fenderbender Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 All other considerations aside.......I think building an amp would be a lot of fun and very educational.... I for one am toying with the idea of building a set of Transcendent T16 mono's...I have never built an amp before, or soldered much besides an RCA cable...but I'm a quick study and have good manual dexterity ....so I make a few mistakes and have to resolder.... Hey Nailbender....us "benders" need to stick together [][][] ...VRD's sound great, but if funds are not there ....this kit sounds like a great deal and will be fun , frustrating , and educational.....go for it!!!! You can always get some VRD's later down the road.... nothing like having someone admire your amp and then say "I built that"!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldenough Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 Fenderbender wrote..." nothing like having someone admire your amp and then say "I built that"!!! " That my friend is probably the BEST reason for doing it. Satisfaction in a job well done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 "...I think building an amp would be a lot of fun and very educational.... I for one am toying with the idea of building a set of Transcendent T16 mono's.." The Transcendent kits are likely good choices as well. I enjoyed the SE-OTL I had. *IF* you go that route I'd suggest getting a couple of cheap whatever kits to practice a little on first. A few things from here maybe: http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm IMOit is way better to get more experience soldering on a couple ofinexpensive kits them doing so on a set of $2600 monoblocks. After youget a couple of those kits built and working them consider the T16s. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 "IMO it is way better to get more experience soldering on a couple of inexpensive kits.." A couple hundred crossovers works good too. Too many damn tubes with that T16, good grief -- it's bad enough trying to figure out which tube is bad when you only have two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 You might also: Check the menu on the left at www.tubesandmore.com for kits. There is a link to an actually quite well-reviewed stereo amp kit for under $200. While kind of expensive as a practice, just something else to look at for interest, and there are lots of interesting things there to check out -- tubes, transformers, sockets, other passive/active parts. The kit is built on PCB, and mounted on a board. Shawn is talking about the Transcendent Sound SE OTL as seen below. It is an incredible amp for very efficient speakers, but 1.5watt/channel might leave some wanting for more. I loved it. edit: Forgot the laptop doesn't have the pictures on it. I'll post a couple later. The instructions are easy to follow, as well. The Transcendent T-16 with more horsepower was as quiet and equally superb. Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 Relax... I realize everyone is very subjective on this forum. I encourage it. Let me ask this question... what makes a VRD amp voiced to a Klipsch speaker? I am not doubting the worthiness of the VRD, but it's out of my price range. Plus I'd like to assemble it to possibly mod it or repair it in the future. I hear that tube amps are high maintenance. I'm sure I'll get blasted with smart remarks, but it's like water off a duck's back. No worries. Where are you stationed in Florida? Pensacola? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 Dean, "Too many *** tubes with that T16, good grief --it's bad enough trying to figure out which tube is bad when you onlyhave two." Would be useful to deal with the multitudeof 6c19pi I have though. Pretty sure you can pull output tubes and runon less to figure out which ones are bad. I asked Bruce about running asingle channel of a stereo T16 and pulling the other channels tubes andhe said that was fine. Or you could just get a tube tester. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenderbender Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 "IMO it is way better to get more experience soldering on a couple of inexpensive kits.." A couple hundred crossovers works good too. ) You Need an apprentice this summer [][][] Thanks for all the feedback guy's...I fully plan on practicing ...after speaking with Bruce R...I'll get some very cheap components and just practice untill my joints are good... I misspoke and will probably start buy building a SEOTL first...as I intend on getting vrd's as my large purchase later this year....then If money is still there I may try to tackle the T16's...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 Here's what's in the SE OTL: Each socket has to be soldered, pin-by-pin into the circuit board sockets, as well as the other parts stuffed into the boards. The rest is point-to-point, with some cap/resistor bypass connections that are just a little bit fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 The above is one of the later versions I built, which includes a small filter on the output. Some seem to have adverse reactions in the presence of electrolytic capacitors, but please note that those used in this circuit are appropriate for the application. I found a more simple crossover, such as the type 'A' for example, to work better than a higher order design with this amp. Again, it's subjective. The Transcendent Grounded Grid preamp is also a great performer for the money, and I've built several of those -- a few hours work after you have some practice. The circuit design was historically more common in the RF field, and Rozenblit found a good use for it for music audio. Very quiet, too. Have fun, Erik edit: Just to mention because I think it's important to know: The SE OTL is even better IMO when setup as a monoblock. Quiet grounding can be kind of a juggling act at times, and I found the 4 watt monoblock-wired SE OTL quieter than the stereo counterpart. With efficient horns, the sound is just outstanding. Output transformers are kind of like passive crossovers in some respects: sort of necessary evils. OTL amps and active networks can be the answer to those problems for some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenderbender Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 Thanks for the great info Erik......Looks like something I could really dig my teeth into.....even though I'm short on t electronics experience, I did quite a lot of model building in my younger days and have spent the last 25 years as a chef and have won a number of awards for my show work...(talk about patience...I'll never do another show) So I believe that I have the ability to work slow and meticulous and methodical...even if it's just soldering a few joints an hour at first...no need to get it done in a day. I probably would do two in mono....I have ALK extreme slope networks on my Klipschorns...how do you think they would react to these amps?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 Sure. "even though I'm short on t electronics experience, I did quite a lot of model building in my younger days and have spent the last 25 years as a chef and have won a number of awards for my show work...(talk about patience...I'll never do another show)" If you built models, soldering won't be a problem once you get the feel for it. It's a rather basic manual skill which can be refined. Congrats on your cooking awards! As far as the ES and SE OTL, I don't have experience with such high order slopes. I believe Shawn does, though, so maybe he can mention something about that. There is a fair amount of insertion loss because of the number of passive parts in those networks, which is NOT to say I think they aren't good crossovers. Al is a talented designer, and I'm mentioning this only because of the lower output ability of the Transcendent amp. The VRDs would fair better in that respect, IMO. There is always a compromise. Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nailbender Posted July 9, 2008 Author Share Posted July 9, 2008 I'm stationed at Hurlburt Field currently in Balad, Iraq. I should be back very soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 Okay. My opinion is that ES networks would not be the best match for such a lower power amplifier, but only you can be the final judge of that. It would be possible to compare them with the more simple and efficient type 'A', and if you don't have one, I could make up a pair and send to you to try with the amp. One must start to compare some cost and performance issues. I also probably wouldn't recommend this amp as a first time build project. You could actually build yourself a pair of type 'A's to use, which would give you a small amount of practice, as well as end up with something useful to use with the OTL amp if you decided to get one. Erik And Nailbender: Take good care out there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nailbender Posted July 11, 2008 Author Share Posted July 11, 2008 Just got home last night. I purchased the 60 wpc stereo tube amp kit from Bob Latino. I'll let you all know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted July 11, 2008 Share Posted July 11, 2008 Before anything else -- WELCOME HOME!!! I've been preferring to build from scratch lately, but I admit those kits look really cool. Very tempting! Please do keep us updated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted August 8, 2008 Share Posted August 8, 2008 partial assembly manual avail in below thread http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/t/107797.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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