paulaelliott Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 Because of their discontinuance, there are some incredible buys now on the Legend series....Specifically, I'm considering upgrading from my SB-3s to either the KLF-10 or the RF-3....I'm having a hard time making the choice though..Pricewise, theyre available now for similar dollars...So, it comes down to merrit....For mostly classical orchestral music, but with some rock, which do you think is the 'Better Speaker'? They will be driven by my 150 wpc amp. The room is 12 X 24 X 8. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Blorry Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 I'd go for the Legend series, but then I'm biased. Please don't tell me how cheap the KLF-10s are being offered, but are these folks also offering reduced prices on KLF-20s or 30s as well? Both these models have a three-way setup, and I think they handle upper midrange and highs better than the KLF-10s, which only has a two-way setup. I think classical would definitely sound better with either the 20s or the 30s. See if you can audition all of them and decide for yourself! My friendly K dealer here still has Legends as well as Reference series on the showroom floor, and comparisons are easy. Bring along your favorite tunes and ask the K-Person to play them through every Klipsch model they have! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 you 1st paula, which do YOU think sounds better? ------------------ Klipsch KLF 30 (front), KLF C7, Cornwall I (rear) Velodyne HGS-18 sub woofer Monsterbass 400 sub interconnect & Monster CX-2 biwire & Z1 cable Marantz SR-8000 receiver Sony DVP-C650D 5-disk cd/dvd player Sony Trinitron 27" stereo tv Toshiba hi-fi stereo vcr Technics dual cassette deck Scientific Atlanta Explorer 2000 digital cable box Boa's Listenin Lounge: Klipsch RF-3 (front), RC-3, cheap little Technics (rear) Monster MCX Biwires Sony STR-DE935 a/v receiver Kenwood KR-9600 AM/FM stereo receiver (vintage 1975) Russound AB-2 receiver switch to RF-3 Teac PD-D1200 5-disk cd changer Technics SL-1950 turntable/AT LS500 cartridge rock on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulaelliott Posted July 30, 2001 Author Share Posted July 30, 2001 Well, truth is, I havent heard the KLF line yet! I have heard the RF-3 and like it alot...Only problem is, its the KLF line which is selling now from legit retailers at, hold onto your hat, %45 off! This with a 30 day no questions asked warranty if you dont like them, so I have a hard time not going ahead with it...At $600 for the pair, this is probably a one time opportunity which doesnt come along every day..In answer to Blorry's question, they DO have the KLF-30 also, for $1000 for the pair, also a great price...But $600 is more my liking..Also, I think the 30s would be a little strong for my room and my 150 wpc amp..It would probably work but its alittle intimidating...Dont forget, I'm coming from SB-3s! So, the KLF-10 for $600....I've seen the RF-3 pair going for $539 at the cheapest from an internet source...Certainly, there would be no 30 day return/refund warranty on that....But can anyone say definitively whether the RF-3 or the KLF-10 sounds better, fuller, better stage, more detailed, etc, with Orchestral music? You might say that since I can return them, what's to lose? But the fact is, I live in a 1 bedroom condo hi rise apt, and room is at a premium...Its not all that easy to be flipping around 100 lb boxes of speakers, if you know what I mean. Thanks for helping me decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 paula, which amp u using? know it ain't easy, nor does the $ come easy ala ringo, but it's necessary. see if they'll let u get both pair home one way (free trial) or the other (float the pair u return on the credit card) to a-b them w/ your room & stuff. at the very least a-b them at the dealer. wouldn't want your ears biased by opinion would u? & i can feel the opinion about to explode with your inquiry the general consensus though seems that rf-3 are accurate, detailed, refined. klf are brighter, wilder & raw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbobo Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 I would try to bring them both home at the same time and test them out, the KLFs need a good amp to sound balanced. If looks are important I think the KLFs look better with the real-wood-venneer. I auditioned both and liked the KLFs better, I would think for you, since you listen to classical the KLFs would sound alot better, they sound alot more dynamic IMO. Either will be much better then the SB3s though. After I bought the 10's I went and auditioned the 20's. To me the 10's sound weaker in the mids, while I found the 20's too forward in the mids. IMO ------------------ My bedroom system: YAMAHA CDC-575 CAL GAMMA D/A converter MONSTER IL400MkII ADCOM GTP-400 preamp ADCOM GFA-545 mK II amp TOSHIBA CZ27V51 27" TV TOSHIBA SD2109 YAMAHA RX-V596 for surround KLIPSCH KSW 10 POLK R10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbobo Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 Oh, forgot to mention I paid $550 pair for the 10s in April. ------------------ My bedroom system: YAMAHA CDC-575 CAL GAMMA D/A converter MONSTER IL400MkII ADCOM GTP-400 preamp ADCOM GFA-545 mK II amp KLF 10 TOSHIBA CZ27V51 27" TV TOSHIBA SD2109 YAMAHA RX-V596 for surround KLIPSCH KSW 10 POLK R10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 Get a pair of Bose 301's.They sound great! Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oogins Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 quote: Originally posted by talktoKeith: Get a pair of Bose 301's.They sound great! BLAH! You should be shot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Blorry Posted July 31, 2001 Share Posted July 31, 2001 Keith's got the right idea! Be another HornEd, but instead, be a BoseEd! Get about fifty Bose 301s, dot them all around the room, then sit back an relish in the luxurious Bose direct reflecting..uh..sound! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulaelliott Posted July 31, 2001 Author Share Posted July 31, 2001 Thank you all (except those recommending the Bose!)...I made up my mind, and went ahead and ordered the RF-3....I decided that for classical, where the mids are so important, the KLF-10 would have suffered...The KLF-20 might have been an option, but I was a little intimidated by their size..dont forget, I'm coming from SB-3s! And the RF-3, from all I've read, sound like the perfect speaker for me....Excellent mids, great bass, wonderful stage, etc, etc...Also, I think they'll be easier to integrate with my SC-1 and SS-1 until I decide to replace them with reference. BTW, now seems to be a great time to order Klipsch on line...The cheapest I saw mine going for was $525, $529, $539.....But, all of those were sold out...So I went for $545, from a respected on line source...I also saw KLF-20s going for $735 for the pair!! So Klipsch certainly seems to be in season at the moment. I cant wait for the RF-3s to get here. This leaves me with a pair of SB-3s to sell..I also have good 21" Sanus stands with spikes and cones....I'll throw the stands in for anybody who wants the SB-3s, which are 6 mos old...I paid a full $450 from the Wiz...and I'll sell them for $300 with the stands. Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted July 31, 2001 Share Posted July 31, 2001 paula, Just wondering how,when you auditioned the KLF10's,you decided the mids suffered? The KLF10's have really good mids,in fact the last time I personally listened to 10's I was surprised by the midrange balance of the KLF10's.As a matter of fact my opinion is that the KLF10's possessed a more balanced sound than did KLF30's.This is just my opinion of course and everyone has one.Listen and decide for yourself. Also, Klipsch is always "in season". Re-read your posts of several weeks ago and you'll find my original recommendation. Hope you enjoy em,whatever you decide to get! Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulaelliott Posted July 31, 2001 Author Share Posted July 31, 2001 Keith, I remember well your initial suggestion: UPgrade the speakers! I even remember what you suggested: RB-5. Well, I think youre right! Not about the RB-5, but about getting more powerful speakers than the SB-3..Which by the way I still really like...But I think everybody knows that its unlikely that one's first forray into HT or Audio will be their last...YOu never know going into it what you will several months later...The SB-3s were for me a great way to get into it. But now, I wanted more....And it was a very tough choice between the RF-3 and the KLF-10...It was mostly via the reviews Ive read on line which told me that the KLF 10s were weaker in the mid areas, which is crucial for Classical, than were the RF-3s. Hey, frankly, I have no idea whether this is true or not....I didnt audition the KLFs, just the RF-3s, which sounded incredible to me....Online conscensus bares this out. Whether or not they'll prove better than the Legacys I dont know...Only that I'm pretty sure that they're damn good, and that's good enough for me...Besides, I read in alot of places that if youre getting Legacy, you should get the 20s, not the 10s....But now, youre getting into BIG speakers...Too big for me...And, the REference is the 'new' line, the Legs are discontinued, etc, etc....Does any of this mean I'm making the decision I'll still be happy about 6 mos from now? Hell if I know...But, that's what the hobby's about...Actually, fixation's probably a better word than hobby....Its an obsession..One I'm going to have to slow down some after I these speakers arrive before I hit the poor house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted July 31, 2001 Share Posted July 31, 2001 Mr. Blorry... if you are suggesting that HornEd is related to "BloseEd" I'm going to have to call in the Mystery Guest Hostility Patrol to cool down before I can reply! I've been pretty small a time or two in my replies... but I try to stop short of being a Bozo! Harrumph ... a standing wave to you, Mr. Blorry. Bose sound is so squished it produces "squatting" waves! HornEd PS: Curiously, in my pre-stereo days, I built a "sweet sixteen" speaker which took advantage of the multiplier effect of small speakers to gain a big sound. This message has been edited by HornEd on 07-31-2001 at 01:02 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulaelliott Posted July 31, 2001 Author Share Posted July 31, 2001 Hey Horned and Blorry, Mind not stepping all over my thread with this irrelevant drivel? Start your own if you have to, but its not nice to take well meaning threads off in directions that have no relevance but to the poster adding on....Stay on topic...its good form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted July 31, 2001 Share Posted July 31, 2001 Sorry to have offended you Paul or Paula, as the case might be (I have seen both used and prefer to be correct given the standard you have now set). The fact that several people have mentioned Bose in this thread, including yourself, had me confused as to its depth. I thought that Mr. Blorry's aside, by his mention of my rig, thereby connoted that multiple Legends, such as the KLF 10, were a preferable route. In my reply, aside from the apparently tasteless humor, there was a reference to the "sweet sixteen" concept. This, when applied to your potential for multiple KLF 10's would create a far better sound than one might suspect even though you are using the bottom of the line KLF Legend series. I too have long been a concert season ticket holder and classical music is a large part of my personal library. That leads me to suggest that the mid-range of the KLF 20's and 30's is preferable to the KLF 10. For awhile, I used KLF 30 mains and three KLF 10's for the rear of a 6.1 system... with a Klipsch subwoofer under each one (except, of course, the KLF C7 center). Hopefully, I am better known for my lengthy, insightful and helpful posts rather than only the "irrelevant drivel" you were able to see. As you can see below, I like Legends (not Legacy) and, like them, I too may be obsolete. Peace be with you HornEd ------------------ "Where Legends Live! Klipsch Powered HT" FOREGROUND SOUND STAGE: KLF 30 Center, KLF 30 Mains, KLF 10 Front Effects BACKGROUND SOUND STAGE: KLF 30 L&R Side/Surrounds, KLF 30 Rear Effects LARGE MOUTH BASS: Twin SVS CS-Ultra sub with Samson Megawatt Amp SPEAKER SUPPORT SYSTEMS: Mitsubishi RPHD1080i 65", Yamaha RX-V3000 Receiver and such... Tweakin' On! 2-Channel Music Respite Room ala Cornwall under construction... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulaelliott Posted July 31, 2001 Author Share Posted July 31, 2001 HornED, All is forgiven...There are few enough of us classical music buffs that we must stick together at all costs! First, the name is Paul...I post under two names...at work I use my login name which is paul a elliott...At home, I use Paul E, but they're both me... You have quite an eviable system, with KLF 30s for seemingly Everything! Must have a big room....Im in a hi rise condo apt, with a 12 X 24 X 8 living room. I have my front speakers about 8-9 ft apart, on either side of an ent. center holding my 32" Hitachi TV and my electronics. And, I sit about 7 ' from the tv putting me about 8' from each speaker, which is the way I'm supposed to be situated in the 'sweet spot'...But I tell you, KLF anythings would I think just overpower the room...I'm using a Sony STR-V333ES receiver acting as preamp, equalizer, and DSP driving a 150 w/c Audiosource Amp3 which is connected to the Klipschs. I finally ordered the RF-3s....I believe their midrange, so crucial for classical, is better than the KLF-10, which you confirmed...Ideally, the KLF-20 would have found their way into my room, but, again, too big for the environment....Or maybe, just too big for me...Anyway, I think the RF-3s will do well, and they should arrive tomorrow....How's your Mahler collection? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted July 31, 2001 Share Posted July 31, 2001 Whew, thanks for the relief, Paul... I looked for your Gustav accolades on http://www.visi.com/~mick/shrine.html but that particular Mahler attendant is known for upbeat devotion not tempo. I would agree, given your constraints, that the RF3 is the better choice... but, on reading T-T-K's post below I am reminded that I, too, found that the old Reference line came up a bit short... and so I have amended this reply. Sure, my Cornwalls are a bit large but they sure bring out the delicate beauty of classically structured music... and I picked them up in great condition for only $520. In Mr. Blorry's defense, I am rather well known on this board for experimenting with multiple large speakers and for having one of the first handmade Twin SVS Ultra subwoofers that meet the tough Dolby reference level standards for setting speakers to SMALL and relying on the subs to handle the sub 20Hz to 90Hz range. It does wonders for Mahler! The Legends system is primarily for HT and was designed to stimulate the neural pathways my dementia plagued 93 year-old mother... but it does a competent job on classical orchestral pieces... and is absolutely stunning on sub-20Hz organ notes. For most of my classical enjoyment, I take respite in my two-channel Cornwall system. On that note, I thought you might like an introduction to C. C. Poon's delightful http://www.monarchyaudio.com/home.htm which provides the best classical amp gear for the buck that I have yet to encounter. Well, if you will excuse me, I need to spend some time on a daily Elizabethan news tabloid that I am creating for the run of a Renaissance Faire... and thoughts of "modernists" like Mahler are out of period! HornEd This message has been edited by HornEd on 07-31-2001 at 05:11 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted July 31, 2001 Share Posted July 31, 2001 paul, listen.That is EXACTLY what everyone here is trying to do.HELP YOU! You laid out the parameters in your original post: classical music/you HAD bookshelf speakers/333ES receiver. My thinking was that the RB5's would sound better with classical music than Legends(MO),the RB's are high quality speakers,and they are efficient enough that the Sony would drive them to ear bleed levels.You would have had those speakers(RB5's)upon which to build your HT system. I'll give you the best advise that I can give you for free.Spend lots of time LISTENING to loudspeakers.Decide what sound YOU like and buy the highest quality speakers you can afford.You will be building the remainder of your system upon this first purchase.If you can't afford the speakers you like,wait until you can afford them and then buy em.I personally hate paying for something I don't enjoy(dentist).Buy speakers that are timbre matched,and buy them from an authorized dealer.Everyone here will help you find the deals. I personally like the Legend sound much better than the older Reference but hey,that don't mean shiite!Listen for yourself.And good luck to you.I had a big smile on my face as I typed this ,so there is no hostility intended. Keith OK.Thought about it a minute.New recommendation(considering given info): pair of RB-3's or RF-3's,RC-3,pair of RS-3's,and a pair of SVS subs(TV will help fine tune your needs/room).Get on U-Bid and get an Acurus 125X5 amp.It has goobs of power and the 2/3 configuration will give you 200 WPC when listening to 2 channel stereo(classical).Good luck. This message has been edited by talktoKeith on 07-31-2001 at 04:50 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USparc Posted July 31, 2001 Share Posted July 31, 2001 Hey paulaelliott, Good choice with those RF-3's. I'm probably to late but I have still some questions about the STR-V333ES. Did you audition those RF-3's with an alike sony receiver?? I had for a short time(very short) the STR-DB930. It is a good receiver, but with the klipsch RF-3's and probably other klipschers the volume control was to sensitive. It was even so sensitive that I wasn't able to get the right volume. Moreover the lowest volume with this receiver was still to loud for background music. It was even the case that one RF-3 was still playing and the other was death. Yep, those RF-3's reveal everything. Don't think I'm not playing loud, I do (115dB). But there are times ... for background music. Let me know how it turns out. Boa12, you have a sony receiver(I just noticed)driving those RF-3's. No problems or probably no background music in Boa's Listenin Lounge? ------------------ ------------------------- Receiver: Onkyo 676 DVD: Pioneer DV-525 Screen: Thomson 46" RetroProjection Front: RF-3's Rear: RF-3's Center: RC-3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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