Crossover points for Klipsch RF's?

[dbossa]

I've got a pair of RF-7's for my mains, RC-7 for the center, and RS-7's for the surrounds. I've also got an HSU VTF3-MK2 sub. My first guess would be to set the mains to large and set the rest to small using a 60Hz crossover. Do any of you have a similar setup and, if so, what crossover points are you using?

[PhilMays]

80 for me

[dbossa]

80 for me

80 for ALL speakers or excluding the mains?

[DrWho]

http://www.klipschcorner.com/Articles.aspx?guid=feb5d669-1513-426d-a8fc-29f8aa90869f

Or basically, 80Hz and everything small (even including the mains).

[dbossa]

http://www.klipschcorner.com/Articles.aspx?guid=feb5d669-1513-426d-a8fc-29f8aa90869f

Or basically, 80Hz and everything small (even including the mains).

I would have thought that the RF-7's would be considered full range speakers. When listening to two channel audio, wouldn't sending everything below 80Hz to the sub somewhat detract to the capabilities of the RF-7? I mean, the bass that it is capable of between 50 and 80 is so much cleaner and tighter than my HSU VTF3-MK2 which is already a very good sub. Wouldn't an 80Hz crossover reduce the overall sound quality?

[STUDIO 2000]

Can you explain to a newbie what is meant by crossover? What is it and how does it work?

Thanks,

Dave

[dbossa]

Can you explain to a newbie what is meant by crossover? What is it and how does it work?

Thanks,

Dave

It's actually quite simple but it only applies if you are using a subwoofer. A crossover of 80Hz means that everything above 80Hz will be played on your regular speakers and everything below 80Hz will go to your subwoofer. Most people tend to use a crossover that is higher than what their speakers are capable of doing. For example, my speakers go down to 32Hz. However, most people thing that the lower frequencies are better handled by a subwoofer and that you should only let your speakers play the mid to higher frequencies which is easier for it to do.

[DrWho]

http://www.klipschcorner.com/Articles.aspx?guid=feb5d669-1513-426d-a8fc-29f8aa90869f

Or basically, 80Hz and everything small (even including the mains).

I would have thought that the RF-7's would be considered full range speakers. When listening to two channel audio, wouldn't sending everything below 80Hz to the sub somewhat detract to the capabilities of the RF-7? I mean, the bass that it is capable of between 50 and 80 is so much cleaner and tighter than my HSU VTF3-MK2 which is already a very good sub. Wouldn't an 80Hz crossover reduce the overall sound quality?

What crossover options do you have on your receiver? There are always exceptions to the rule, but 80Hz and everything small is the best place to start - since that's what the movie studios are anticipating. Ultimately, what you want to avoid is having the mains and subwoofer overlap their passbands. It will cause a peak in the response, but more importantly it diminishes the percieved low frequency extension of the system - which is probably not something you want to do if you already feel like the sub is struggling to keep up. I would still recommend trying to stick with 80Hz and doing whatever you can to get it sounding as best as possible. From this starting point you can push the crossover lower to see where it sounds the best - trying if it all possible to avoid setting the mains to large. Another alternative would be to listen to 2-channel without the subwoofer altogether. If in the end you decide to set the mains to large, then no big deal - every situation is different and you wanna pick the settings that sound the best to you. I believe I also mentioned in that article a method that involves setting the mains to large and the LFE to Mains + Sub?

[PhilMays]

I'm not sure I have an option for crossover points for the different speakers on my amp. I actually think my amp (yamaha RX-Z1) has a 88hz crossover, which I use.

I set my main speakers (RF-7's) and everything else to small. Of course this is not perminant, and I am always playing with the settings!

Enjoy,

Phil

[dbossa]

http://www.klipschcorner.com/Articles.aspx?guid=feb5d669-1513-426d-a8fc-29f8aa90869f

Or basically, 80Hz and everything small (even including the mains).

I would have thought that the RF-7's would be considered full range speakers. When listening to two channel audio, wouldn't sending everything below 80Hz to the sub somewhat detract to the capabilities of the RF-7? I mean, the bass that it is capable of between 50 and 80 is so much cleaner and tighter than my HSU VTF3-MK2 which is already a very good sub. Wouldn't an 80Hz crossover reduce the overall sound quality?

What crossover options do you have on your receiver? There are always exceptions to the rule, but 80Hz and everything small is the best place to start - since that's what the movie studios are anticipating. Ultimately, what you want to avoid is having the mains and subwoofer overlap their passbands. It will cause a peak in the response, but more importantly it diminishes the percieved low frequency extension of the system - which is probably not something you want to do if you already feel like the sub is struggling to keep up. I would still recommend trying to stick with 80Hz and doing whatever you can to get it sounding as best as possible. From this starting point you can push the crossover lower to see where it sounds the best - trying if it all possible to avoid setting the mains to large. Another alternative would be to listen to 2-channel without the subwoofer altogether. If in the end you decide to set the mains to large, then no big deal - every situation is different and you wanna pick the settings that sound the best to you. I believe I also mentioned in that article a method that involves setting the mains to large and the LFE to Mains + Sub?

I can only set one crossover point for the whole system and can pick and choose which speakers are large or small. Two channel audio definitely sounds better with my mains set to large. It was for that reason why I wondered why I kept switching them to small everytime I listened to movies or multichannel audio. My VTF3-MK2 is not struggling in the least and has enough power to knock down my whole neighborhood. Nevertheless, the bass that comes out of the mains is still tighter and cleaner than that of my sub. I was just wondering if my arguement holds any water here

[Zen Traveler]

...I was just wondering if my arguement holds any water here

It does to me. [Y] FWIW, I have toyed with my HT for years and there is no way my RF-7's are going to be set to small after my trial and error. If your RF-7's sound better set to large for music--Why wouldn't that carry over to everything else if your AVR can handle it? [^o)]

[Hunt]

I would agree w/ TKD. I also experimented for a long time with large/small settings and different x'vers. I've read convincing arguments for both ways. Eventually, I settled on Large up front, small for everything else, crossed at 80, with my big old cylinder sub in the back of the room. I was running a Denon 2805 AVR at the time, and setting it to LFE + mains, sounded best in my room. I've since upgraded to the B&K seperates, and it seems as if the overall sound and bass just keeps on getting better and better each day I listen to it. Hardly a day goes by that I am not thoroughly impressed, and still leave it on large up front. Like others have said, you room placement and acoustics may be different, so you have to experiment. You can run into bass cancellation, and need to have them on small up front. That's part of the fun of it - don't worry needlessly about a wrong or right way, but find out how it sounds most pleasing to your ears. Last I checked, everyones ears were a little bit different too.

[colterphoto1]

LaScalas, small at 80Hz crossing over to THX sub system. I've tried it at 60-100 and usually wind up at 80.

CW's Large for surrounds, because they can take it.

Rear center set to large which is KSW12/Heresy setup.

General Rule: if you have a sub capable of better performance that your other speakers below that crossover point, use the sub.

In the old days I had CW's and the KSW and ran them Large and sent LFE to the Sub + Mains

Everyone's setup is different. Follow your ears.

[coolflea216]

Now I'm confused. I am running a 7.1 with RF-52s as mains, an RC-52, 4 Onkyo surrounds and the Onkyo Sub that I will eventually upgrade that came with my HTIB. My receiver is the Onkyo 604. I currently have my Fronts set to large but the Double Bass setting is on to still send LFE to the sub. All my other speakers crossovers are set to 80hz. Now what should the crossover on my sub be set to? Also, if I switch the crossovers on the fronts to 80hz, what should the subs crossover be set at? Thanks

[tenzip]

Take hold of the knob on your sub x-over, and crank it as high as it will go. You only need one crossover working on the signal, and you're setting that in the receiver.

How do you like your Onkyo? I had my 604 only a short time before I got the bug. It'll probably go over to my parent's house now.

[coolflea216]

Actually, my sub does not have it's own crossover, I meant the receivers crossover setting for the sub. Do i put it at 80hz? And I love the 604, it's a great receiver.

[tenzip]

I did not have a sub hooked up, but I don't remember a separate crossover setting for the sub. What you set for the speakers is the crossover. Think of it as a high pass filter for each speaker, anything that doesn't get through the filter goes to the sub.

[dbossa]

I was unaware that I even had an LFE+mains setting on my receiver. So, let me get this straight (and correct me if I'm wrong):

I would essentially setup my front speakers as large and set my receiver to LFE+mains. That means that my front speakers would get the full range and my sub would receive all the bass from the mains plus the LFE.

Is this type of setup considered better to use vs having the sub do only the LFE?

[tenzip]

It depends on what your ears tell you. Sit and listen to it, then change the settings and listen again.

At this point, I'm almost glad I don't have a sub, I just set everything to large and forget it. []

[dbossa]

Actually, now that I think about it, I can't do that. I only have that option on my receiver but I want my HTPC to do all the processing which means I need to use the HTPC's bass management. The only way I could acheive something similar is to set all speakers to large and set my crossover to 40Hz in the bass management section of my HTPC (since the 3db point for my mains is 32Hz).

This way all stereo audio would come almost exclusively out of the mains and movies with LFE would still benefit by the sub. I think that would be the best way to go for my setup.