bkevind

I've got one family spot left but it's spoken for

Yeah. https://support.tidal.com/hc/en-us/articles/203055651-Who-owns-TIDAL "TIDAL has the commitment of artist owners that believe in creating a more sustainable model for the music industry. The TIDAL artist-owners are Alicia Keys, Arcade Fire’s Win Butler and Regine Chassagne, Beyoncé, Calvin Harris, Coldplay’s Chris Martin, Daft Punk, Damian Marley, deadmau5, Indochine, J. Cole, Jack White, Jason Aldean, Shawn “JAY Z” Carter, Kanye West, Lil Wayne, Madonna, Nicki Minaj, Rihanna, T.I. and Usher."

I wish I could do that for the side surrounds but I took a good hard look at it today and I can't make it happen. Well I probably could but WAF meter pegged suddenly at that one So the big LCR and sub on the front wall are fine, 6 speakers in the ceiling are fine, and the bookshelf speakers in the back are fine too. But...no in walls for the side surrounds! Makes sense, it would be weirdly out of balance for the room to have them where they'd need to be. Haven't had any side surrounds to date in this house, for that reason. Just the bookshelf speakers in the back. So in spite of the so-so configuration ("side surrounds" will be in ceiling) all in all it will be an improved movie experience.

Sure will. Not a proper room for any audio, but will give my thoughts. Probably 2 months out. Will be upgrading receivers to support 11 channels (LCR, 2Sides, 2Backs, 4 heights), but mainly I need to get off my arse and run the wiring in the attic. I should use this time to relocate the AVR/Amp to the closet that shares the wall with the TV and stuff.

I ordered 4x CDT-5800-CII. Will be front height and side surrounds for now. Might add another pair later for rear height. I found them cheap enough, with full Klipsch warranty intact so I jumped on them. I reviewed the possibility of 2 in walls for side surround but it just won't work.

I really enjoy Tidal. I use it different ways. I have a media pc connected to a Schiit Modi multibit DAC then connected to the integrated amp in the office for my 2 channel enjoyment. I use a play-fi streaming device I have connected to the receiver for the main family room. Although now I've started using the direct connection on my Yamaha receiver with multicast. Yamaha supports Tidal after a recent firmware update. Sounds great.

To the point - you said you don't want to mess with separates. As @MetropolisLakeOutfitters says, you just need a receiver (or AVR). Personally I lean towards the top of the line of whatever brand (Yamaha for me), even though it costs a lot more and has way more channels and other features you just don't need. My reason is simple, the TOTL gets the best DACs and audio processing effort that mfg has to offer. You can save a bit by buying previous gen models (especially if you don't mind refurbished). In my case I'll probably pick up the Yam 3060 as I need an upgrade. The stuff that matters to me hasn't been changed. ($2200 receiver for $1200). The Marantz example is the SR7011, a $2200 for $1100 (at accessories 4 less) which is another one I'm considering.

It's good to hear positive experience with Marantz. I think what happens to me is when I research a Marantz I want to buy (AVR) I unintentionally find all of the negative things with reliability. What you don't find are all the attaboys, as when things work well people don't generally talk about them much.

If the room was closed, it'd be 13.9'x21.5' with 8' ceiling However it's open to the rest of the house hallway to bedrooms on left front, directly behind is half wall (4' high) (at 21.5' from TV) open to main entrance, and left back open to dining and kitchen (small house - 2000 sq/ft 3bd + office) Yeah I'm S.O.L. to run proper side surrounds and rear surrounds, although I can leave the SVS Ultras as rear surrounds. The rears are a little close together, but work well enough. Probably work better than in-ceiling would, but may work poorly in tandem with in-ceiling side surrounds. I'm still thinking about in-wall side surrounds at a better, lower height. Or maybe on-wall closer to ceiling. That area is a main walk way through the house so that's why I probably will just go with in-ceiling. The left side would be a few feet further left than the right because of the open room. If I could manage that then I could just have 2 pair of in ceiling for height / atmos effects.

Yeah I have no doubt. One thing I really like about the Ultra2 stuff is they come completely enclosed. But definitely not worth the price for my purposes. I can get the Klipsch enclosure that might help a bit, even though it's just thin metal I think. At least it will be to code then Or...I could build some basic backer boxes I suppose. I don't mind having non Klipsch installed in the ceiling but I want the efficiency and brightness to be similar. That's the deal breaker for the RSL. They have a 3/4" soft dome tweeter, and are rated at 88dB SPL 1w/1m. They sound a bit dull and muted compared to the aluminum tweets in my SVS ultras that are temporary rear surrounds, and the Klipsch up front. I cranked the gain up on them but still just, no. The SVS ultra actually works pretty well, perhaps overkill as rear surround, but my wife doesn't mind them there. The aluminum tweeter is the right amount of bright, and in spite of less rated efficiency than the Klipsch, they get plenty loud and dynamic to match the LCR fine. So I'll start with 2 pair of the 5800-c II in ceiling and leave the SVS for the time being.

I take it back. I don't think it's worthwhile going for the pricey THX in ceiling, for my space - and likely not the best tonal match. I also decided to have another isolated listen of the RSL pair I have now. Man it's just not going to cut it. Looks like I'll be going for 5800-c ii. Sweet spot in price and seems it should be a pretty close tonal match to my LCR. In theory anyway. Mainly I want a closer match than the RSLs provide, too much of a gap there in sound and efficiency.

I don't suppose there is any "matching" ceiling speakers to go with my l/c/r. I've got one set of in ceiling (it's pretty good RSL C34E - good for the money), but thinking of going with something Klipsch ultra2 for my height / surround (6 speakers) Would of course prefer to have proper speakers and not in ceilings but it's just not an option in our room.

This little sub is pretty darn good. I have one in the office and it is impressive. Matches up well to bookshelf speakers.

That is fantastic. Similar to my wife's reaction. A toast to awesome women and wives!

I want to want Marantz but everytime I look deeper into their receivers I see a trend of issues (Denon as well - sister companies). I've owned Denons in the past and been underwhelmed. I keep coming back to Yamaha for an AVR because they are very reliable and I tend to like their "sound" (yes different amps/AVRs/preamps have their own sound) But I make sure to get one with pre-outs so I can use an external amplifier. The thing is with almost all AVRs, the amp sections have become less and less as the features stack goes up and up. For 2.0 only this isn't so bad, as all the watts per channel ratings of the receivers are specifically for 2 channel. Once you start adding more channels to the weak AVR amps the wpc goes way down. Yeah technically you don't need a lot of power to play at moderate to loud volumes, but there is more to it than just getting loud. Higher quality amps will sound better - cleaner, better control of bass, depth of sound, blah blah blah it goes on and on 3 channels makes sense for TV, and sometimes for some types of music - I enjoy multi channel stereo. No phono preamp isn't that big of a deal as you can buy a pre separately or buy a player with a built in pre. Anthem seems to make nice stuff, but I haven't used it. For receivers I've used Onkyo, Denon (a few), NAD, Yamaha (several), and Pioneer. Only the Denon really disappointed me for the money, and only the Yamahas have stood out above the ones I've used - for my use and taste. Maybe there are some better boutique brands out there that still make AVR's with excellent amp sections, but if not I'd recommend AVR + external amp to get the most out of the Forte III - or any decent speakers for that matter.

Yeah, doesn't it? My wife and I had a pretty deep philosophical / relationship discussion about that. It may have been also that he was ready to let go of them. He had some nice RP-150 or 160m setup, so at least he's got something. That emotional tie into one of if not the first major purchase he ever saved for and made happen...kind of sad to let go of that after all these years. But then again I am not one to hold on to objects forever. Likely will hold on to what I have for many years though. Thanks for the congrats, I'm very happy with the purchase.

So I've been on the hunt for a pair of vintage/heritage speakers. Idea is to put them in the office (small space - 9.5x15.5) where we listen to vinyl and Tidal streams. We both work from home and spend a lot of time in here. We already have excellent bookshelf speakers and a small sub to go with - sounds really damn good (SVS Ultra bookshelf and SVS SB1000). But, I just love the look, feel, smell and sound of vintage stuff in general. Because of the size of the space, I figured Heresy's at the largest. My impatient struggle to find any locally was starting to climax towards giving up and/or spending a lot more on a set of Heresy III. Recently a set of Forte II show up for a pretty high price, but I decided to go for it. I checked the dimensions specs and it seemed reasonable (always does on paper, until you see them in person!). I bought them, brought them home and snuck them into the office, setup in place of the bookshelf speakers. Yeah these things are visually big. Fully expecting my wife to be annoyed. Nope. "Hey I love these! They look great in here. Matches our desks, looks cool with the record player. Sounds awesome!" Yeah I'm a lucky guy. Conversely. The guy I bought them from is living the typical speaker enthusiast nightmare with his wife cracking down. This guy saved for these speakers all through high school, and bought them brand new when he graduated HS in 1990. Fast forward 27 years, and they have to go(wtf?!). Makes me kind of sad for him, he was pretty dejected to be selling them.

No worries. I keep things in perspective, and try to change perspectives when it helps keep an open mind. I take words laced with vitriol and vehemence with a large grain of salt.

Thanks for the feedback. Regarding the crossovers, I don't expect to hear much of a difference, unless my current caps are that far gone. In my mind, it is replacing consumable parts with improved consumable parts that will likely outlive me. Hah yeah. It's the way of the 'net. The thing is, when you've been steeped in something for quite a while, certain things seem rather self-evident. And you know you've seen the topic answered/discussed time and again, so it's there in the forum for discovery (in theory). I'm appreciative of the positive response as well, with seemingly a lack of any animosity. In spite of my excellent Google-fu, information was leaning towards disparate and inconclusive. Some of this disparate energy I gathered from Alk's website, who pulls no punches with their perspective of things Thanks to you forum vets for not roasting this noob on an open fire.

Good advice, thank you. I want spend a bit more time with the stock speakers, since I've only had them for a day now. The age alone justifies x-over replacement, but I'll wait a bit if I can...will be hard once I have them in my hands Then I will definitely give it some time before replacing the tweeters.

And done. Bob Crites new xo's and ti tweeters ordered. Thanks Bob! Seems like a real nice guy.

Thank you Mark. I did catch a lot of info from audioKarma. That sounds like the proper route for me. This thread helped crystallize that for me. I'll start with crites xo then maybe go with the rest of the goodies later.

Thanks all. I've pretty much decided on the new Crites xo at a minimum, and there seems to be consensus on the Crites tites. I guess the reason for this thread is that it is not clear the effect of the difference in methodolgy (between the different options, pros cons of those blah blah), and if there was a clear "man you have to hear these Alks..." sort of thing. I read a lot of threads that trusty google pointed me to, and ultimately came away less informed. That in itself informed me that I should just do the basics and enjoy what I have. Forums searches and even google searches of forums often leaves much to be desired for subjects that are themselves not black and white. I've been on both sides of that coin many times for many years. "Search noob!" is always the answer, but it rarely provides any good answers on subjects like this IMO.

First, I'm sure this is a topic that has been beat to death and is considered common knowledge on the forums - but in my searches so far I'm not quite gleaning the understanding I'm looking for. So with that, please forgive me my ignorance and asking "those annoying newb questions" Let's leave the debate of "should I upgrade or not" to a different thread So far what I think I know: Crites: -upgraded drivers/tweeters -crossover replacement (but not an "upgrade" in xo design?) ALK Engineering: -Upgraded drivers/tweeters -Crossover upgrades DeanG: -Crossover replacement / upgrades (?) I understand a xo replacement with new/improved parts can/will sound different/better because aging caps degrade in quality (higher resistance / ESR). The Forte II's I just picked up are approaching 30 years old, so at the least I'm considering going with something like the Crites xo replacements. I've also seen a variety of things like, felt discs, ping pong balls etc, and lifting the Fortes. Cabinet bracing, gluing all seams to seal the box, weighting the passive radiator for improved bass, etc. I'd probably go for gluing seams, maybe some bracing, reducing horn resonance with some material, and of course xo, possibly drivers if need be later on. Thanks for your time and thoughts. -Kevin

Listening to the album, Dave Grusin / Homage to Duke. I'm having ear-gasms. This might just be my forte after all.