Poll: MONO TUBE AMPS IN HTS (Obsurd Idea, or Yea, That's The Ticket)

[Born2RockU]

I can't see why it wouldn't be great.

I believe "Born to Rock You" is doing it with MC30's and VDR's.

Steve

Actually, yes, I did have that setup..but I ONLY using my VRD's for the Mains, now. I have the Peach so, yes, I can use the "HT switch" to use the VRDs w/ the HTS.

I just recently sold the MC'30's because I am satisfied w/ 30 TRIPATH watts per surround-channel using my extra Teac 700's. Using the MC30's were incredible, but I needed to pay for those "bad-***" VRD's and had to say bye-bye, for economic reasons.

THose $80 TEAC amps are PERFECT for surround sides and rears. But NOTHING , in my opinion, matches NOSValves VRD's. NOTHING !

I still have my Baldwin 6L6 Tube for the center channel. I want a single VRD for the center.

Would anyone like to buy a single VRD for $945?

~ EMAIL ME ! ~

(I have the connection on a pair for $1890 shipped to me and only need one of the pair.)

[Born2RockU]

Hey I'm all for all tube power amps in HTS. Who's going to order the first 5 VRD's []

I personally have completely dismantled my HT system it was fun for a while but IMHO unless watching a special effects action movie for its a complete bore. I guess some people are just into the thrill factor more then I am.

Craig

Craig,

Now don't get me started. You know we have had that serious discussion ! []

[Born2RockU]

First off two-channel listening is passe' it is very uninvolving and not even near as lifelike as a multi-channel environment. Ever been to a concert or live event with just two speakers or a two channel system?

I am not talking about SACD, HDCD or DVD-A I am talking just a matrixed 7 channel stereo setup with subwoofers. I can randomly switch back and forth from two to seven channel and there is just no comparison from a realism perspective.

My goal was to head in the direction that Gilbert is pondering but the differences between the tubes and high quality SS in my system were negligible and the maintenance and cost of tube rolling, etc., etc make going all tubes not really an economical and viable option. Although I have no doubt in my mind that it would sound fantastic

I also learned buying vintage amps and then have dump even more cash into them to make them sound right is a waste. If I try tubes again I am going for brand new, and that means VRD's from Craig. (What is the wait time these days? Does Smilin still have his for sale?) I have already sold the MC-30's to Joe for his collection because I was not willing to invest any further. With what I originally paid, plus what it would have cost to get them to wherever the supposedly needed to be was already putting me in VRD country so that is the direction that I will go. A brand new amp with brand new parts and more power. I will indeed miss the MC-30's they are super sexy and look gorgeous lit up and working, they sound fabulous! There just not enough of a difference to justify me keeping them.

I don't have a dedicated spot for a two channel system so I want to integrate and have the best of both worlds. I now see that my DBX BX1's can run with the best that is out there tube or SS and ad NOTHING to the sound which is and should be every amplifier's goal.

I for one think it is certainly an idea worth trying, you old farts can sit in a closet with your near field two channel systems and enjoy yourselves since you are so close minded and not open to new ideas and system layouts. If you think I cannot playback with the best of them in two channel mode you are sadly mistaken I just prefer not to listen that way. I ran two channel setups up until about 1999 from the early 70's and I am not going back in time.

This entire posts sounds to me like someone that has never had a 2 channel system that portrays music at its best.

My first thought to this statement "Ever been to a concert or live event with just two speakers or a two channel system?" was when have you ever been to a live event that had surround sound? Every event I have ever attended had a large stack of speakers either hanging or standing up on the right and left of the stage. I've never witnessed speakers spread all over the concert hall or to my knowledge do they use some matrixed multi channel processing.

Craig

Craig,

Actually, I have been to two Surround Shows.

** Emerson Lake and Palmer, and then RUSH. **

It was special !

Neil Pearts (Rush ) drums were mixed in surround and it was scary...

especially being in the 17th row...dead centered.

I was definitely in the sweet spot.

It was an experience I will NEVER forget.

Thanx for askin'.

[Gilbert]

Yes, I saw RUSH in Houston, back in the early 80's. They opened up for the Stones (Tattoo You). Yes, RUSH did play a single song using a surround set up, combined with a light and video show, it was Red Barccheta, but that was it, the bulk of the concert was the Left and Right side speaker systmes.

We may have even seen the same concert.

[Born2RockU]

Yes, I saw RUSH in Houston, back in the early 80's. They opened up for the Stones (Tattoo You). Yes, RUSH did play a single song using a surround set up, combined with a light and video show, it was Red Barccheta, but that was it, the bulk of the concert was the Left and Right side speaker systmes.

We may have even seen the same concert.

Gildbert,

With all due respect to your opinion. I have seen every Rush show in Houston since seeing them in the Houston Music Hall in 1976 ! Never have they toured and backed up the Stones in Houston.

What date was that ?

I will do some research. I have a list of every show they have done in their whole career somewhere in my garaged archives.

If they played w/ the Stones in Houston...I gotta know.

What venue ? (the AstroDome)

[Born2RockU]

I found this...but it was in Canada.

Rush performed at the Toronto Rocks /Stones Concert (2003)

[Born2RockU]

This is the actual original RUSH w/ / John Rutsey on drums...not Neil Peart.

[Strabo]

My first thought to this statement "Ever been to a concert or live event with just two speakers or a two channel system?" was when have you ever been to a live event that had surround sound? Every event I have ever attended had a large stack of speakers either hanging or standing up on the right and left of the stage. I've never witnessed speakers spread all over the concert hall or to my knowledge do they use some matrixed multi channel processing.

Craig

Odds are those large stacks of speakers are playing mono. [^o)]

I mean, I'd be PO'd if I paid good money for a seat on the right side of the stage and not be able to hear the guitarist that was playing on the left side because the one on the right side of the stage was drowning out the left bank of speakers. [8o|]

What I find to be really incongruent is the same people that claim they have to have accuracy also put their music through a digitized algorithm that acts as an on the fly mastering engineer sending different pieces of the music and different tones to different speakers. There is nothing accurate in that, just as there is a lot of accuracy lost in processed recorded music. [:^)]

[Audible Nectar]

I tried posting on this a few days ago, then lost the post. So, I try again[]

It seemed to me to be too much trouble to tweak a half dozen tube amps for use in HT. I thought about this, however. Also, I like the idea of having the HT be the HT, and the 2 channel be a different character system all together. I have my HT tweaked to be a slammin', jammin' setup where impact is king - and a 2 channel rig with much different sound and intentions. The HT offers the consistency and "less worry" factor (due to not wondering about tube rolling), it's a known quantity that I do not seek to tweak.

The two channel setup, OTOH, has been a learning experience and "sonic lab". It was my first foray into tubes, and I have taken slow and deliberate progress on this system. First I used "mostly stock" McIntosh 30's and MX-110, then began a steady, yet "unrushed" progression through the upgrades - which in this case has meant new parts in the 110 and speaker networks - and am now contemplating the fashion of finishing the rebuilds on the MC30's. Taking those steps has been a learning experience and quite a bit of fun - albeit with a few bumps along the way. All in the process of learning, I suppose!

But to do that in an HT environment would drive me nuts - and my wallet into a deep hole. Sweating the matching of the amps, along with obtaining tubes for those six amps just involves too many expensive variables. Given a larger budget, I could imagine having 6 VRD's hooked up to my Cornwalls - but the MC250s do just fine in the HT - the 2 channel setup offers enough of such considerations, as a practical matter.

As for "matrix" music listening, this is VERY processor dependent - most don't cut the mustard for such use. Some (like Lexicon) sound pretty good. Depends on what you like. But I suggest listening to a BB/VRD setup on big Klipsch - this gear has IMAGE.

I do agree with the "2 channel as only system" approach, if done well. If you aren't getting good imaging with your 2 channel setup, try again! I've heard 2 channel systems that make listeners doubt there are only two speakers - a well executed system CAN deliver the goods - and make many forget about HT all together. We considered such a move, but prefer the "two types" of system approaches. We may yet still "combine" them in some fashion, depending on our permanent dwelling, but we like the "two sonic approaches" that our HT and 2 channel vintage system provides.

But using all tubes in HT?? Too much hassle.

[NOSValves]

Odds are those large stacks of speakers are playing mono. [^o)]

I mean, I'd be PO'd if I paid good money for a seat on the right side of the stage and not be able to hear the guitarist that was playing on the left side because the one on the right side of the stage was drowning out the left bank of speakers. [8o|]

What I find to be really incongruent is the same people that claim they have to have accuracy also put their music through a digitized algorithm that acts as an on the fly mastering engineer sending different pieces of the music and different tones to different speakers. There is nothing accurate in that, just as there is a lot of accuracy lost in processed recorded music. [:^)]

No denying that. I never said they were mixed in stereo..... My point was as a norm live events have no surround sound effects.

Craig

[Gilbert]

If they played w/ the Stones in Houston...I gotta know.

What venue ? (the AstroDome)

Geeez Craig, you really go me thinkin now. I don't remeber the location, but think it was the astrodome. Does the astrodome have undergound parking. I seem to remember we parked in an underground parking lot, or maybe it was just parking below the stadium. Anyway, we were so fried after the concert, we couldn't find my Jeep. It took an about an hour or 2. Man, I was in bad shape.

Just before the Stones opened up, some Harley boys were passing around what looked like a wimpy joint. I distinctly remember me and buddy laughing our asses off at the size of the pinner. But after a couple hits, we were Blitz'ed, and those dammm Harley Boys were going Heheheheheh at us. Yep, those were the days I had hair down to the middle of my back.

Use to go to Houston, SanAntonio for most of the concerts. I loved Houston, and racing the 1/4 mile down Rankin Rd. Those were the crazy days.

[Born2RockU]

If they played w/ the Stones in Houston...I gotta know.

What venue ? (the AstroDome)

Geeez Craig, you really go me thinkin now. I don't remeber the location, but think it was the astrodome. Does the astrodome have undergound parking. I seem to remember we parked in an underground parking lot, or maybe it was just parking below the stadium. Anyway, we were so fried after the concert, we couldn't find my Jeep. It took an about an hour or 2. Man, I was in bad shape.

Just before the Stones opened up, some Harley boys were passing around what looked like a wimpy joint. I distinctly remember me and buddy laughing our asses off at the size of the pinner. But after a couple hits, we were Blitz'ed, and those dammm Harley Boys were going Heheheheheh at us. Yep, those were the days I had hair down to the middle of my back.

Use to go to Houston, SanAntonio for most of the concerts. I loved Houston, and racing the 1/4 mile down Rankin Rd. Those were the crazy days.

THat might explain why you say RUSH played w/ the Stones. "Fogged memories", huh?

The answer to you Astrodome Parking underground question is NO. The Astrodome does not and never had underground parking. The only places in Houston that have or HAD underground parking is/was The Houston Coliseum/Houston Music Hall (parking was below on the BuffaloeBayou) and the Summit/Compaq Center (parking was 4 story's across the street w/ basement area.) I know for sure the Stones and RUS never played both of those places on the same bill. Again,...that joint must have been good !

As far as the Rankin Road 1/4 mile. Were you nuts....or what. ? I hope you weren't smokin' when driving on that deserted teenage hangout.