Tarheel Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 There is another solution that I first saw at a friends house during the 70s. He suspended his tt from the ceiling using 4 lengths of chain attached to a wood platter that the tt sat on. This corrected the skipping problem completely. Looks a bit strange but it worked. About a year ago I mentioned this to Bluesboy who was also having skipping problems. We spent about an hour duplicating the same set up and the outcome was more than satisfactory. Brainstorming other ideas we came up with using threaded rod that would go through the wood base with nuts that you could use for leveling the tt. The rod would then go through the ceiling joist with a lock washer and nut to secure everything. Won't fit into everyones decor....just and idea that worked for us. If you have the luxury of building your own music room as I did you can do things that will help reduce vibrations. Bluesboy built my addition and we used 2x12 floor joist on one foot centers. We also used cross bracing and ran a 2x8 across the bottom of all the floor joist and built a pier under that. Doing it again....I might double up on the joist in the area under the tt. Shorter spans are desireable and drop girders after the fact can accomplish that goal. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJbob Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 To answer you question, if the wall's vibrate and you have a wall mount shelf -Yes it will affect the playback. I went through hell to get my VPI working corectly. Mine had spings. if you breathed it skiped. My father had told me movement in the air as you walk can also cause that effect. I built a 100LB TT stand with MDF shlevs and 2" oak legs with points to the floor. Then I cut 3 2-1/2" solid rubber balls in half placed them on the 2-1/4" thsick MDF top shelf then added a 1" marble base then my VPI TT. It helped, defenatly no hum or floor noise. Still had skipping when their was movement in the room. Took out the springs and put in the VPI JR sorbothane ft...No more problem. on a quick note - my empire 698 table I can almost jump up and down and it sounds great. In fact it just sits on top of a simple wood rack i made bewteen my LS and just play's Hmmmm $400 empire or $1700 tricked out VPI - makes you wonder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmusic Posted March 9, 2007 Author Share Posted March 9, 2007 Hummm!!! yes it does maske you wonder. Maybe I have alot less of a problem than I thought, I have no skipping at all, I think just some resonance. Jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted March 9, 2007 Moderators Share Posted March 9, 2007 Hummm!!! yes it does maske you wonder. Maybe I have alot less of a problem than I thought, I have no skipping at all, I think just some resonance. Jay Jay, Well of course as soon as I assumed what the construction is it turns out you have exactly the opposite. From what I understand from your follow up to my post, you are wondering about what, if any effect, the vibration you feel from the MUSIC coming from the speakers is having on your turntable. As far as vibration from the floor, you have none. Am I correct? Given that you are on a slab with tile floors (I would kill for that) I would assume that there is no floor vibration. I believe one response addressed your question that if you can feel music vibration then it is also reaching your equipment and having some effect, and he correctly stated that whether it makes a difference in the music depends on the equipment and the situation. You for sure do not need a wall rack with a slap and tile. You have the near perfect floor, and you have plenty of isolation. The only thing you would need to concern yourself with is dampening, that is to try and avoid any ill effects of vibration that is caused by the tt itself by virtue of the motor, the manner in this the platter is mounted (interved bearing, etc.). How high of volume level do you play? There is nothing that you can buy or do that will eliminate the effects of vibration from the sound itself, short of what Larry and Gary do and have the turntable in the other room. I would say unless you have a very obsolete TT, that you would have to be playing at extreamly loud levels for sound vibration to cause a problem with the sound that you would be able to notice. Travis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmusic Posted March 9, 2007 Author Share Posted March 9, 2007 Hummm!!! yes it does maske you wonder. Maybe I have alot less of a problem than I thought, I have no skipping at all, I think just some resonance. Jay Jay, Well of course as soon as I assumed what the construction is it turns out you have exactly the opposite. From what I understand from your follow up to my post, you are wondering about what, if any effect, the vibration you feel from the MUSIC coming from the speakers is having on your turntable. As far as vibration from the floor, you have none. Am I correct? Given that you are on a slab with tile floors (I would kill for that) I would assume that there is no floor vibration. I believe one response addressed your question that if you can feel music vibration then it is also reaching your equipment and having some effect, and he correctly stated that whether it makes a difference in the music depends on the equipment and the situation. You for sure do not need a wall rack with a slap and tile. You have the near perfect floor, and you have plenty of isolation. The only thing you would need to concern yourself with is dampening, that is to try and avoid any ill effects of vibration that is caused by the tt itself by virtue of the motor, the manner in this the platter is mounted (interved bearing, etc.). How high of volume level do you play? There is nothing that you can buy or do that will eliminate the effects of vibration from the sound itself, short of what Larry and Gary do and have the turntable in the other room. I would say unless you have a very obsolete TT, that you would have to be playing at extreamly loud levels for sound vibration to cause a problem with the sound that you would be able to notice. Travis Hi Travis, you are correct I have no vibration from the floor at all. I was concerned about the vibration that I feel from the speakers, as you know khorns use the walls for the bottom end. Well they also create alot of vibration down the walls and across the room, my inital question was how would a wall shelf help with all the vibration the speakers are sending into the walls. I listen to music between 80-95 db for the most part, every now and then I will get it up to 100db rarely. I sit about 11 feet away from the speakers and can feel the music at that point, so I just figured that if I could feel it so could my TT. Honestly the music sounds fine, I guess what I really need to do is isolate the TT from the shelf it's sitting on and that should be good. Jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted March 9, 2007 Moderators Share Posted March 9, 2007 Hi Travis, you are correct I have no vibration from the floor at all. I was concerned about the vibration that I feel from the speakers, as you know khorns use the walls for the bottom end. Well they also create alot of vibration down the walls and across the room, my inital question was how would a wall shelf help with all the vibration the speakers are sending into the walls. I listen to music between 80-95 db for the most part, every now and then I will get it up to 100db rarely. I sit about 11 feet away from the speakers and can feel the music at that point, so I just figured that if I could feel it so could my TT. Honestly the music sounds fine, I guess what I really need to do is isolate the TT from the shelf it's sitting on and that should be good. Jay I have my TT rack on the same wall as one of the Khorns, it is about 12 down the wall from the corner. In between the rack and the speaker is a window. With a rack you want it at least 4 feet away from the corner because that should put you into a different piece of sheetrock (4x8), unless they are mounting them on their sides and then you have to go 8' to get into another piece of sheetrock. In my situation you cannot feel the vibration on the wall past the window. That is where new sheet rock started and it just ends there. I think your assesment is correct, at those levels I don't believe that whatever sound vibrations through the air that hit your turntable would be causing any change in the sound to even someone with a golden ear. I think there is a lot of confusion with it comes to things you can buy that go between your turntable and what ever shelf or rack it is sitting on. With your rack sitting on solid tile that is sitting on a solid slab, I don't think you are going to benefit from anything that has to do with isolation. Isolation would decouple the TT from the floor (through the rack). In some situations this has the effect of trapping vibrations within your turntable. You would want something that tended to dampen rather then isolate. Dampening would have the effect absorbing whatever vibration is created by the turntable. A spongy springy Linn for example would sound better sitting on the floor then it would on an air bladder. This is because the suspensions system of the turntable is going to be working against and counter to the bladder. A Clear Audio, or Nottingham, with no suspension system at all could benefit greatly from an airbladder, or other dampening products because it can allow a means for vibraton to escape from the unit. What kind of TT/tonearm are you using now? I am sure it was mentioned but I just can't remember what it is right now. Travis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmusic Posted March 9, 2007 Author Share Posted March 9, 2007 Travis I used the wrong word, I meant to say dampen instead of isolate. My TT is a mid-fi vintage Luxman with stock arm, it is DD without any suspension at all. Jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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