Croc Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 i did not made any changes yout to my xover - it's "pure" Type A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Type A or AA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 type A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Here's a pic schematic of a type A. a 13uf capacitor, a 2.5mh inductor, a 2uf capacitor, and t2a autoformer. Can you post a picture of your xover, i want to see how it is wired. Also, please confirm what drivers you have. I'll them post the changes to make your xover cutover at 500hz. I just want to make sure we all understand what you have and what state it is in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pzannucci Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 There were some old posts from ALK that show with the right mid driver that the 511 actually is usable to 400hz. If this is really a Klipsch A network then the difference in the output (with the slow crossover roll off) between the 511 and a K400 or 401 should be very small. It may be something else requiring some crossover changes such as the mid output being slightly higher, 511 horn being much shorter causing phase differences, ringing of the 511 horn or even the lack of coloration the K400 adds. Any of these will definitely affect the midbass timbre as that is where the overlap off the drivers occurs, especially with the A network. Worst case it is raising the crossover slightly from the bass horn (type A 6db electrical) by lowering the inductor value some and lowering the output of the mid about 1db or so, Hopefully the phase on the mid driver is correct. You could check and make sure by flipping the + and - to see if there is much of a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 You could check and make sure by flipping the + and - to see if there is much of a difference. thats right....on a k-55. theres a small number 1 for positive and a small number 2 for negative next to each connection on the driver. If this is really a Klipsch A network I'm also curious what you have as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kg4guy Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 type A I think you would be ok with the type A and the 511B's at 400Hz there is so much driver over lap in the A network I really don't think you could hear much difference and even though the 511B is 500Hz cut off it will still go a little lower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 You probably need to look at the Altec spec sheet. If you cross the 511 lower than 500Hz, you may need to use a steeper filter (not a first order on the type A network). It can be hard on the driver and may give some distortion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.4knee Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 In the LS type A, AA, AL the actual crossover point is more the acoustic cutoff of the horns rather than electrical. The same is true for the ALK. I thought I noticed a "hole" when I first switched to 511b but it turned out not to be the case. I use the ALK Universal so I opted to change my tap settings to knock down the sqawker a bit. Been happy ever since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 In the LS type A, AA, AL the actual crossover point is more the acoustic cutoff of the horns rather than electrical. The same is true for the ALK. I thought I noticed a "hole" when I first switched to 511b but it turned out not to be the case. I use the ALK Universal so I opted to change my tap settings to knock down the sqawker a bit. Been happy ever since. Thats right....the k-400, according to the dope from hope article introducing it, has a lower range of 230hz with a recommended crossover of 400hz. The 511 on the other hand, has a recommended crossover of 500hz. So you loose quite a bit of mid bass when you move away from the k-400. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.4knee Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 In the LS type A, AA, AL the actual crossover point is more the acoustic cutoff of the horns rather than electrical. The same is true for the ALK. I thought I noticed a "hole" when I first switched to 511b but it turned out not to be the case. I use the ALK Universal so I opted to change my tap settings to knock down the sqawker a bit. Been happy ever since. Thats right....the k-400, according to the dope from hope article introducing it, has a lower range of 230hz with a recommended crossover of 400hz. The 511 on the other hand, has a recommended crossover of 500hz. So you loose quite a bit of mid bass when you move away from the k-400. The Belle Klipsch used the same networks with a 500 hz K500 horn, the LS Bass bin goes up over 500 Hz with ease. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6l6gc Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 My experience with Khorns and 511 and AA Cross, >>> It all started because I thought the k401 sounded honky like a resonant pipe at the low end, and harsh at the higher freq plus I wanted to experiment.>> I found out that when using the 511 k55 there was a slightly noticeable hole>> but this might be less of a problem on a LS>> This pushed me into going active in order to integrate the 511 more easily,>> it seemed to me that the k55 wasn't being loaded properly on the 511 at the lower freq, this was noticeable at higher spls.>> it turned out that with 18db slopes and going back to k401-k55, and crossing it ~380hz - 1200Hz to a Selenium D220, it became perfect,>> and that the k401+k55 is really really good at this setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 The Belle Klipsch used the same networks with a 500 hz K500 horn, the LS Bass bin goes up over 500 Hz with ease. This does not sound like a question...but I'll answer it anyway....the Belle and LaScala uses different types of bass bins. The belle's has a 3 sided dog house that has a gradual flair after the first turn. The LaScala has a 5 sided dog house, which has a 6" or so restricted straight section after the first turn, and as a result, the horn flair is not gradual, it's what we call fast. The straight section serves no postive audio purpose, it's just there so that the woofer will fit in the dog house, with out it, you could only get a 12" woofer in the lascala dog house. This straight section is the cause of the -10db dip at 500hz in this image. This straight section is not needed in the Belle since the Belle is wider that the LaScala and a 15" woofer fits very easy in the Belle dog house. So the Belle does not have the -10db dip at 500hz. In light of the -10db dip, and in light of the fact that the k-400 has a response range that begins at 230hz, it should be clear why a horn that begins at 500hz like the 511, leaves a lot to be desired in the mid bass area when compared to a k-400. Thank you for your question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted May 15, 2011 Author Share Posted May 15, 2011 following pictures of my xovers.don't look at "type AA" writing as i removed some parts os they should be type A now. https://sites.google.com/site/crocweb/Home/stereo/audio_pictures/P1010861.JPGhttps://sites.google.com/site/crocweb/Home/stereo/audio_pictures/P1010862.JPGhttps://sites.google.com/site/crocweb/Home/stereo/audio_pictures/P1010863.JPG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted May 15, 2011 Author Share Posted May 15, 2011 following pictures of my xovers.don't look at "type AA" writing as i removed some parts os they should be type A now. http://sites.google.com/site/crocweb/Home/stereo/audio_pictures/P1010861.JPGhttp://sites.google.com/site/crocweb/Home/stereo/audio_pictures/P1010862.JPGhttp://sites.google.com/site/crocweb/Home/stereo/audio_pictures/P1010863.JPG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted May 15, 2011 Author Share Posted May 15, 2011 following pictures of my xovers.don't look at "type AA" writing as i removed some parts os they should be type A now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted May 15, 2011 Author Share Posted May 15, 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 You probably need to look at the Altec spec sheet. If you cross the 511 lower than 500Hz, you may need to use a steeper filter (not a first order on the type A network). It can be hard on the driver and may give some distortion. I agree with Tom, and want to go further by saying you probally would like the type AB-2 network. Which I have attached. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 here's an altec A7 3-way just to illustrate the steeper slopes on the border of the 511 and the woofer. this particular xover will not work since the impedance's on your drivers and the altec drivers are different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted May 17, 2011 Author Share Posted May 17, 2011 it looks to me that 511 is too much incompatible with La Scala. i'm more and more leaning to getting Fastrac 2 horn which according to Dave is completely "plug and play"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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