New Heresy cabinets?

[jimbop]

I've read that the Heresy cabinet is actually too small for the woofer. Has anyone built new cabinets based on the TS parameters of the woofer? Would any crossover changes be necessary, or would the main result be better and/or lower bass response?

JD

[ttaylor]

Yes the cabinets that the Heresy uses are too small if you require LF response below 70hz. Ive been experimenting w/ large reflex boxes with only fair results because the E22 woofer just gets overpowered by the horns. I recently did a temp mod on my xo per John Albright(voices the Heresy like a LS) and after putting the E22 into a 4.5cu foot vented cab, I got down to 38hz and it apprears to be now better matched to the horns with the new xo. I will be designing a better reflex box once I establish the exact woofer I have and see how it sounds.

taylor

[J.4knee]

I would be interested in what you come up with for xo and cabinet mods. I was thinking ALK's for the xos but cabinet mods to help match bigger Heritage series sounds interesting too. If its not too much trouble could you publish you cabinet dimensions when you work it out. I am interested in putting Heresys in my system as a center and rear surrounds to go along with my La Scalas.

[ttaylor]

Heres a link to a thread which contains schematics and pics of Johns LS voiced Heresy xo. Once I build the cabinets, I will post my findings.

http://forums.klipsch.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=38292&forumID=71&catID=19&search=1&searchstring=&sessionID={97CE6526-A036-4893-BD50-788E269CAD4C}

taylor

[HDBRbuilder]

Heresys have short throw woofers. PWK would have ported them if the woofer was a good one for that use. The sealed cabinet optimizes that woofer so that it doesn't slam itself to death. In the sealed cabinet that short throw woofer is actually able to produce tighter, but not lower bass....IOW bass to match (within its limited range) that of his other Heritage line. PWK would have done it if he thought it was worth it, but he believed that if one wanted deeper bass, one should just move up to Cornwalls, instead. The whole idea was to keep the Heresy price down, while still keeping it voiced close to his other Heritage...NOT to make it more expensive to build, with negligible added benefit at the expense of that voicing! The Heresy was never intended to be a stand-alone speaker, it was conceived as a SUPPLEMENTARY speaker to a K-horn...a low-cost alternative. By the late 1960's, though, PWK saw that it was selling primarily in pairs as stand-alone speakers for the cost-conscious Klipsch lover. So, he changed it up some by extending and strengthening its bass response so that it would make a BETTER stand-alone speaker, without totally compromising its original intent. He did about all that could be done within the price range he wanted to be able sell it. Sometimes we tend to let our enthusiasm for a project outrun our common sense. PWK wasn't that way.

[Malcolm]

FWIW the version of the K-22 used in the Heresy in the mid 60s, the EV SP12b was designed for ported alignment. EV literature of that time stated specifically that it was not designed for a sealed cabinet. All of the Heresy woofers can indeed be considered short throw. They have Xmax of from around 2.5mm (earliest) to about 4.0 mm (latest). But that by itself does not preclude their use in ported designs.

[Kartracer77]

For increasing the cabinet size on the Heresy II, I would think that the results will be very comparable to the Tangent 500 model, They have the same drivers with the tangent having an additional 12in passive.

The tangnet is rated as 35Hz-20kHz±3dB while the Heresy II is rated 63Hz-20kHz±3dB

[ironwoods]

The documentation included with my '86 Herasy II's, states bass output down to 38 Hz. I'm assuming Klipsch used a -6 db response plot. Was this the norm

at that time? Sales tactic? Now, most ratings are at -3 dB, which is the least that our ears are able to detect.

[ttaylor]

Well, I decided to model the K-22-E in various enclosures and see what type of performance I was able to achieve. I realize what niche the Heresy was originally designed to fill, but that doesnt mean that its components cant be modified to fill modern needs.

That said, I modeled the original sealed enclosure, an original enclosure that is ported, and a large, 5.25 cuft ported enclosure (larger than the 4 cuft I

originally tested the K-22 in).

As can be seen by the WinISD graph, the yellow(original) dies at -3db at above

60hz, the green(ported original) gains 2db at 60hz and falls off at -3db at

about 56hz and the blue(5.25cuft ported) goes down to the mid 30s. After seeing

the results I decided to port my Heresy by making a new back panel and adding

a port. I used a 2.125 in. hole in 3/4 ply which created almost the proper port

length. I screwed a piece of ply on the panels that I could swing over the

port hole, so I could do a quick sealed/ported listening.

The change was fairly dramatic. I know power handling is diminished with the porting but I wont be blasting Led Zeppelin until my ears bleed.I did that for several decades and I now listen at MUCH lower volumn. Im using a 20 watt Gainclone amp and have a 10watt class A SS in the works so power handling isnt a concern.

I can now hear bass instruments that were completely missing before. Listen

to Dire Straits "Calling Elvis" without the port and the whole driving bass

line is missing. Open the port and it magically appears. Satrianis' "Flying in a Blue Dream" now has its slow hipnotic bass line as well.

The sound, combined with Johns xo mod (I did a quick and dirty one for now)makes my Heresys sound like more like HiFi and less like Pro boxes.Not earthshaking but more rounded and with a fuller sound.

Im going to tweak the port tuning, properly dampen the cabinet and build nice XOs and call in done. I am also retaining the adjustable port so I can seal the cabinet if needed for

higher power handling. They will one day be rear channels for my La Scalas but for now, they are in my home office and doing duty as my main listening speakers while we remodel our house. This is a pretty easy tweak and reversable.

taylor

[HDBRbuilder]

OH...OK...I get it NOW...it isn't a Heresy YOU WANT...it is a speaker that uses Heresy parts. Well...have at it...but if you intend to design a new speaker, why not just get the absolute best components ever made to do it with to begin with? Then you don't have ot settle for just the stuff PWK used for a Heresy. You might want to retain the mid horn and its driver, but you can probably find a better tweeter and woofer to do this with.

[ttaylor]

Now you see where Im headed. JBL or TAD drivers would be great but I cant justify that kind of expenditure. My view is that older Klipsch Heritage stuff, Heresys, CWs, LSs etc, represent about the best value in speakers period.I bought my Heresys for $100 with blown tweeters and water damaged cabinets(plant stands!) I fixed the tweeters for $50 and now have a pair of $150 speakers that cant be touched by and under a $1000.That horn clarity has become addictive. And the Klipschs are built like old cars- Big, heavy parts,lots of screws and very simplistic. This makes them perfect for "hot rodding" and restoration. So Im going to wring every last penny of value out of them and Im sure,they will provide years of pleasure.

taylor