LarryC Posted April 7, 2005 Share Posted April 7, 2005 Mark, that may vary, plus there are wattage limitations at least on the PS Audio units. The 300 in P300 means it's limited to producing 300 watts. I initially tried my preamp (50 watts) and tuner (less than that), didn't hear enough difference to be worth while, so I ended up powering only my CD player, TT, and cassette deck. I didn't try it on my amp monoblocs because each unit uses 500-watts, well over the 300's limit. I recall seeing claims that electronics like preamps would sound better if the Hz were upped to 80 or 90. However, it has to stay at 60 Hz for motors. One should note that PS Audio power regeneration will consume in the vicinity of twice as much power as produced (it will also add heat to the room!). For example, since my CD player uses 85 watts, probably at least 150 watts are drawn from the mains for that alone. My P300 also has low-level cooling-fan noise which fortunately is not located in my listening room. Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted April 7, 2005 Share Posted April 7, 2005 Max, I personally don't see any issues with a dealer borrowing me a piece of eqiuipment to try out. He obviouly knew something about you and your setup. It's up to you to discover the benifit of the Clearaudio product or in this case that your analog setup would benefit from speed stability. If it's worth the price to step up, it's up to you. What turntable are you trying the Clearaudio product on? The VPI SDS does the same thing as the Clearaudio and is sold for the same purpose. The SDS also can adjust the Hz in tenth of a Hz steps, up or down. You can really dial in a speed this way, so regardless of stylus drag, plattter weight , belt material and friction, ring clamps, matts, etc. You can always dial the proper speed becasue you can adjust it in 1/10th of a Hz steps. I myself would not consider a power regulatr that did not offer that ability. Also some LPs are produced at the wrong speed, Kind of Blue comes to mind, with the SDS or Clearaudio you have the ability to dial in the proper speed for that particular album. ( by ear I guess or comparing to CD/SACD done at the proper speed). Additionally the SDS can keep track of Cartridge/stylus life if you choose to do so. I didn't experience the "veiled" lifting as much as you did. For me, it was a improvement in timbre, natural sounding attack and decay of instruments, and a general sence that instuments sounded "right." Piano for one sounded so much better with the SDS. No Disc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott0527 Posted April 7, 2005 Share Posted April 7, 2005 I'm amazed that for 5 grand(or whatever you paid), the turntable isn't already capable of holding an accurate speed. Yet a lot of the manufacturers do this. Linn has the Lingo, VPI has the SPS. Everybody says they make a big difference. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me but I won't bad mouth it until I get my hands on a Lingo or an Armegeddon for my Linn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonfyr Posted April 7, 2005 Share Posted April 7, 2005 You have piqued my interest... Is there any reasonable way to open that puppy up and to take pictures or draw the schematic? I would of course never dream of doing such a thing, but a clever person could conceivably recreate the control circuitry.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted April 7, 2005 Share Posted April 7, 2005 Max, Do you remember me asking you some time ago if you ordered this little device? You thought it was only beneficial if using the flywheel and multiple motors. Your dealer is a clever chap, knowing all along once you've used it, you would purchase one. Up to this point I have not been able to drop the money on VPI's newest version of thier SDS controller, but I do have their older version, the P.L.C.(Power Line Conditioner). And yes, even their older version provides an improvement with respect to cleaner attack, better focus, and openness. What does it do? It's job is to provide frequency stability, and clean power. The limittation on it's use is that any piece of equipment plugged into mine at least, must not draw more than 20 watts. Accordingly, the P.L.C.'s is supposed to provide a highly stable pure wave as opposed to the most often unstable line frequency you get from the wall outlet. Other devices filter spikes, surges, and R.F. noise. The P.L.C., VPI SDS, or Clearaudio Syncro provides a pure and stable line frequency. In addition, for turntable use, the tt must use an A.C Synchronous or induction motor that does not have any intervening frequency control electronics on it own. If on a budget, as I always am, you can download and print your own calibration disc from many internet sites, when combined with a florescent or neon light, can provide an on the cheap calibration tool. Certainly not a good as a dedicated strobe light, but it will get you there. For those interested in a DIY strobe, I have VPI's instructions that I can post, when I have the time, if there is sufficient interest. And to address Scott0527, there are always tradeoffs when producing electronic products. There are manufaturers who once chose the direct drive approach to speed stability, and you should already know the negatives of that. Teres for example, uses a motor with strobe device to control speed, but it is a DC motor and does not deal with the unstable line frequency that the motor sees, but an option I once considered to replace my Scout motor. I feel the approach I took, patiently waiting for a VPI P.L.C. to appear for sale, and later upgrading my Scout motor, and has provided the benefits I hoped for. Admit it Max, you're going to get the Synchro. Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted April 7, 2005 Share Posted April 7, 2005 When you think about it, there is nothing wrong with the turntable itself, it is the lack of a steady current of power that is robbing max of his sound, not the table. The table is perfectly capable of holding accurate speed provided a steady current is used. Some people purchase the SDS and find out that it does little to help their sound, most likely because they already have some other type of power conditioner or line stabilizer. Sometimes they are just lucky and they have relatively stable power. Why include a device that will drive the cost up and only help some of the people. For what it's worth, before I got the SDS, I did most of my listening late at night because there was less people using AC (air conditioners, lights off, etc.) and that provided cleaner sound. The SDS eliminates the problems associated with non-stable power from those type of power fluctuations. Just a thought. No Disc ---------------- On 4/7/2005 12:56:32 PM scott0527 wrote: I'm amazed that for 5 grand(or whatever you paid), the turntable isn't already capable of holding an accurate speed. Yet a lot of the manufacturers do this. Linn has the Lingo, VPI has the SPS. Everybody says they make a big difference. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me but I won't bad mouth it until I get my hands on a Lingo or an Armegeddon for my Linn. ---------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted April 8, 2005 Author Share Posted April 8, 2005 Scott is right - for the money I paid (rather in XS of 5 grand but lets not go there) this thing should have been built in - and the ring should have been included too for that matter. Should have been - but wasn't - what can you do? Yes - ultimately I am going to buy this damn thing - my question was more one of - where am I going to find the money without SWMBO noticing? $1000 is not an easy figure to hide in this household's budget! Too many toys - not enough money! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted April 8, 2005 Share Posted April 8, 2005 Max, I didn't realize which TT you purchased or how much. Yeah, for 5 grand you would of got an SDS with a VPI Superscout master. Clearaudio makes good stuff, but pricey. I do love my Virtuoso Wood Cart though. On the other topic, not sure If I can help you there... Oh, I know, I know, try this on the wife... Antonis, your loan shark, is going to break your legs if you don't pay up the money he borrowed you for your gambling problem. I't's a sordid situation really, but how are you going to work and support your family without your legs... Oh well, it's a thought... No Disc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai2000 Posted April 8, 2005 Share Posted April 8, 2005 . Sorry, couldn't resist. Wolfram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted April 8, 2005 Share Posted April 8, 2005 ---------------- On 4/8/2005 2:03:44 AM maxg wrote: Scott is right - for the money I paid (rather in XS of 5 grand but lets not go there) this thing should have been built in - and the ring should have been included too for that matter. Should have been - but wasn't - what can you do? Yes - ultimately I am going to buy this damn thing - my question was more one of - where am I going to find the money without SWMBO noticing? $1000 is not an easy figure to hide in this household's budget! Too many toys - not enough money! ---------------- Max, Since it's all your dealers fault for loaning you the Syncro in the first place, tell him you'll buy it on the time honored "installment program" of maybe $100 a month or something like that. Whatever you can fudge out of the budget per month. He's much better off having someone using it in their system and saying good things about it, instead of leaving it sitting on the shelf. Very cheap marketing for him. You get to keep the Synchro. Both parties win. Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted April 8, 2005 Author Share Posted April 8, 2005 "Since it's all your dealers fault for loaning you the Syncro in the first place, tell him you'll buy it on the time honored "installment program" of maybe $100 a month or something like that. Whatever you can fudge out of the budget per month. He's much better off having someone using it in their system and saying good things about it, instead of leaving it sitting on the shelf. Very cheap marketing for him. You get to keep the Synchro. Both parties win." I am working on it - or a variation thereof.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted April 8, 2005 Share Posted April 8, 2005 I like the "Dollar down and the chase is on" plan myself. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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