does not mean that the speakers are the problem. The efficiency and accuracy of the KG-4s can bring out things that have always been there but you've never heard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erdric Posted March 12, 2001 Share Posted March 12, 2001 >>The buzz comes out of both speakers and can be eliminated with a slight pressure to the woofer<< If you tell me what smashing pumpkins track you are listening to then I could try it on my kg-4's. I have most but not all of their cd's. I could see if I get the same buzz that you are hearing. I would need to know if volume had an effect on the ability to hear the buzz. Get back to me. I have no idea if this will work but have you tried applying pressure to the woofer with other music to see if you can affect it in a similar manner. What I mean is that if you are able to change the buzz in a specific fashion then can you reproduce the same change with another piece of music? It might be impossible to get reliable data doing this but it's worth a try. The thing that still bothers me is that you are getting it out of both speakers at the same time. I just find it hard to believe that both woofers in two separate enclosures were simultaneously damaged in such a way that they now produce the exact same buzzing. I could be wrong though. If I am then I would suggest that you spring for the klipsch replacement woofers. $175 is a steal for kg-4's. I just got my kg-4's for $150 to replace my kg-3's and I would have happily spent double now that I have heard them in my setup. They are worth the $80 replacement cost IMO. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron N Posted March 13, 2001 Share Posted March 13, 2001 Are the speakers sealed properly? If the speaker isn't sealed properly aginst the cabinet, I'm wondering if that would make the "buzz". Just as a note, I have to adjust the grilles of my KG 5.5's on occasion because they rattle sometimes. Didn't know if one of these things could be contributing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggs Posted March 13, 2001 Author Share Posted March 13, 2001 Bullet with Butterfly Wings as soon as the bass guitar hits. After listening to this track over and over it seems that only one is distorting. I may have been over analyzing last night and was listening for the slightest distortion. So the problem is from only one speaker and if I turn it up it on this track it gets really bad. It also happens on other CD's too, but the odd thing is that it only happens on some bass notes. I put on the new Outkast Cd and it only had a problem playing certain notes. It seems to do OK on punchy bass like Prodigy or anything techno, but bass guitars create a buzz. Im not sure what frequency they are, but if you listen to that track you'll know what im talking about. The speakers seem well sealed and I tried to tighten the screws and they wouldn't budge, and all testing was done with the grilles off. Im pretty sure it's blown so Ill just get a new one. Thanks for the help all! PS Is the same signal sent to both woofers? It does seem odd that only the bottom one would blow out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted March 13, 2001 Share Posted March 13, 2001 One last check, Diggs. Swap the speakers and see if the buzz follows the speaker. (just to be sure...). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BobG Posted March 13, 2001 Share Posted March 13, 2001 +8 on the bass control is certainly inviting amplifier distortion, especially on music with strong bass content. The fact that Dougdrake's couch vibrates with bass set neutral while Diggs finds it best to raise bass +8 should be the biggest indicator of what's going on here. I have my Columbo trenchcoat on as I type. Perhaps Diggs just digs (sorry, I just can't help it) bass more than Dougdrake. Possibly, Diggs's room has a null in the bass at the listening position. If this is the case, cranking the bass up won't do much of anything. The more output, the deeper the null. Like an audio black hole. Diggs, you're probably just overdriving those woofers or you may have burnt the coils in them from abuse and now they are scraping. Possibly, you are hearing what's called tinsel slap, where the flexible leads going to the voice coil are slapping the back side of the woofer cones. If you need replacement drivers, there is only one sensible approach - original parts. Putting anything else in will not work properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Fini Posted March 13, 2001 Share Posted March 13, 2001 BobG- How sensible would it be to have Klipsch(or someone reliable) repair the woofs? I have a similar problem with my KG4's, and the repair option was suggested to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggs Posted March 13, 2001 Author Share Posted March 13, 2001 Doug - Buzz still present. Even distorts on Bob Segers voice from across the room. BobG - Maybe my room is not exactly bass friendly, but when I turn the bass all the way up and stand next to the speaker is the only time I feel anything. The passives emit practically nothing. My little Aiwa 60W/channel bookshelf could make my old KLH's shake the floor (it sounded like crap though), and this Denon can't come close. Oh well, that's what i got the sub for. I'm just disappointed that I heard such great things about these speakers being able to handle anything you throw at them and mine failed. Im not giving up on these things, they sound terrific. Good news though, I found an audio site on the web with a pair of KG-4's with damaged cabinets, but the components are in good condition, unless anyone thinks it would be better to get new woofers. Again, thanks everyone for your help, hopefully I'll come back with good news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted March 14, 2001 Share Posted March 14, 2001 Diggs - All I can tell you is that the KG4s, properly working, will give you lots of bass. Others on this board with KG4s will attest to that. You might check your speaker configuration in the Denon and make sure the front speakers are set to LARGE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djk Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 >>Does anyone know where I can get replacements cheap? None on ebay, and I dont want to pay a local dealer mucho $$$. Any alternatives maybe for a different brand of woofers or are these woofers "what makes the speaker" Help needed! << I am going to make myself very unpopular with most people here and recommend you buy four MCM part number 55-860 at $17.95 each.This is the Pioneer B20FU14-54F clear poly cone 8" woofer.The Thiel Small parameters are correct for the KG4.You don't mention the age of your KG4s.I am going to guess late 80's.For a while in the late 80's Klipsch had a problem with the K8K woofers.The coils had dry spots when wrapped and these would rattle on certain program material.Touch the cone and it would stop.Very noticable on piano. Klipsch no longer offers the original K8K and you would have to settle for the K3K at $80 each.MCM is at 800-543-4330.If they won't sell to you I have an account with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charliko Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 quote: Originally posted by dougdrake: One last check, Diggs. Swap the speakers and see if the buzz follows the speaker. (just to be sure...). My first thought was surely the spkrs are fused..... Dougdrake: I am wondering about the Fortes you purchased. Did you put them into home theatre use? with the KG-4"s....just curious about the mix of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 Charliko - The mix is a real mix-up right now. Not sure how it will play out. I removed the KG4s from my HT (they are now in the living room). The Forte's took their place. I will be upgrading the center to either a Forte or a Heresy II (currently evaluating them in a a/b test). I presently have SS-1 rears (from when the KG4s were the mains) which I know may be a little on the light side for the Fortes. However, they will stay for the time being. While I really like my KG4s, the Fortes blow them away... Doug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oregon_guy Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 for what its worth: I picked up a link to a great company in Illinois that fixes speakers (among many other things, like manufacturing tube amps). Its a little company with a great rep. Check this url: http://www.decware.com/repairs.htm or http://www.decware.com/quotes.htm there's a lot of interesting audiophile stuff to be seen at this website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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