mobile homeless Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Your far superior understanding of the soul of music? Whatever makes you feel good this morning, I'm all for it! It's such an absurd assumption, it doesnt even deserve a rejoinder. Obviously, you have been troubled by that quote of mine, and in hindsight, it was a bit over the top, although not as completely off the mark as your last retort. But it was uncalled for. I just assumed we had gotten past it. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clipped and Shorn Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 I knew you'd like that, being yourself the top salesman of absurd assumptions in the guise of undefinable terminology. Apology accepted. -C&S ------------------ Cornwalls currently upgrading to all tube components This message has been edited by Clipped and Shorn on 09-04-2002 at 11:50 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Ignorance is your partner in crime, although who is being robbed is up to debate. In addition, I have never seen one so in love with contradiction, sometimes within the same sentence, which takes a special skill. Your lack of understanding of the connotations and meaning of words is a shaky excuse for an argument, especially when you attempt to pin this very same lack of understanding to the ABCs of science. The Logical Positivists are coming to bring you into their fold, so they can bring a fellow traveler with sketchy use of logic but with all the heart and well meaning of a wandering puppy, looking for ownership. I am tickled at your sudden leap for the "soul" of music after your many posts citing the importance of certifiable proof in a scientific exercise to validate all things. Measure it and be done.... The soul will take awfully big calipers; or should we use a sound meter? Are you going to be caught like Woody Allen, Cheating on his Metaphysics Exam by looking into his classmates soul? I hope you get a 90 or above. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clipped and Shorn Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 You didn't perceive an important distinction I was making. My comprehension of the "soul" of music comes from being a natural and gifted musician and composer and takes place in my musical brain, not from experience with audio gear and picking apart the signal from the point of view of a high-end audio salesperson. When you talk about some audio gear possessing the "soul" of the music, that is something entirely different. If anything your obsession and attention to audiophilia distracts from comprehending the music on the level I am talking about IMO. -C&S ------------------ Cornwalls currently upgrading to all tube components Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Perhaps so, but as I have been playing instruments since the age of 12, having been in numerous bands from the age of 13 till my late 20s and then running an in-home recording studio through the 80s, fully loaded with instruments, I would think I have a handle on the music side of the spectrum, in appreciation and performance (add working in a college radio station as their Engineer and co-Music Director/Advisor). I play the drums, guitar, bass, and a bit of keyboards and make my own recordings. In addition, my father was a drummer in NYC for a jazz band in the late 30s-40s so we had music in the house all the time (on top of growing up in a house where my parents worked and/or taught in a major University so education/art/literature was a major focal point). He knew more about jazz than just about anyone I knew with a love of music that is second to none. I inherited about 2000 jazz LPs along with a huge collection of 78s (not to mention the recordings my father made over the 30 years into that). So music is FAR more than messing with audio equipment, my Clipped than Shorn friend. So, please dont claim the understanding of music as thy sole/soul domain. The audio equipment side of the spectrum is just a small part, and one I find interesting especially if it moves you closer to the music. See 90% of my posts on the matter for reference. The two dont have to be mutually exclusive of one another. Christ, I dont know how many times I have posted on this very subject, even within the same damn thread as the discussion of your Mall painting friend. Your close reading skills are second to many... kh ps-HL Mencken would be proud of this thread...besides the steady decline into the sub-human... How postively painful for those exposed, however; My apologies to all. This message has been edited by mobile homeless on 09-04-2002 at 01:47 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clipped and Shorn Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Interesting background information. Now, if you could only eliminate your need to always throw in insults along with your domineering "always have the last word"isms, we could possibly get back into a harmonious dialogue. You need to give respect in order to deserve it. -C&S ------------------ Cornwalls currently upgrading to all tube components This message has been edited by Clipped and Shorn on 09-04-2002 at 02:21 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Now that was some clever flaming guys Keep up the good work !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted September 4, 2002 Author Share Posted September 4, 2002 I wonder what it is about the nature of people that they argue with each other when they have similar interests. You would think that we would battle with people who don't like tubes, or who don't like Klipsch, rather than argue with someone else who likes tubes and likes Klipsch, just different models. Of course it's by no means limited to this board, or to audio. You know, it's like one Corvette collector saying his '67 blows away the other's '97, or whatever. Whereas it would seem more likely a Corvette collector would be arguing with someone who hated Chevys. Anyway, the confrontations are witty enough, so I sure as heck don't mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Mobley Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Yeah, that's the ticket: settle the packing order stuff and let's get back to the Eico trannies. Anybody got any? I hate to unwind a good one but I'm not having much luck finding a bad one. Somebody has to have one. Please purdy please? Can somebody with an HF-81 get the numbers off the trannies? I need help here, I've got a line on a corroded HF-81 but the guy is hard to get hold of and the thing still works so he's not giving it away. Are there numbers stamped into the covers? printed on the laminations? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 I cannot believe that, except for the faceplate, this entire amp can be made from new parts for a few hundred bucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BryanJ Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Why cannot you think that to be true? I'll give the auction a run for its............. Heck, what better way to learn how it works than to build it??? Museum or me???? Who knows!!! Bj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 There were basically two types of HF-81 transformers. The earlier units, I believe, have the "lip bells" that cover a portion of the laminations. I have one unit with these transformers. The numbers can be found on the bell-end on one side. My first EICO has the numbers: 32013 900 The later transformers have no lips on the bell housing and appear to be later models. I will get the numbers off them later. They do look very close to identical although I at first thought the actual laminations were thicker via the later, no lip model. Usually, thinner laminations are preferred. Upon closer examination, I believe they have the same thickness,but the way they are stacked makes them appear differently. In the rather unfortunate picture at the right, the laminations appear MUCH thicker. This is not actually my unit. Mine gives this appearance too, until you get very close and notice it is comprised of two which look like one from afar. I have some other pictures as well so going over them now. My latest guess is that these are just different runs of the same basic design. If interested, my first unit does sound better but I am not sure what the reasons are as several things are different about them so the transformer housing is not the only explanation. kh This message has been edited by mobile homeless on 09-04-2002 at 06:02 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Just a mention of the tubes with the EICO. Notice the EICO branded 12AU7 tubes in the generic white boxes which is what I supspect would have been the same for all the tubes in the kit. The original owner or next owner/s went to some trouble to replace missing originals with Mullard tubes for the other positions. I own an original unused quad of what normally would be the output tubes to match the EICO Made in Holland tubes in a kit like that. I will try to check manufactures codes on my EICO EL84 tubes. They are more than likey made by Amperex Holland or Phillips Holland. So for what it's worth, I don't think the Mullards were part of that original package. On the transformers; my HF-81 has the trannies with the lips. I'm willing to look for numbers if the numbers Mobile has provided don't help. Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Mobley Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 kelly, much thanks for the time and trouble to post that. That's helpful. I know somebody in the business, he thinks they can reverse engineer the things from a working sample without unwinding them. However, if presented with a non-working sample they may have to disassemble it. Apparently they can determine turns ratio, number of turns, other basic stuff easily, but there's a possibility that the things have interleaved primary and secondary windings, a high quality deal that provides better efficiency and whatnot that's apparently fairly unusual. Still no volunteers for a bum unit, huh? Asking around a little I find no-one with experience of bad Eico trannies, but several have mentioned issues with their Dynaco units. Hmpf. Apparently they're a premium item. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 I am thinking of calling Mike LaFevre of MagneQuest transformers to ask some specifics here. I dont know of hardly any EICO outputs that have gone bad. I know of quite a few that had used their outputs in high quality DIY projects. These transformers have leads for 4, 8, 16, and 32 ohms. The bottom end via this amp is REALLY surprising, this along with excellent extension in the highs. The transformers are major part of this although I think the dual 6CA4 rectifiers along with an ALL triode front end help. kh EDIT: Tom, just curious... how are you talking to that will do this? I still think that materials have something to do with it as well, even though others here disagree. Many things conspire to make output iron better than others. The Acrosound and Peerless are both better than a line share of the outputs. A number of factors come to play. This message has been edited by mobile homeless on 09-04-2002 at 07:31 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Mobley Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 the ones with the lips look nicer. Yes, jazman, any available info is more than I have now. Please do, at your convenience. Kelly, do you have contacts with historical info? Is there anybody around now that worked at Eico then? I'm a recognized expert on the GM Quadrajet carburetor, digging around on the net I was able to sort of accidentally dig up a guy who was one of the engineers on the dev team for the carb in the early Sixties. Guy is an absolute treasure trove of info, and he knew another guy who was a chassis engineer at GM during those years. This guy turned out to be a sort of bottomless well of car knowledge. Wouldn't it be cool to find somebody who worked at Eico? Anybody got any bright ideas? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted September 4, 2002 Author Share Posted September 4, 2002 A friend of mine worked there in the late 1960s, but all he did was pack orders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Mobley Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Do you know him well enough to ask him if he knows anybody? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 13 minutes left and those HF-14s are still only 152.50 !! How many people are going to bid ?? oops spoke to soon there over 200.00 LOL !!!! This message has been edited by NOS440 on 09-04-2002 at 09:21 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted September 4, 2002 Author Share Posted September 4, 2002 $307! on the HF-14 pair. You can never go by what an auction is at until the end, because this kind of stuff frequently doubles or triples in the last couple of minutes. Tom, I emailed my friend. He hasn't kept in touch with anyone--been way too long. He recalls the transformers being their strong point, but that they often went bad. But he is probably talking about those in later products, I would guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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