AZNracerx1989 Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 I know low watts with clean watts are good for audio listening... I heard 3 watts can go pretty loud. If this is the case, why do people recommend higher wattage for home theater? If its already loud, why get more watts? And, most people with low watts listen to classical. I listen to rock and songs with alot of slam. How can a low watt amp supply me with this kind of sound? How many watts are needed to give the RF-83's the power it needs to take full advantage of its lows on the subwoofer (full slam+full range of subwoofer). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 huh? the rf-83 are 100 db per watt so with 3 watts you get about 105 dbs You just need more wattage for movies as the amplitude can change from dead quiet to super loud very quickly with digital sounds like explsions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 Some speakers such as the RF-7 have a very low minimum impedence (2.8 ohms). Most low-watt receivers and amplifiers cannot effectively handle that low of an impedence. Typically a high-watt and high-current amp will be better suited for lower impedences. More watts give you more headroom to work with for sudden bursts of sound. I'm not sure if the RF-83 has the same minimum impedence, but I think its safe to say that they too would benefit from a clean high watt amp with the type of music you listen to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZNracerx1989 Posted September 13, 2006 Author Share Posted September 13, 2006 huh? the rf-83 are 100 db per watt so with 3 watts you get about 105 dbs You just need more wattage for movies as the amplitude can change from dead quiet to super loud very quickly with digital sounds like explsions. That would mean that songs with fast quiet to super loud wont be good on low watts? I know for sure 3 watts wont take the subwoofers of the rf-83's to its limits. How many watts will give it punchy bass and be able to dig down to its limit?Do you guys think an 2 Outlaw audio 2200 monoblocks or a Crown XLS402 would be bettter for the RF-83's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 there are no subwoofers on the rf83? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 you will be miserable with a 3 watt amp ... no matter what the math say's Don't Do It Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 I typically listen to my music below 1 watt. For HT, I use the full 300 watts. Could even use more (well, maybe). There is a great deal of sonic difference between an orchestra, for instance, and gun shots, explosions, etc. Personally, I think explosions should explode. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 That would mean that songs with fast quiet to super loud wont be good on low watts? I know for sure 3 watts wont take the subwoofers of the rf-83's to its limits. How many watts will give it punchy bass and be able to dig down to its limit? Do you guys think an 2 Outlaw audio 2200 monoblocks or a Crown XLS402 would be bettter for the RF-83's? You seem to have many things jumbled together and confused. The power output of a decent amp (watts) is unrelated to its frequency response. IOW, a good 3 watt amp can drive RF-83s to produce bass as deep as the speaker can go. The RF-83s will be as punchy on 3 watts as they will be. A low power amp will limit the maximum loudness the speakers can achieve, nothing else if the amp is decent, or better. High output amps are used in home theater only because of the dramatic *difference* in loudness, not how quickly it changes. Any home audio amp can handle the speed of any digital source. FWIW, RF-83s don't have subwoofers, they have woofers. Subwoofers are specialized narrow band woofers that only reproduce the lowest sounds. The power you need depends on your room size, what music you like and how loud you want it. I have found that quality SS amps start at about 100 watts. That will drive each 83 to 120 db at 1 meter. If you sit 10 meters away, you may want more power. Nonetheless, I recommend 100 watts per channel. That would generally get you a good, or better amp with plenty of "watts" between average loudness and the peaks music has. Try to find one that runs in Class A to more than one watt (Esoteric: most amps are designed to transition from Class A to B at some small power level; higher is better). That way you'll have clean sound at normal loudness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 As far as the math goes, I demo'ed my system for a buddy at 300 watts pegged on the meters. Suprizingly, it isn't painful (loud, yes) as you might expect, it is just to the point of being "uncomfortable for longterm listening". It isn't as loud as one would expect from "300 watts". It's only something like 4 times as loud as one watt (1w [or below], 3w, 30w, 300w). Not as impressive as one might expect. However, for HT, which has uncompressed dynamic capability as well as different purposes than music, you tend to use what you've got to its fullest extent, because the loud (explosions, etc.) parts are loud, and the remainder (which is the bulk) of the movie, etc., is "normal" dynamically speaking. For HT use, you NEED all the dynamic headroom you can get. The larger the amp (and respective power supply), the better. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 ...... Try to find one that runs in Class A to more than one watt (Esoteric: most amps are designed to transition from Class A to B at some small power level; higher is better). That way you'll have clean sound at normal loudness. ........ John, Two things that irritate me about manufacturer's specs are: 1) they typically do not list the levels of distortion when the (solid state) amp is not a full power (which is most of the time and the distortion will be greater) at these lower levels 2) they advertise as class A/B but they do not specify at what levels the amp transitions from class A occurs. Those few manufacturers that do list these specs are typically out of my price range. Although Parasound would list some of this (or at least they used to). Is there any easy way to get the info.? Do any of the magazines do this sort of bench testing? I agree with what you are advocating. -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Crown always lists milliwatt THD and IM spec's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivendell61 Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Tom, You might look at the Hypex class D amps. Great specs. Very neutral. They publish the THD vs Power plots and at .5 watts they are sub .005% THD. A nice 100k Ohms input impedance (don't you have a passive pre?). Balanced or unbalanced. Flat frequency into all loads.... They are incorporated in a few amp manufacturers products but can also be bought as simple kits. Mark Edit: here is a link to a datasheet: http://www.hypex.nl/docs/UcD400_datasheet.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivendell61 Posted September 15, 2006 Share Posted September 15, 2006 There is a distinction made (above) between demands of HT and music/orchestras, etc. Well, I'll just note that some well recorded 'classical' (I would guess not so with rock) music will be quite demanding. I have a CD (Prokofiev) which if you want to: a) Not compress the peaks and Hear the quiet bits You would (sitting at 10 ft--and with the above mentioned 100dB speakers) need.....c.300 watts. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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