jdm56

Good job!

At least some models in Velodynes DLS-R line have selectable 80/100Hz 1st order high-pass filters on their speaker-level outputs. On their DEQ-R series, it is fixed at 120Hz. I'm not sure of the slope on those. At least one Parts Express plate amp has a high-pass filter on it's speaker-level outs. I'm not sure of the model number but it is rated at 240W and is supplied with their 10" Titanic III sub.

I'd think the older ones having more plywood instead of mdf would make some difference in sound, but I can only guess as to whether or not it would be for the better or for the worse. And yes, the crossovers and drivers have changed over the years, so that has to make an audible difference. But is it a "big difference"? I've never A-B'd old and new, so I can't say. My opinion on whether older speakers need upgraded to newer specs is this: If it ain't broke, don't fix it! And that dictum could be extended to include sound quality. In other words, if it sounds good enough that you're happy with it and you have no proof a specific change would actually translate into better sound, then why bother?

My definition of "too much" keeps going up. Especially since the Palladiums came out! $20,000.00?[:S] Bob Carver seems to be an "outside the box" kind of guy. Kind of like Paul Klipsch, only with different conclusions. Check out Bob's little cinema ribbons: http://www.sunfire.com/CR.htm I'll bet these little pups can pull off all manner of imaging hocus-pocus.

I paid less than $500 for my $700 list Onkyo integrated and I love it. It's a digital amp rated 100W/channel @1kHz into 8 Ohms and 200W into 4 Ohms. Let's see...Marantz has a 70W/channel int. that lists for $700. Yamaha has a 100W'er for $500, I think. Then there's NAD and Cambridge. I think they both have products in that range. Most of the majors have decent receivers in that price range, too. Off the top of my head, I know Onkyo, Denon, Yamaha, Sony and Marantz do. The killer affordable 2-channel receiver is the Outlaw, though. It is really cool. -Lots of choices!

"I talked directly to Velodyne- they no longer sell a sub that will accept the speaker wire as an input and then out put to the Klipsch's." I don't know who you talked to at Velodyne, but they told you wrong. I use two Velo DLS4000R subs with my two-channel rig. They have speaker level inputs and outputs. There are so many Velodyne subs, I can't say for sure which ones do or don't have speaker-level connections, but I know mine do and I think all the DLS-R and the new DEQ-R lines do. Many SVS subs do too.

That's what I'm talking about! How do they do that? Unless somebody comes up with a better explanation, I'm going to go with phase manipulation. Of course, just saying that doesn't really explain the how, really. It'd probably be over my big, fat head anyway.[]

The most holographic imaging I've ever achieved myself was with a pair of Optimus Pro-77's from Radio Shack, set up on stands well out from the walls, in almost a near-field arrangement. No bass, but lots of depth and imaging magic. Too bad their tweeter was so lame. I'm sure much better results could be obtained with better mini-speakers, such as ADS L310's or something along those lines. I guess another related question (not that the first ones have been answered yet[]) is how much of any given set-up's imaging performance could be described as accurately reproducing information on the recording, and how much is just a speaker/room induced effect? Especially the "outside the box" imaging; i.e. the (re)creation of images outside the plane of the speakers. And I guess what I'm still hoping to hear from some of you knowledgable audio dweebs (a compliment!) is what's going on when a system does just that. I recall watching one of my kids DVD's that had a scene with a jet on a runway. As the jet streaked from right to left, the image just kept on going beyond the left speaker -amazing! I don't hear that kind of eerie, beyond the speaker imaging in music as often as I do in movie effects, but I do hear it sometimes.

"Belle on Wheels" Didn't Sir Paul and Wings sing that?[]

Most of the time, the image produced by two speakers is confined to an imaginary line drawn from the left speaker to the right. If a given pair of speakers can reproduce solid, convincing images at any point along that line, they're doing pretty good. Sometimes the line is straight and sometimes it is bent in the middle, depending on whether the speakers are "forward" or "laid back". And some speakers produce vague images along the line, while others are razor sharp. And some can produce images behind the line. These speakers, we say, have good depth. But there is one aspect of two-channel imaging that in my experience is more or less constant. Others may disagree, but personally, I seldom experience image placement outside this imaginary line. That is, to the left of the left speaker or to the right of the right speaker. Notice I said "seldom". Because I do have a few recordings that will at times image "outside the box"; sometimes extremely and startlingly so. My question is: "how is this accomplished? What factors are at work here. My feeling is there must be some kind of phase manipulation going on, some audio "hocus-pocus" if you will. Or perhaps it is just accidental! And this leads to the next question: If this can be controlled, that is, if it's just a matter of the recording engineer pushing the right buttons or turning the right nobs, then why isn't it done more often. It is a very "cool" effect and could be used to widen the soundstage considerably.

Hey, I thought that must be a belle on casters! ...Thanks for the picture. The guides were a good idea in lieu of a flat top plate. Better, actually, because there's no way the speakers are sliding off those!

Amen to the above. I'd forget about numbers, specs and test data. The klipschorns will play loud enough, period! Just enjoy the music. If you still feel the need to tweak, I would look elsewhere in the system and focus on sound quality. You've already got the quantity thing nailed down! Just my humble opinion. BTW, congrats on the fine speakers! I used to have a pair of '98 k-horns with the AK-3 network, myself.

Looks like you got yer klipsch on! Enjoy!! ...but don't deafen junior!

Congrats on the good find. I've been seeing some exceptionally clean la scalas on ebay lately and yours appear to be in fine shape. Yes, the la scalas do image like champs, don't they. Pretty amazing for a big box of a speaker. I think they're the best imaging heritage of all. Put a good sub or two with them, and then you've got something that can go toe to toe with the mighty k-horn. I think the reason the LS1 and 2 image so well is that they actually have very little baffle area, relative to the area of the horns. Compared to the la scalas, the other heritage speaker's drivers see a much bigger baffle area, especially the klipschorn. The la scalas even have a degree of three dimensionality to their sound. They're not 'stats by any means, but they do at least let you hear depth information in the recording.

Oops, guess I'm late again![] Anyway, thanks! Yeah it's a nice place to live, if a little on the depressed side right now. I'm sure you noticed all the empty retail space. What do I do? I work for 3M. A lowly wage slave, to be exact. Currently (well, for the last 14 years[:S] I have classified wastes and ran a solvent distillation unit among other fun activities.[|-)] As they say, "it pays the bills". You would be welcome to swing by the hacienda some time if you're ever in the vicinity with some time to kill. We are peacable folk and I always enjoy talking audio and music with anyone so inclined.

I'm just not ready to go that route yet! (A) I've only had the LS2's less than two months and my wife would kill me if I even mentioned that kind of mod; ( Frankly, I can't imagine anything having more presence and detail than what I've got now. (I know -- Ignorance is bliss!) and © This system is in a family room, so I have to maintain at least a wee bit of wife acceptance factor. BTW, Mr. BHendrix, you simply MUST send pics of your HT rig to the mags. They would have to run a story on it because it is the most gorgaceous A/V speaker/room set-up I've ever seen in the history of the universe as we know it.[H]

Yeah, that's good advice, no doubt. I don't want to get too fancy, and to be honest, I don't really think I'm losing much high-end as is, but there is a bit of dulling when I stand up from my seat in the sweet spot. (No big deal there!) When seated, and depending on how I'm sitting, my ears are just a little bit above the tweeter now. I really think just raising the front with a few degrees of tilt might be the best thing, but then again, casters would be handy sometimes. Oh well, I'll probably just try some different things like you said, just to see what works before I put any time and expense into anything.

I'm contemplating building either risers or stands for my LSII's. I'm not sure I will, but after I get my subwoofer situation sorted out, I'll need something to focus on, audio-wise. So if anyone has pics of risers or stands they've built for La Scala's, Belles or Cornwalls, I'd like to see them. I'm thinking probably risers, about 4" high, more or less. Or maybe just an angled pair similar to what they put under H3's. I'm not really sure it will improve the sound, other than when standing, but then again, it might. Casters might be kind of nice, too...

Then let me say a little more about the Conquest. After living with it for some time now I wouldn't suggest any less of a sub to go with Klipschorns or LaScalas. This will also depend on your room size. My room is about 17' x 50' and is open to a 16' x 20' room that can be closed off by flimsy double doors that I usually leave open. Normal listening for me is between 88 and 94 db on the Rat Shack meter. I can now enyoy listening at around the 85 db level, because the Conquest will fill the room on the low end. Before nothing under 94db would please me. I still prefer levels at around 94 db. When I'm into something that I like the listening level goes up to 104db. The Sunfire could keep up in volume up to 94, then it would't go any louder. The Conquest will allow me to listen to levels up to 110 db in my room. This is around the level where the Klipschorns will keep going, but the Conquest won't. So, I could use another one if I want more head room. My McIntosh amp meters read around a steady 1 watt per channel ( I have 10 channels ), at 88 db. When at 94 db the meters show a steady 2 to 5 watts. To get to 104db. I have to feed the Klipschorns a steady 20 watts. At 107 to 110 db, which is too loud to listen to for long, the Conquest won't increase in volume, but the Klipschorns will. Thing is, I'm kindy odd (in case you hadn't noticed that already) and I really need two subs. It has less to do with performance than it does my own particuliar oddness. I like visual balance in the front of the room. (I know, I should seek psychiatric intervention.) Then, when you figure my room is only 15' wide and I already have the LSII's in there, the amount of real estate left for subs is limited. A pair of 18" wide subs is about all I can accomodate without crowding the speakers too close together. The Velodyne DLS4000R's I'm using now are only about 15" wide, but I'd like a little more oomph. Which puts me back to a pair of AV123 MFW-15's, Velodyne DLS-5000R's or Epik Knights. The Epiks are still almost too big at 27" deep w/grilles. I'd prefer not to have the subs deeper than the LSII's. So that leaves the Velo's and the AV123's. The Velodynes have good output between 30 and 60 Hz, but don't do much below 30Hz. The MFW-15's seem to do it all well, yet they're not too big or too costly. Now, if the economy would only "straighten up and fly right"![]

I'd really like to make that show someday! I looked over the reports on Stereophile's website and I gotta say I came away just thinking how crazy over-the-top "high end" prices are. All the $20000 and up speakers...PLEASE! Makes good ol' Klipsch Heritage look like screaming bargains.

I'm always the last one at the party. ...Oh well, better late than never! I've got to say that is one of the very best HT set-ups I have ever seen. Definitely the best looking...so clean and together...and manly, ar-ar-arhhh!! I'd love to hear those jubes!!! I'm in Nevada, MO so keep your doors locked or else Papa Bear may be sitting in the sweet spot some night when you come home. -"ah, just right!"

"Thanks Seti for posting this." -RF62 Amen to the above. It seems only logical that a round or conical horn would have fewer reflections within it due to the shape of the horn more closely resembling the shape of the expanding wave front. If so, it would logically follow there would be fewer colorations due to reflections inside the horn. Assuming that's all true, the round horn still wouldn't necessarily sound better than a square or rectangular one! All I know is the best sounding horns I've heard have all been exponential.

...leaning real hard towards dual AV123 MFW-15's. the economy has me spooked though. would it be less than prudent to "blow" $1400 on a pair of killer subs right now?[6]

Looks to be coming along nicely. I bet they'll sound great! Be sure to post more pics as you go.

That place looks familiar... Didn't Neko Case film a concert there?