wuzzzer Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 I have an older Panasonic SA-XR57 fully digital receiver and love everything about it except the lack of modern lossless audio decoding and no HDMI upconversion. In my search for a more modern digital receiver I found the Pioneer SC series with its Class D3 amplification. Is this the same or similar to the digital amplification in my Panasonic? I love the sound quality and lightweight nature of it so if the Pioneer would match that I would definitely upgrade. Any other suggestions for digital receivers? Looking to spend about $500 max and don't mind buying used. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 Class D amplification doesn't mean digital... In addition to the SC elites, check out NADs latest M series based on the class D hypex units. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 Thanks Schu. Maybe I'm using incorrect terminology. Basically what I'm trying to ask is are the fundamentals of the Pioneer D3 amplification the same/similar to my Panasonic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet_Hollow Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 No. Not the same, however the DSP and power supply capability in the Elite SC series yields significant performance. I feel your pain, and it's the only reason the Pioneer drives my living room system.....otherwise I'd still be using my XR-57's. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 I think if you are patient and shop wisely, you will be able to find a used elite on the secondary market. I've been using pioneer class d for years and have been in love with the cleanliness of the sound for home theater. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willland Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 My buddy wants me to sell his Pioneer Elite SC-05 AVR. It is from 2008/2009 and is very powerful. Not sure if it is modern enough but does decode lossless Dolby TrueHD and DTS Master Audio Blu-ray formats. I think he wants $375.00 shipped. This graph shows that the SC-05's left channel, from Multi input to speaker output with two channels driving 8-ohm loads continuously at 1 kHz, reaches 0.1% distortion at 168.1 watts and 1% distortion at 197.2 watts. Into 4 ohms, the amplifier reaches 0.1% distortion at 249.6 watts and 1% distortion at 338.4 watts. With five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads (blue curve), the amp reaches 0.1% distortion at 119.7 watts and 1% distortion at 153.9 watts. With seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads (green curve), the amp reaches 0.1% distortion at 137.8 watts and 1% distortion at 149.0 watts. It's odd that the power output at 0.1% distortion with five channels driven is less than with seven channels driven, but that is indeed the case with this AVR. The test was performed several times to verify this result. He loves his pioneer Elites but is eliminating a system because he moved to a smaller house and does not need three multichannel rigs. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted November 22, 2017 Author Share Posted November 22, 2017 Thanks willand. There's an SC-05 local to me for $350. Might have to check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 That gen elite is ice based class d... pioneer moved away from ice based class d after the sc35/37... which I owned. Many folks still covet that gen ice based elite, though it does have a less advanced form of MCACC room correction/processing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet_Hollow Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 22 hours ago, Schu said: Many folks still covet that gen ice based elite, Very likely because they've never experienced a fully tuned, late model D3 unit (Elite SC-57 onward). OP, here's one of the primary reasons the XR sounds good: Very little idle noise, with consistent behavior until the PS prevents the chips from melting. OTOH, here's one of the primary reasons the D3's are so awesome for HT: There's a little more noise to start off with (first thing I immediately noticed when I compared the two on my La Scala), but the amps quickly hit their stride...and continue to perform extremely well all the way into war volume. With a good signal, the D3's have an "unlimited" sound....the type of performance that will run me straight out of the house because it's so loud, but have me giggling in the front yard because it still sounds soooo good, even outside. Sure, the Equibit craps out before the D3's power-wise....that's a given. But what is also not shown (and is noticed by many that have spent time with the XR), is that the Equibit doesn't have inspiring IMD numbers once you step on the gas. Couple that with no TrueHD or DTS-HD capability during movies (only the lossy core), and movie soundtracks can come across bright or grainy at times, all the while PCM performance (like typical 2-ch stuff) remains stellar. Consider those two above to the graph of the earlier model SC. Throw MCACC Pro on top of that as Schu mentioned, and it's really hard find a better solution, all under one hood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet_Hollow Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 FWIW - Back in the day, Panasonic did offer a direct competitor to the Pioneer ICE-based Elites in the form of the Tripath powered SA-BX500. It was TrueHD and DTS-HD capable. Definitely worth checking out, if you can source one. Last I looked, they were more elusive than the SA-XR700. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Home theater transients are really good with a D3 Elite but I have to admit that I am using very expensive Bel Canto monoblocks for my RL... and soon for my center(s) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrickdj1 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 I have a SC 37 that I will let go for $375. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted November 24, 2017 Author Share Posted November 24, 2017 On 11/23/2017 at 11:20 AM, derrickdj1 said: I have a SC 37 that I will let go for $375. Great price but I'm going to look for something local first. I'll keep you in mind! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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