powdermnky007 Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 http://www.audioadvisor.com/store/productdetail.asp?sku=AQSORS&product_name=Sorbothane%20Tile%20Sheet Wherever an isolation foot doesn't make sense - such as to dampen the top plate of components from vibrations - choose one of these tacky adhesive-backed energy absorbing sheets. Easy to install! What do you guys think? Good or Gimmick? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 I use this: http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=268-010 I damp the inside top, sides and everywhere there is a good spot. It is good for speaker damping too. And, for $19.95 you can get about 14 sheets! Not that I'm cheap or anything like that. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powdermnky007 Posted October 12, 2004 Author Share Posted October 12, 2004 Did you get improved sound quality or better imaging? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Are you experiencing vibrations on the top plate of your CD player? Really, if you don't hear anything audible, then there is nothing to worry about. Also, I wouldn't spend that kind of money when any kind of alternative material could be used, like a big rock. Ok, so a big rock is ugly, but there is an unlimited source of heavy objects that could be placed on the top of your CD player to reduce any vibrations, if indeed they do exist and are audible. (Perhaps take another component off the shelf above and let it rest on top?) Before you invest in anything as silly and minute as this, I would first get the acoustics correct in your listening room. Something like this costs $300, but every $20 of it would be a much better investment: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=rec/g=rec/search/bigpid/base_id/57869 There are also plenty of other lower cost options and alternative methods available as well (some better looking than others). I just posted this as it would be a great kit to get started with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powdermnky007 Posted October 12, 2004 Author Share Posted October 12, 2004 Room treatment is my next adventure. I just bought the decware modded sony sacd player. SHould be coming in this week. Just bought a house too. In a few months, once my money settles down, I'm planning on doing some room treatment. This is my first house and the stereo will be in the living room. So I'm not too sure how crazy I can go with the panels I will get something up. Gotta get a fridge and stuff first! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 There is an unmistakable reduction in jitter when the case of a light CD player is damped. I have done four of them so far. IOt stops the panels from radiating vibrations and adds additional mass. Here is some of the internal damping as well as the replaced PS cap. As you can see all the assessable panels have some damping as well as the non-moving parts of the transport. Some care is necessary on the transport as it is fragile plastic. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Here is the damped cover on my Phillips. There is also a sheet on the bottom. Take care not to block any cooling holes/fins. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 What's the technical reason that damping the cd player case causes a reduction in jitter? It doesn't make any sense to me because a cd player is just like a harddrive and has error correction and everything. Once the data has been read, it is stored in a memory buffer which just acts like RAM. It is then run through the DAC which is an entirely electrical process. I just don't understand how reducing vibrations would make a difference...If it did, then the sound quality on your walkman should change when you shake it a lot (even though it's not skipping). I just did a crude test and I can't tell any difference at all. Also, it would make sense to dampen the harddrives on your computer as well (which nobody does). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audio Flynn Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Constrained layer damping and a layer of anti static foam applied to the inside is cheaper than the Sorthobane. And also on all the standing cans put a rubber O Ring. Shield the DACs with Lead tape. A $ 45 package from www.virmode.com and instructions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I used some left over dynamat to damp the inside of the case of my AH!, looks similar to 3DZapper's pics. Also some on the bottom. Didn't hear any difference in the sound, but it gave the unit a surprising feel of heft. Made the stock unit seem cheap in it's construction by comparison. Well, it is after all a fairly light Marantz unit modded for tubes. My take on the damping is the same as with tube dampers... that unless the fix corrects an audible problem, hearing a difference is unlikely. To my ears, anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I used some left over dynamat to damp the inside of the case of my AH!, looks similar to 3DZapper's pics. Also some on the bottom. Didn't hear any difference in the sound, but it gave the unit a surprising feel of heft. Made the stock unit seem cheap in it's construction by comparison. Well, it is after all a fairly light Marantz unit modded for tubes. My take on the damping is the same as with tube dampers... that unless the fix corrects an audible problem, hearing a difference is unlikely. To my ears, anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I used some left over dynamat to damp the inside of the case of my AH!, looks similar to 3DZapper's pics. Also some on the bottom. Didn't hear any difference in the sound, but it gave the unit a surprising feel of heft. Made the stock unit seem cheap in it's construction by comparison. Well, it is after all a fairly light Marantz unit modded for tubes. My take on the damping is the same as with tube dampers... that unless the fix corrects an audible problem, hearing a difference is unlikely. To my ears, anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Deja vu? Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 ---------------- On 10/12/2004 8:41:43 PM 3dzapper wrote: Deja vu? Rick ---------------- All over again. Just now looked at this thread again. I promise I only clicked once to submit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 ---------------- On 10/12/2004 5:38:46 PM DrWho wrote: What's the technical reason that damping the cd player case causes a reduction in jitter? It doesn't make any sense to me because a cd player is just like a harddrive and has error correction and everything. Once the data has been read, it is stored in a memory buffer which just acts like RAM. It is then run through the DAC which is an entirely electrical process. I just don't understand how reducing vibrations would make a difference...If it did, then the sound quality on your walkman should change when you shake it a lot (even though it's not skipping). I just did a crude test and I can't tell any difference at all. Also, it would make sense to dampen the harddrives on your computer as well (which nobody does). ---------------- Eliminate or reduce mechanical vibration thus reducing the need for as much error correction thus reducing the the manipulation of the "original" signal preserving it's integrity as much as possible. Depending on your system and set up what you can "hear" will vary, but the benefits are real and measurable. As another poster mentioned, lead tape is EXCELLENT on digital devices, especially inexpensive DVD players. I have treated several inexpensive models with the lead jacket and the results were supurb! Most notably in the AUDIO output. My two cents worth. As always, Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 ---------------- On 10/14/2004 4:44:45 PM analogman wrote: Eliminate or reduce mechanical vibration thus reducing the need for as much error correction thus reducing the the manipulation of the "original" signal preserving it's integrity as much as possible. Depending on your system and set up what you can "hear" will vary, but the benefits are real and measurable. As another poster mentioned, lead tape is EXCELLENT on digital devices, especially inexpensive DVD players. I have treated several inexpensive models with the lead jacket and the results were supurb! Most notably in the AUDIO output. My two cents worth. As always, Analogman ---------------- Well I can understand the use of lead tape as that acts as a shielding device which reduces the amount of EMF. EMF is a very audible distortion and the science is very straightforward. As far as reducing mechanical vibrations to minimize the amount of error correction needed...I think it needs to be noted that error correction ONLY uses a checksum method to make sure all the bits were read correctly. There is no manipulation of the data occuring at all and it's a very standard and simple system stored into the way the data is put on the disc. I think many people forget that the data on the CD is not even in a consecutive order. Every sample on a CD has 16 bits to it, aka a total of 16 1's and 0's. But the way data is stored on a CD, all 16 of those bits are stored in a packet which has a specific layout as to the order of the bits. If I had my old textbook with me, I could recreate the image of what it looks like. As the data gets read off the CD, the data gets put into a buffer and then a checksum is run to make sure the data is correct. If it's wrong, the CD player will reread the packet that was read wrong and it will continue to reread it until the checksum suceeds. Since we're able to read the data faster than it gets spit out, we can use a large buffer which will allow you a certain amount of time that you could be reading nothing at all. This is how the "shock protection" on portable CD players work. You'll notice that if you turn the shock thing off, that your disc will turn slower (which results in a longer battery life). Once the data gets into the buffer, it then gets pulled out when the cd player wants it (just like the RAM on your pc...data from the harddrive gets put into the RAM where it can be accessed quickly). RAM is a purely electrical storage system (aka, no mechanical parts involved). Once out of the buffer, the data then gets sent into the DAC where the data is processed and then turned back into an anagolous stream of voltages that should hopefully correspond to the orignal signal that was recorded. I don't see how shaking a wire would change the electrical flow...now if the wire were in a magenetic field, that's another story. I don't think the magnetic fields present in a cd player are strong enough to cause an audible difference considering the small distances things will be moving. Or I may be totally wrong, but if that was the case, then it'd make sense to make all our interconnects free from vibration as well as the amps and everything else with electricity running through it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben. Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 Isn't EMF a wanker band from the early 90's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben. Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 So tubes (purely electrical devices) vibrating like a 15 year-old's cell phone an hour before the prom wouldn't sound any different than tubes that are isolated from such distrubance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 Good point, bclarke, Vibration is CD playbacks #1 enemy, period. CD players ALL have "clocks" aka "timing crystals". Can you say PIEZOELECTRIC MECHANICAL VIBRATION? If you believe a device or circuit is completely defined by its schematic, then all CD players should sound the same, right? I do not think so, in fact I know so. And I also know for a fact that those players operated with as little extraneous vibration as is possible sound better regardless of price point, all things being equal. And yes, they were a Wanker band from the 90's As always, Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben. Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 A CD player's number two enemy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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