vindeville Posted September 13, 2015 Author Share Posted September 13, 2015 Spezjag I added corner reflectors in my lascalas when I had them but I did not hear a change then if I remember correctly. I have read that those harsh corners create "bubbles" in those areas that effect flow of sound. Is say add them as its not difficult and certainly won't hurt. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vindeville Posted September 13, 2015 Author Share Posted September 13, 2015 I forgot to mention i was also able to raise the level on my mids 3db yesterday for better balance after the tail board change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) I.LL RESPOND AS I SEE FIT... Mr. Spezjag was trying to be helpful to you. Intelligent discussion here is the norm, not the exception, and personal insults will not help anyone get their points across. It sounds to me like you have done some good research and have some experience in this area and have some helpful views to share. Even though I have never met Mr. Vindeville he sounds like an intelligent person who is sharing his experiences, the same as you. I find it most helpful, and speaking as a third party reader, more interesting, to understand and reconcile the differences. Maybe he's using a $10,000 cable that exposes the sound waves that you don't have. Who knows? Edited September 13, 2015 by wvu80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 ALSO ,,Place your fingers on the access door to the bass bin,,, It vibrats,,,when playing loud percussion,,, I placed a extra layer of bracing,, Adding any some damping layers inside the bass bin is a no no,,,,, It CHANGES the impedence EMF,,,, PAUL K was very stricked about that,,, Also the compliance of the woofer can be compromised,,, The expiraments on cone treatments by ASHWORTH and PAUL In earlier woofer designs showed where the problems are,, It took STEVENS to give PWK the best woofers back then,, EMINENCE now provides the proper woofer,,Propriatory,,, Not the Crits,,Although its close,, Some of the latter EMINENCE woofers have been slightly changed,,,,,,, I don't like any of the mid horns in the K horn,,and that cheep mid driver,,,But remember the Klipsch Company does not make speakers ,,But only horn designs and enclosures,,, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 WVU 80,,, Your coming from the wrong direction,,,.....Georg Ashworth was a scientist in his own right that helped with woofer problems with Paul Klipsch in finding a proper woofer compliance,,, I new him very well,, Paul K made a special bass bin with a special access door so George could change woofers faster to make tests,,,Remember all woofers back then had a higher free air resonance point,, Paul needed to change that,,, George provided the special chemical to help lower that problem,,,in outer compliance,,, Paul had to apply that,,on each woofer himself,,,It was that STEVENS gave him the woofer type he wanted,, saving paul all that labor. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 Anyone ever try radius/curved reflective surfaces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 JBL does.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) Anyone ever try radius/curved reflective surfaces. If you look up the Stan White, Inc. Loudspeaker Company you'll notice that the term "multi-flare" is used. It's a design feature that utilizes radii to make transitions within the folding of the horn. The 4-D Millennium was a large, dual 15" JBL driver, rear-loaded system similar to the Jensen Imperial that utilized the concept. I was fortunate to trade emails with Stan before his death. Apparently during a hi-fi show in Chicago, engineers from nearby Jensen were pawing all over his 4-D Millennium. A year later the Imperial was introduced, a copy without the so-called "mutli-flare" which, at the time, was a patent protected concept. You have got to LOVE Janice, the model in the picture below, classic 50s marketing. Stan White made a business decision that haunted him, to raise capital, he gave Eddie Bracken, the actor, control of the company. The relationship didn't work well and Bracken hobbled Stan. Stan was a degreed EE and a smart guy. As he mentioned to me, he got even with Bracken by outliving him. Edited September 13, 2015 by John Warren 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) WVU 80,,, Your coming from the wrong direction,,,.(respectful snip!) Ha! That would be the first time ever... +++ I'm not debating the physics or the sound, that's for you guys. I'm just following a topic about which I don't know anything. And I hope you know I was kidding about the $10,000 cable. Edited September 13, 2015 by wvu80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vindeville Posted September 13, 2015 Author Share Posted September 13, 2015 Interesting insight Zako. Thanks. I am planning on beefing up the woofer door as well and its good to hear it may be worth while based on anothers experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 WVU80,,, I am not a fan of political correctness,,,(respectfull snip) Cable design has come along way,,,,,,, PAUL K used a hell of a lot of lamp cord,,, ,,,So did I,,, 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 13, 2015 Share Posted September 13, 2015 VIN... Like I said before padding the inside of the bass bin is a bad idea,, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 I found it the chemical used on the outer surround was....dibutylphalate Paul used it on the EV and Jenson woofers to lower Fe to about 28 fe 37 in horn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vindeville Posted September 16, 2015 Author Share Posted September 16, 2015 Modified the reflectors as pictured. Shortened and 45d to match top n bottom of horn shape. Measured 6" down at tip of wedge n cut angle back from that. I won't try to describe what I hear any further but I like the version. I like where I'm at with this. Hope someone else gives a try and reports. Been fun messing with this. Only need to do a couple of small holes in the tail board to pass screws through. Easily undone if wanted as well of course. I drew a center line on back of reflector and lined up peeking through holes that are also centered. Sorry pics aren't great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 16, 2015 Share Posted September 16, 2015 Good.... Years ago I just added an extra stiffner to the outside of that board..Plus added a stiffner to the bass access door...Its been that way for 40 yrs.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 16, 2015 Share Posted September 16, 2015 Years ago Klipsch Licenced VITAVOX to make the Khorn in Europe,,,, The bass bin was of a thicker dimensional wood,, 3/4 and thicker,,,This eliminated all this beefing up of thinner wood Paul used,,,Plus a better woofer, Plus a better mid and horn,,,VITAVOX was way ahead on QUALITY 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vindeville Posted September 18, 2015 Author Share Posted September 18, 2015 Years ago Klipsch Licenced VITAVOX to make the Khorn in Europe,,,, The bass bin was of a thicker dimensional wood,, 3/4 and thicker,,,This eliminated all this beefing up of thinner wood Paul used,,,Plus a better woofer, Plus a better mid and horn,,,VITAVOX was way ahead on QUALITY Interesting, I have wondered if anyone has ever tried sand loading the top of the khorn bass bin. The top fold cavity in mine seams completely sealed. I have looked this over inside and out and cannot see any opening into another section of the horn. I have thought what if a 2" hole was drilled in on the top and sand or lead shot poured into this area? could do the bottom to. Edgar discussed improvements with sand loading on top of bass bins. Anyone ever tried this or have thoughts. Is there any place material could leak out if this was done? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 The bass bin is pretty massive...and solid... BUT Vitavox use of thicker wood was a sound idea,,,,But in the end...the bass frequencies were not one white note better,,,,, Adding sand would not make that last note any cleaner,,....A bigger room would help more,,,,, MY bat cave is 18 x 28 The bass frequencies have room to breath 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 The top fold cavity probably would not hold the weight...And would rip through... A friend of mine thought of making a 3" hole and pouring in concrete..After hardening,,Fliping over and doing the same to bottom cavity,, C R A Z Y 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vindeville Posted September 18, 2015 Author Share Posted September 18, 2015 (edited) Khorn bin is definitely ridged and heavy. I was thinking more of a deadening effect that may smooth our 200hz range where there is a peak. Thought bass might tighten up a bit as well. My room isn't bad, 18x14 but yea, i'd like to have a bigger room. Just always looking at playing with something else to wring more out. I guess I just have a fascination with this stuff more than anything. Edited September 21, 2015 by vindeville Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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